“Getting ANY adult dog breed is strongly NOT recommended”

[tallulahtoo78]

From a dog expert interview on LBC discussing the utterly awful, tragic death of the 17 month old little girl.

My youngest dog is a Staffie XL Bully. In my opinion they are not a dog to own if you have young children. My youngest children are 17 and 18. Unfortunately they seem to attract the type of owner that they really don't need. You only have to look on TikTok to see the many posts from enthusiasts flaunting their dogs with cropped ears and spiked collars. These people will even go to great lengths to own a dog with cropped ears. It is illegal here but not in many other countries so the puppies are imported. They are fabulous dogs in the right hands and a potential nightmare in the wrong ones. My girl is an affectionate cuddlebug who loves people and other dogs but I would never leave her alone with a child.

@Agrudge yes, he knows our visitors from a pup and is fine with them. Covid affected this a lot as he is 4 so his socialisation was cut significantly but he remembers those that have been around since a pup. He also reads if we are relaxed etc when people knock on the door.

A problem I have is that some people expect him to be as friendly as our last dog with them and he simply isn't. He is cautious and watches until he is comfortable they aren't a threat. I've had one guest think he was cuddly and playing and I've had to tell him off saying the dog will become aggressive and snap if he carries on. Only then did he understand.

I've also had a cocky friend of a friend say he knows dogs etc. dog saw straight through him, gave a warning growl and pushed him over. Whilst I don't typically allow or approve of that behaviour, I am in full control and think about important point was made. I also got a laugh.

He is a problem dog and I would never trust him, anyone around him or rehome him. He is our problem dog.

He is incredibly good looking. He looks fluffy and smooshy which is also a problem for him. He tolerates my smooshing but can't stand strangers running up squealing.

@OopsaDayZ

I'll probably get slated but I also think ALL bull terrier's should be banned. And that includes the Staffordshire bull terrier that for some reason loads of people love.

They seem so popular, however, it's only particular types of people that seem to like them.

Have I got this straight, you want to ban Boston terriers? I'm falling over laughing.

My dgirl sadly now passed was a Staffordshire bull terrier/alsation cross breed and was the sweetest most gentlest girl you could ever meet. If we met on a walk a nervous puppy out on their first walk she would be gentle and playful and within minutes the puppy would know how exciting walks were and would be at ease.

Children she met who were scared of dogs she would stop and roll over on the pavement or sit down whilst they went passed. I hadn’t taught her that she seemed to pick it up as something to do to show she wasn’t to be afraid of.

The problem with Staffordshire Bull terriers is their physical likeness to a banned breed and the people who think owning a Staffie will make them look hard. And train them to be aggressive. That is down to humans and not the breed

The same dog treated with kindness and respect from being a puppy will be a kind and gentle dog.
All dogs will snap if they are suddenly awoken by a toddler falling over on them or sudden noises or being over stimulated but from a starting point the staffies I know are the most laid back.
I think it is Labrador’s that have the reputation for biting and I have witnessed a completely unprovoked dog attack by a cockapoo who suddenly saw a KCS 100 metres away and despite being on a lead charged at the little dog, pulling over the owner who lost grip of the lead. Everyone ran towards the small dog and we did manage to prize the shaken and bleeding KCS from the cockapoos teeth.

@Agrudge

As I said, once upon a time i was all ‘deed not breed’ but fact is, whenever there’s a fatality, nearly all of the time, it’s a pit bull/American Bully/American Bulldog/other bully breed or mix.

But it's never dogs from nice homes

Unfortunately every time this happens you just know what kind of family it’s happened in. You could almost make a tick list

Round my way these bull breeds are a fashion accessory. They're part of a look that includes tattoos and the right trainers. They're a masculine statement. In some cases, a replacement for the 'safety' of a knife
It's the norm to see one straining away at the collar while a couple of young teens are being half pulled along whilst they're also chatting on the phone

I think this encapsulates perfectly why it is an owner problem, not a breed problem.

@Kennykenkencatits been proven that treating a dog with kindness can not overrule genetics. Some dogs are genetically predisposed to aggression in exactly the same way some dogs are genetically more likely to bark, hunt, herd etc etc.

I’ve seen so many owners who have raised puppies perfectly and still have reactive or aggressive animals, not just bull breeds but across the board. You can’t say if you treat it well it will turn out great because it does not work like that. I had a friend who was badly attacked her her golden retriever of all breeds, it also almost killed her elderly collie. This dog had been loved and trained by a very experienced owner from day 1 and actually lived the life of riley on a farm. Once it was destroyed she delved a little deeper and found there was aggression in the lines all the way back to the grandam and many of the littermates had similar issues. You can’t say that that’s chance because all of those owners were bad?

It’s like people, they are born with a personality to an extent. You can shape it but you can’t change it.

@wetotter

Round my way these bull breeds are a fashion accessory. They're part of a look that includes tattoos and the right trainers. They're a masculine statement. In some cases, a replacement for the 'safety' of a knife It's the norm to see one straining away at the collar while a couple of young teens are being half pulled along whilst they're also chatting on the phone

I think this encapsulates perfectly why it is an owner problem, not a breed problem.

Finally, someone gets it

@MiniTheMinx - there's already someone up-thread wanting to ban French Bulldogs. There's a lot of anti-dog sentiment on this thread, that doesn't really care which breed they are as long as they're banned. And some very unrealistic opinion (banning sale/adoption of all adult dogs).

Anyway, must go. Getting the wet-nose-nudges and hand-lickies of wanna-go-walkies from the Staffy here.

The problem with Staffordshire Bull terriers is their physical likeness to a banned breed and the people who think owning a Staffie will make them look hard. And train them to be aggressive. That is down to humans and not the breed

This 100% I agree with.

@Agrudge yes. I have family all over and seems rules vary widely.

City A: Pit bulls, American bulldogs and presa canarios declared “vicious”

City B: Pit bulls and guarding breeds, including German shepherds and doberman pinschers, declared “vicious”

City C: Bans: pit bulls

Adult staffy rescue owner here (ticking all the boxes!) but I would say several I know are not good with other dogs. For one I know it is very likely because he was used for fighting before being abandoned, rescued and rehomed. He is fine with non-staffies but reactive to many bull breed dogs. But I think it’s also part of their history - my understanding was they were bred to fight dogs but also to allow humans to step in and separate them without causing injury, hence why they have a tendency to be very drawn to people, cuddly to the point of being needy and not big on allowing any kind of personal space, in my experience! Ours is the other way, excessively friendly but also pretty strong (she’s a cross so slightly larger than a breed standard staff) so if she decides to go barrelling along at 100 miles an hour and wants to jump around with another dog, she is far more likely to do them an injury even when there is no intent. And that’s why she is never off lead unless it’s a secure field with no dogs around.

Yep, just as I suspected, it's a staffy. Knew it. I do agree it's an owner problem though, not the dog's fault. People get these dogs to try and look 'hard' as a few posters have said.

It's always the same type of muscle dog, always sold & bought by the same type of moron, living the same type of shitty, feckless lifestyle. Always.

How many little children have been slaughtered by these types of muscle dogs in the last 25 years. Too many, far too many. Yet these morons still desire them. They still buy them. And they happily have them roaming around little children and babies.

I see from the news that the family are saying the toddler was much loved and will be much missed? They didn't love her nearly as damned much as they should have done.

They should be prosecuted for manslaughter.

@Kennykenkencat

My dgirl sadly now passed was a Staffordshire bull terrier/alsation cross breed and was the sweetest most gentlest girl you could ever meet. If we met on a walk a nervous puppy out on their first walk she would be gentle and playful and within minutes the puppy would know how exciting walks were and would be at ease.

Children she met who were scared of dogs she would stop and roll over on the pavement or sit down whilst they went passed. I hadn’t taught her that she seemed to pick it up as something to do to show she wasn’t to be afraid of.

The problem with Staffordshire Bull terriers is their physical likeness to a banned breed and the people who think owning a Staffie will make them look hard. And train them to be aggressive. That is down to humans and not the breed

The same dog treated with kindness and respect from being a puppy will be a kind and gentle dog.
All dogs will snap if they are suddenly awoken by a toddler falling over on them or sudden noises or being over stimulated but from a starting point the staffies I know are the most laid back.
I think it is Labrador’s that have the reputation for biting and I have witnessed a completely unprovoked dog attack by a cockapoo who suddenly saw a KCS 100 metres away and despite being on a lead charged at the little dog, pulling over the owner who lost grip of the lead. Everyone ran towards the small dog and we did manage to prize the shaken and bleeding KCS from the cockapoos teeth.

I've only spent any length of time with one staffy. Dh found him by the side of the road one day, clearly injured, so picked him up and brought him home (it was a Sunday morning, so couldn't take him direct to the vet), so we could contact the police and the SSPCA for advice.

He had no collar on and it looked as if he'd been hit by a car, but despite the fact that he must have been utterly terrified and in pain, he was entirely placid and calm whilst dh was putting him in the car and getting him back out again at home.

The story does have a happy ending - when we rang the police, they hadn't had any missing dog calls at that point, so took our details, and we handed the dog over to the SSPCA warden who came to the house, because we felt they were best placed to get him the veterinary care he needed. Shortly afterwards, the police got a call from the owners and the dog was reunited with them - but the dog had been so lovely that, if his owners hadn't been found, we were going to adopt him from the SSPCA. He was a complete gentleman.

@BurgerKingAddict

The problem with Staffordshire Bull terriers is their physical likeness to a banned breed and the people who think owning a Staffie will make them look hard. And train them to be aggressive. That is down to humans and not the breed

This 100% I agree with.

Anyone with any knowledge of bull breed dogs will not be mistaking a Staffie with a Pitbull.

If you look up a list of bull breeds you will find this includes Boxers and Boston terriers. Neither of which could be said to be dangerous. For the record I've had both, and staffies. I am far from being some sort of lower class yob trying to look 'ard' Sweeping generalisations about bull breeds and about the type of owners they have will not bring back that poor child.

Yes, there are irresponsible dog owners. Yes, there are irresponsible parents. And yes there are irresponsible drivers but we ban neither cars or parenting. It's a very unfortunate set of circumstances and it's relatively rare when you compare other forms of accident, incident, neglect, or harm. Put this way, there are fewer deaths caused by dogs than cars, there are far far fewer cases of neglect resulting in death by dangerous dog than cases of neglect of children in general.

If you look up a list of bull breeds you will find this includes Boxers and Boston terriers
Neither of which could be said to be dangerous
Boxers are big, strong dogs.
While they might have a reputation for friendliness generally a rogue one could kill a child very easily.

While they might have a reputation for friendliness generally a rogue one could kill a child very easily.

So we should ban a breed because there could be a rogue one?

@BeautifulGreenEyes

Yep, just as I suspected, it's a staffy. Knew it. I do agree it's an owner problem though, not the dog's fault. People get these dogs to try and look 'hard' as a few posters have said.

Have you got a link?

The most up to date one I can find (BBC 3 hours ago) is still saying that breed is being investigated - and including a comment from a neighbour who said it looked like some kind of bull type, but they didn't know what sort.

So we should ban a breed because there could be a rogue one?
I don’t believe in banning breeds myself really.
I think it makes them a lot more desirable for the wrong people.
I’d like to see a lot more severe punishments for people with out of control/dangerous dogs, a great deal more education about body language/safety.
But frankly, any dog medium sized and above is capable of killing a child, even very small dogs like chihuahuas can kill babies.
I think it’s wise with a big strong dog like a Boxer to at least be aware.

Just to say...I have a Cypriot rescue dog from a Cypriot charity with a Facebook page.

They were every bit as diligent about checking us as owners before placing a dog with us.

We had to have experience with dogs, no children under a certain age (we don't have any DC) and were able to foster for several weeks to make sure we were the right fit for the dog and vice versa.

We had to do a video tour of our home and garden.

We only went with an overseas rescue as we wanted certain types of dog and they needed to be cat-safe which is quite rare.

I also agree that new dogs should never be introduced to a household with children who can't read their body language and respond accordingly.

For some DC this might be 5-6, for some it might be more like 8+

Our dog went to a home with two DC for a few weeks before us and one of their DC was too young to respect her boundaries so she had growled and snapped in his direction.

She's a lovely dog with a heart of gold but very, very playful, resource guards bones/treats and isn't very good at understanding the boundary between what she is and isn't allowed to do when playing so gets quite physical sometimes (she has bitten my nose for example although she never draws blood).

The previous family did the right thing IMO to say she wasn't the right fit for them even though they were devastated about giving her up.

As an adult only home we can manage all her quirks but even as a lovely dog she could easily get into a situation where she feels scared and lashes out as she would do with another dog that scared or cornered her.

And it wouldn't be her fault but she would be PTS for it. She's not suitable to be left with children.

I would guess that it is nearly always the same type of dog, nearly always the same type of irresponsibility.

@HotnSunnyRainbowRoses

If you look up a list of bull breeds you will find this includes Boxers and Boston terriers Neither of which could be said to be dangerous Boxers are big, strong dogs. While they might have a reputation for friendliness generally a rogue one could kill a child very easily.

Should we ban Boxers? how about banning Pugs?

So much nonsense on this thread. Here’s a nice photo of my staffie cross and dd. You’re welcome.