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Ukraine Invasion: Part 17

998 replies

MagicFox · 27/03/2022 07:23

A new place for us to convene, thread 17.

OP posts:
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33
RedToothBrush · 31/03/2022 17:24

news.yahoo.com/medicine-shortages-russian-army-searches-154921407.html
Medicine shortages and Russian army searches: life in occupied Kherson

jgw1 · 31/03/2022 17:39

@RedToothBrush

news.yahoo.com/medicine-shortages-russian-army-searches-154921407.html Medicine shortages and Russian army searches: life in occupied Kherson
I understand that is what is called a hearts and minds operation.
RedToothBrush · 31/03/2022 17:49

Carl Dinnen @carldinnen
NEW Defence Secretary @BWallaceMP says long range artillery and armoured vehicles (although not tanks) will be supplied to Ukraine as a result of today's donor conference.

He also says President Putin "is now a man in a cage that he built himself... Russia is a lesser rather then a greater country because of him."

Jimmy @JimmySecUK
To be clear this doesn't mean the UK will directly supply these weapons. The last donor conference included 25 nations as well as NATO. I'd guess artillery provided would be ex-Soviet stock still used by countries like Poland (e.g. 2S1 Gvozdika, BM-21 etc.).

This would make sense because the Ukrainians already know how to operate these vehicles and they can seamlessly integrate with their logistics - they already have the ordinance they fire, spare parts they need etc.

prettybird · 31/03/2022 17:55

The really sad bit of that article about Kherson was its closing lines:

Maria said she never expected such a large attack from Russia, where her father lives.

"My father is in Russia and tells me everything I say is fake."

She has stopped calling him.

Sad
MMBaranova · 31/03/2022 18:28

Medicine shortages and Russian army searches: life in occupied Kherson

I exchanged some messages with a relative in Kherson oblast again yesterday [not the city... further east]. What you posted RedTootBrush aligns with what she said. So many of us take the ease of walking into a pharmacy or getting a repeat prescription for granted. That has all just broken down for her family. She says she is afraid to look out of the window as Russian vehicles go past, including a mini convoy of armour. The Russians who are in and around the settlement include what she called a special unit who have gone house to house searching and checking. Someone she knows was apparently roughed up and taken away. The prices in the nearest store keep rising and what there is is basically bread and tins/jars of preserved food. This is a small linear settlement, very much between A and B, with the individual houses with a fence, yard/garden etc. like you see alongside images of destroyed vehicles in the media. They are staying in the cellar and on the ground floor and hardly venturing out. Normal activities are very much suspended. There is still Ukrainian network mobile phone reception.

RedToothBrush · 31/03/2022 18:40

Trent Telenko @trenttelenko
Here is something important the Ukrainians are doing & the Russian Army did not.

Road maintenance

Ukrainian interior lines of communications are getting functionally shorter because the local Ukrainian civilian government fixes the roads

This is "Home Field Advantage" in war

This is stuff I'd never even think of.

Ukraine Invasion: Part 17
Ukraine Invasion: Part 17
DuncinToffee · 31/03/2022 19:00

ABC News @ABC

Russian troops are giving control of the Chernobyl nuclear power plant back to Ukraine, according to a letter from Russia's nuclear power company, Rosatom

DuncinToffee · 31/03/2022 19:05

Kevin Rothrock @KevinRothrock

The Russian troops that retreated from the Chernobyl Nuclear Power Plant reportedly took Ukrainian POWs with them. These are the Ukrainian national guardsmen who were captured while protecting the power station.

TargusEasting · 31/03/2022 19:36

This is stuff I'd never even think of.

One you set the strategy, you then ask one vital question - "What could go wrong?"

You plan for what may go wrong.

Then you fill in the detail at each step "What could go wrong?"

The road repair vehicles could run out of fuel. So you have enough fuel and tarmac for the road workers. "What could go wrong?"

The fuel could get destroyed in bombing. So you make sure fuel is stored in lower quantity at a range of sites. "What could go wrong?"

The youngest road crew might get called to the front line. So you make sure the 60 year old recently retired road workers are on stand by to return to work. "What could go wrong?" ...etc...

You keep preparing until you have exhausted all possibilities. Upside down, turned inside out, back to front. Nothing ever goes 100% to plan, but the easier you can overcome set backs the better the odds of winning.

YorkshireLondonMiss · 31/03/2022 19:50

This might be a silly question but I’ve seen quite a lot on Twitter of people thinking troops are being withdrawn so that chemical/tactical nuclear weapons can be used. To me I feel like perhaps Russia don’t actually care about their troops that much but maybe I’m being stupid. Can anyone shed some logic on this? I’m not looking for reassurance I just don’t really understand the situation.

Ijsbear · 31/03/2022 19:53

I think it's more likely myself that the troops are withdrawing so they can be sent to the Donbas region so Putin can keep hold of that.

RedToothBrush · 31/03/2022 20:27

@YorkshireLondonMiss

This might be a silly question but I’ve seen quite a lot on Twitter of people thinking troops are being withdrawn so that chemical/tactical nuclear weapons can be used. To me I feel like perhaps Russia don’t actually care about their troops that much but maybe I’m being stupid. Can anyone shed some logic on this? I’m not looking for reassurance I just don’t really understand the situation.
I don't think this is the reason for the withdrawal at all.

On the ground there are still troops close enough to put pressure on Kyiv in practice too. Many are exhausted so it actually makes sense to rotate them out for a rest before regrouping and starting over.

The MOD and Pentagon are both saying relocation to the Donbas as Ijsbear points out. I think I'll listen to that before people getting worked up on twitter.

RedToothBrush · 31/03/2022 20:30

Indeed just seen this tweet quoting the Pentagon:

Paula Chertok @PaulaChertok
Pentagon on 40-mile convoy near Kyiv: I don't even know if it still exists. It never really accomplished its mission, never resupplied any value to Russian forces, never came to their aid. Ukrainians put a stop to that convoy pretty quickly. Gotta credit Ukrainians for dexterity.

RedToothBrush · 31/03/2022 20:37

Jasmin Mujanović @JasminMuj
Saying that Russia is "withdrawing" from Ukraine implies they're in control of the situation, i.e. they're choosing (how) to leave. The footage emerging tho clearly suggests this is a retreat - and a disorderly one at that - forced upon them by Ukraine's herculean defenders.

This is also true. They need to regroup.

jgw1 · 31/03/2022 20:41

@RedToothBrush

Jasmin Mujanović *@JasminMuj* Saying that Russia is "withdrawing" from Ukraine implies they're in control of the situation, i.e. they're choosing (how) to leave. The footage emerging tho clearly suggests this is a retreat - and a disorderly one at that - forced upon them by Ukraine's herculean defenders.

This is also true. They need to regroup.

The remaining question before this completely turns into a long running stalemate with all the destruction that will mean in those areas that are on the front line, is will the Russians break through Izyum and be able to come from behind the Ukrainians in the Donbas.
PerkingFaintly · 31/03/2022 20:48

Just watched a brief piece about the editor-in-chief of The Economist getting an interview with Zelensky.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-60525350

She reports that Zelensky spoke almost with disbelief as he described Putin "throwing Russian soldiers like logs into a train's furnace." He seemed shocked at the level of Putin's inhumanity.

RedToothBrush · 31/03/2022 20:59

Japan has put out a formal statement today saying it will call the Kuril Islands a part of Japan occupied by the Russian Federation, Kyodo.

Apparently over the last few decades its avoided phrasing it like this to avoid damaging relations with the Soviet Union / Russia.

PerkingFaintly · 31/03/2022 21:04

Woah! That's a significant shift.

Ijsbear · 31/03/2022 21:15

Russia's unexpected military low performance is having ripples ...

Wrongkindofovercoat · 31/03/2022 21:26

"My father is in Russia and tells me everything I say is fake."

Fake news ? I can't help feeling the West was used as a dummy run, and not just for destabilisation reasons.

Booklover3 · 31/03/2022 21:26

Go Japan

RedToothBrush · 31/03/2022 21:30

www.newstatesman.com/international-content/2022/03/with-russia-tied-down-in-ukraine-other-frozen-conflicts-are-thawing?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1648727707-3
With Russia tied down in Ukraine, other frozen conflicts are thawing

From the Caucasus to the western Pacific, Russia’s opponents are eyeing their chances of redressing the balance of power.

Just across the border lies the disputed region of Nagorno-Karabakh, formally inside Azerbaijan but held by Armenian separatists since the fall of the Soviet Union in the early 1990s, and run as a de facto part of Armenia. Two years ago, a brief but bloody conflict broke out, with Azerbaijan’s forces capturing swathes of territory in the breakaway province and evicting the ethnic Armenians who had lived there. Now, despite a Moscow-brokered ceasefire, there are fears the fighting could start up again.

and

Last weekend, one of those drones carried out a strike on an Armenian position, killing three servicemen and injuring several others. At the same time, Azerbaijani soldiers were accused of having rolled past Russian outposts to take a village in the demilitarised zone, sparking evacuations and fears that a return to full-scale hostilities could be on the cards. Yerevan has accused Moscow of doing nothing to stop the incursion, with the Armenian prime minister Nikol Pashinyan calling the Kremlin to “stress the need for Russian peacekeepers to return the Azerbaijanis to their starting positions”.

And

In theory, Moscow is obliged to protect Armenia, as a member of its Collective Security Treaty Organisation defence pact. But with the reputation of its armed forces shattered as a result of its botched offensive in Ukraine, it is looking like a less reliable partner with each passing day. Gegham Stepanyan, the human rights ombudsman for the self-proclaimed Republic of Artsakh – as Armenians refer to Nagorno-Karabakh – told the New Statesman that “a peacekeeping mission based only on Russia’s political influence is vulnerable”. According to him, “the Azerbaijani side is trying to question the reputation of the Russian peacekeepers and their mission.”

Putin’s woes, however, present an opportunity for another regional power looking to assert itself. The Turkish president Recep Tayyip Erdoğan has presented himself as a mediator between Moscow and Kyiv, with a series of peace talks being held in Istanbul and Antalya. However, simultaneously, he has openly provided Ukraine with the same advanced Bayraktar attack drones that Azerbaijan has used in Nagorno-Karabakh, helping them to take out vast numbers of Russian tanks and troop transports. Across eastern Europe and the Caucasus, Erdoğan is unpicking the webs of Russian influence that have held fast for more than a century and is moving in to fill the gaps.

And

In nearby Georgia, a series of videos have been shared widely online calling for an assault on Abkhazia, a region of the country occupied by Moscow-backed rebels since the country's war with Russia in 2008. Hundreds of Georgian fighters are believed to have gone to fight in Ukraine against Russia and, in one clip, armed volunteers near the front lines told those back home: “we urge you to take up arms and strike at the enemy. We will never have such a chance again.”

Ijsbear · 31/03/2022 21:33

On March 21, 2022 Russia announced its withdrawal from peace treaty talks with Japan and freeze of joint economic projects related to the disputed Kuril islands due to sanctions imposed by Japan over Ukraine.[68]

On March 25, Russia started a military drill with over 3,000 troops and hundreds of vehicles on the Kuril islands, including the disputed islands. [69]

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuril_Islands_dispute#21st-century_developments

RedToothBrush · 31/03/2022 21:35

James Cleverly @JamesCleverly 40s
United Kingdom government official
Good first meeting with Armenian Ambassador @VaruzhanN earlier today.

Useful discussions on the importance of a diplomatic solution on Nagorno-Karabakh and development of UK an Armenian future partnership opportunities as we celebrate 30 years of relations.

Oh won't you look at that. How 'coincidental'.

Wrongkindofovercoat · 31/03/2022 21:41

Russia is vast and has a lot of boundaries/borders, and they are very focused on just one area at present, do they actually have the resources to keep Russia in one piece if other areas seek to utilise that focus ?

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