“Getting ANY adult dog breed is strongly NOT recommended”

[tallulahtoo78]

From a dog expert interview on LBC discussing the utterly awful, tragic death of the 17 month old little girl.

@Catswhiskers13. Ahhhh they look really sweet together all three!

@Agrudge

But it is usually the same breeds. They need to be banned because they are the breeds the irresponsible owners go for, for their strength and aggressive look. Once out of control they can kill a child with ease.

This is akin to the American gun argument.

After the latest mass shooting it's always 'guns don't kill, bad gun owners do!' and everybody does nothing and waits till the next time while bleating about responsible gun ownership.

The fact is relying solely on the goodwill and commonsense of others doesn't seem to prevent more deaths.
And it won't here either.

The dog didn't belong to the child's parents. It belonged to the mothers parents. So they never actually bought the dog, it was the granny and grandad

*” I'd go as far as saying most breeds can do this sort of damage.”

but yet, they don’t, do they?! Small children are not being fatally attached by cavapoochons or malashipoos or whatever.

@NashvilleQueen

Any dog can potentially be aggressive to babies and young children. Its about the dog, not just the breed.

I agree. However it appears to be the case that far more deaths and serious injuries are caused by specific types of dogs. They're especially strong and need owners that know how to handle them. I mean you can get a bite from a golden retriever but I don't think I've ever heard of one going so savage that it mauls and kills a child.

@NashvilleQueen

Simply not true. Many breeds have killed kids unfortunately. From JRT to Labs to bull breeds.

Two-month-old Aiden McGrew was in a baby swing inside his Ridgeville, South Carolina, home when the family dog, Lucky, mauled him. The Golden Retriever/Labrador mix pulled Aiden from the swing and tore off the child's legs. Aiden's father was sleeping while the vicious attack took place, and the boy's mother found his body when she returned home. Aidan was rushed to the hospital where he was pronounced dead.

The potential to cause injury is inherent in all pets. Biting is common and well within the “reference range” of canine behavior, and any dog—including beloved family pets—can bite. In fact, in a recent study of dogs that had a history of biting children, the most frequently represented breeds were German shepherds, English springer spaniels, Labrador retrievers, golden retrievers, and American cocker spaniels, two-thirds of which had no history of biting.

Don't trust any dogs around children and your kids will be safe. Teach your kids not to go near strange dogs, teach them how to act around dogs and most importantly don't allow them alone with any dog.

The problem is people don't research the breeds and buy a suitable dog

Spaniels and labs are responsible for so many bites nowadays as they have gained popularity for a family pet but they are a working breed , highly intelligent and should not be sat about a home with a walk twice a day. These dogs need to work, and use their brains. Collies, spaniels etc need to work to be happy.

If you want a family dog buy a lap dog that has been bred to sit on laps all day like a pug.

@MiddleOfThePack

ANY dog can turn. We had 2 shelties pre-children, but we had both rehomed with an elderly lady, when one of them made a move on my then-2-year-old.

Is it morally acceptable to pass on a problem in this way?

[quote DysonSphere]@Catswhiskers13. Ahhhh they look really sweet together all three!

@Agrudge

But it is usually the same breeds. They need to be banned because they are the breeds the irresponsible owners go for, for their strength and aggressive look. Once out of control they can kill a child with ease.

This is akin to the American gun argument.

After the latest mass shooting it's always 'guns don't kill, bad gun owners do!' and everybody does nothing and waits till the next time while bleating about responsible gun ownership.

The fact is relying solely on the goodwill and commonsense of others doesn't seem to prevent more deaths.
And it won't here either.[/quote]
As mentioned before. They will just move on to another breed . And the cycle will continue.

More responsibilities need to be put on ownership along with tougher punishments

I don't understand how you could re-home your dog when you have a baby. I know my dog couldn't be trusted around a baby. But he is family. We would make it work.

@carefullycourageous

I'd say as long as you 100% upfront with all the information about why you are rehoming and the new owner knows all the risks I dont see why not.
Within reason of course

@DysonSphere

Also why is alway the majority alway have to have things taken off them because of the minority.

Using your example about guns. But in the uk

All the responsible gun owners had to give up there guns because of 1 incident. A terrible incident. But still the responsible owners were punished

[quote Agrudge]@carefullycourageous

I'd say as long as you 100% upfront with all the information about why you are rehoming and the new owner knows all the risks I dont see why not.
Within reason of course[/quote]
I do not think it is acceptable even if honest - there is a responsibility to wider society.

Things have gone rather awry with dogs now, the dogs being rehomed are inappropriate in many cases.

[quote Agrudge]@DysonSphere

Also why is alway the majority alway have to have things taken off them because of the minority.

Using your example about guns. But in the uk

All the responsible gun owners had to give up there guns because of 1 incident. A terrible incident. But still the responsible owners were punished[/quote]
The responsible owners were not 'punished', we as a society re-evaluated what we wanted in light of a new realisation.

Times change.

All the responsible gun owners had to give up there guns because of 1 incident. A terrible incident. But still the responsible owners were punished

Gun ownership is legal in the UK so all the responsible owners needed to do is satisfy the updated ownership requirements.

Most hand held guns were banned after the shooting

There were still other gun options for them to choose from.

@Nobodycarestakeitelsewhere

*It's only a insult if the shoe fits.

Maybe someone just likes the look of that type of dog.

I'd think the kennel club would be a good authority on the temperament of differant dog breeds*

Nope. Liking the look of a dog isn't a good enough reason to get one actually. If you liked the look of a severely bracycephalic pug, who couldn't breathe, would that be a good enough reason to breed them until their nose had all but disappeared and they couldn't breathe without plastic surgery? Or you like the sloping back that's been gradually bred into German shepherd, so you continue to breed them more extreme so the dog can barely walk and certainly couldn't do a days work? Or maybe you like the heavy set build of a bulldog so you breed it so stocky and shortlegged that it has to give birth by c section or die? Or perhaps a cute little cavalier, you like the look of its domed head so you breed it so that it's skull is malformed and it dies of syringomyelia?

All things that your beloved kennel club has championed, encouraged and rewarded over the last few decades through breed standards and judging. So while you might think they're the eminent authority on healthy dogs, i beg to differ.

There is some truth in what you say, though in fairness health testing is heavily encouraged now and many new tests have become available thanks at least in part to the KC investing large amounts of money in research. In some breeds testing is compulsory, though not in my breed, unfortunately. As to temperament, they are actually pretty hot on that. A dog which shows aggression at any KC event will lead to its owner being hauled up and fined. A repeat will lead to the dog being banned from all KC events and its progeny will not be registered. There are limits on the number of times a bitch can be bred (4) and an allowed age range (1-8). The single biggest problem for us who like to do things properly and are single breed enthusiasts is this; those who fall outwith the reach of the KC. They don't register their dogs, or if they do they use spurious registries which have no rules at all. They advertise heavily on Gumtree and Pets4Homes (urgh), they over breed, over charge and do not health test at all. They have no real knowledge of the breed and no care for the consequences of their greed and stupidity. Decades of work towards improving our breed - health and temperament- have been blown apart within the last few years by charlatans and thieves. It is incredibly depressing. I won't name the breed as they are quite scarce and I do not want to be outed. It's a breed that hasn't been mentioned on this thread (at least up to page 12 or so!) but they can be quite large, very muscular and strong and can be challenging in the wrong hands though not usually at all aggressive. Oddly they genuinely are pretty good with children, very patient and tend to remove themselves from the children's orbit when they've had enough. That being said I have never left a child alone with them in several decades because that would be bloody stupid. Nor do I ever allow a child to sit on them, poke them etc. They are never off lead away from home, mainly because they have lousy recall.

@Agrudge

Most hand held guns were banned after the shooting

A hand gun is to shoot a person.

Why would anyone need to do this? Do explain.

In the last 30 years the number of fatalities (all ages) related to dog attack/bite of all ages is 0-6 per year. In most years it's less than three, and many years go by with no recorded fatalities at all.

On average, once a week a child dies as a pedestrian struck by a vehicle in the UK. And of all ages, 5-6 people die a day as a result of road traffic accidents.

Is it the family pet angle or the rarity of this type of incident or just a complete lack of perspective that attracts 22 pages of argument when road deaths go largely unremarked? We're now equating owning a dogs with owning handguns FFS.

@DogInATent
It's not just about deaths though is it? It's about avoidable, preventable injury / permanent scarring / post traumatic stress etc. I just think there are too many dogs generally and a lot with owners who haven't got a clue / don't look after their dogs properly or don't have a plan should a situation change.

@echt

Target shooting, a completely legitimate hobby

@Mickarooni

*” I'd go as far as saying most breeds can do this sort of damage.”

but yet, they don’t, do they?! Small children are not being fatally attached by cavapoochons or malashipoos or whatever.

The incident I witnessed was by a cockapoo

[quote Agrudge]@Kennykenkencat

Staffies who were known as nanny dogs because how good they are with children.
That part seems to have been ignored

It's not ignored , is denied as "propaganda"[/quote]
By whom?

@2022HereWeCome - do you want the avoidable/preventable life-changing injury statistics for pedestrians struck by vehicles too? They're still worse on a daily basis than those for dogs on an annual basis.

I genuinely cannot understand how parents are happy to take such risks with their babies.

Because they are thick, or they don't love their children enough.......or both!

You'll hear loads of "oh my dog would never do that" but the truth is, they can't guarantee that and they're still happy to place their children in a situation with that risk.