Parents too involved in their children’s lives?

[Earbogeys]

Some of the posts on MN (and yes I am aware it’s not necessarily representative of real life) by parents talk about their children’s’ lives in such anxious, involved detail. I’m sure they have their reasons.

Not tiny children, where obviously this is entirely appropriate, but secondary school age, and sometimes older!

I’m quite prepared to be told that I just had a weird upbringing, but my parents didn’t know the ins and outs of every friendship, drama, argument, feeling or even get involved in my homework, exams or extracurriculars. I’m closer with my mum by a long way and she certainly knew who my friends were etc. or if there was a significant issue, but I can’t in a million years imagine her posting on a forum agonising about, for example, my social circle or (!) my university workload. I still did well at school and got a 2:1 in a science degree. I think the space to increasingly have your own life at the teen stage is healthy, and certainly beyond this age.

I’m not here to bash concerned parents, but I wonder if anyone else thinks similarly, even if from time to time? Again, I think my own parents could have been a bit more involved, and this post is probably driven a lot by my own feelings about it all. Also have to acknowledge that times change but still this surprise lingers when I read these posts.

I'm almost 50, so grew up in the 80s. My parents were oblivious to most things as it was normal to be out all day from around age 8, no one expected them to be involved in my education and they weren't friends with my friends parents.

All that has changed - I only realised children no longer played outside when I had my own. Having to host their friends and having my children at home all the time probably meant I was naturally more aware of any arguments going on than my parents were. That combined with the expectation now that parents will be involved with education and not just leave it to the school, also meant I knew if there were issues.

I also think people seem alot more competitive now - SM perhaps or the fact that we are generally wealthier than previous generations.

I have a better relationship with my teens than I did with my parents at that age. I therefore know more about their lives, but I work on the basis that I'm handing it all over to them now. I don't get involved unless they ask (never happened) or its really needed.

My parents were similar to those who said they were raised in the eighties which makes me think it is a generational thing. I wonder if my parents would comment on differences between how they were raised and how they raised their children?

There are a lot of things present now which didn't exist when I was little - social media must be a massive influence today.

Things like societal attitudes change too - smacking for one was acceptable when I was little and my mum would now say she can't believe she ever thought it was acceptable. Back in the day teachers caned children who had misbehaved (or even hadn't, but that is another thread).

I do think social media is a lot to blame for this overthinking and overinvolvement. Or perhaps this easy access to information and parenting forums has made us overthink.

re Universities. These days parents are asked to contribute more ££. I think that leads itself to more involvement Which is partly why many universities now have specific talks aimed at parents on open days.

I'm more involved than most parents I know. I don't want to be, but kids with SEN tends to lead you down that path.

I do feel that the London Indie / Grammar school stuff tends to lead parents to have to be more involved, and maybe that carries on?Whereas with a state comp system you can let nature take its course more.

Me and my mum are close. Always have been. I'm pretty sure, as a teen, I would have shared all my woes and the ins and outs of any friendship issues. Mind you, I would have had plenty of secrets too. I don't remember her interfering, but she did offer advice and support. I thought that was a normal and healthy parent/child relationship, and I try to replicate it with mine.

I think there is often a healthy balance in the middle.

Independence is important and it's also difficult for some parents to learn. Especially primary school seems to stiffle any ideas that a child can do things on their own and therefore enables parents to constantly be involved. DD's primary school head was very reluctant to let Y6 come and go on their own before Summer term. Well, he had to because the parents made a fuss. For every little thing parents had to come and do something, everything was sent by email instead of enabling the children to learn to be responsible for their stuff.

No wonder some parents can't let go. The same with clubs, drop off into the room, collecting at the door, I think one club planned to do so until they were 14 but again, parents complained. We were looked at as if we were utterly irresponsible by letting DD walk down a road to her gym class when she was 9 because it was impossible to park (guess why).

At secondary school we got involved in a friendship issue, but to teach DD how to deal with it, not to take over. It got nasty and thanks to phones and social media it blew up to a proportion unknown to most parents' generation. So, you need to teach your child to navigate through this.

We do know lots of names but as it seems to be uncool to bring friends from school home (despite DD knowing that our house is open) we only knew some faces when we met them at the shops etc. Other friends she has since nursery we know very well, also because we parents are friends.

School work - unless something happens DD is responsible and we don't check. We talk about exam schedule and revision time because it's something we do, not to take over but to ensure she knows we are interested in her life.

It feels to me that some parents see a danger in every situation, never trusting without knowing the exact ins and outs of everywhere their child is at any time. They deemed to young to be alone for a day/a couple of hours when they are teens. I do fear for these children, they are badly equipped to be teens/young adults. Parents often seem to forget their one vital role - teaching a child to be independent.

I’m on a uni Facebook group and there’s some serious over involvement on that!

I went away with a couple of friends and they face timed their uni DCs at least once a day. These were aged 19/20, and seemed happy enough at uni, no obvious issues.

I drove home really concerned that I hadn’t been in touch with my DD enough … a text or WhatsApp’s maybe every two/three days, maybe ring her every week or two. So I rang her and asked her “mum that sounds suffocating, I know where you and dad are if I need you”.

Each to their own .. I was close to my mum but I wouldn’t want her involved that much.

Oh god yes. I couldn’t believe the complete meltdown that happened when my younger sister (18 years younger than me) sent on a chain text message (one of those, if you don’t send this on to three more people you’ll be cursed) type things at the age of 12.
It resulted in the friendship groups’ parents phoning each other either in tears apologising or screaming down the phone furiously.

It was absolutely no different to the chain letters we used to get sent but for some reason the sky had fallen in.

Something I think is very different now with parenting is that when I was at school, if I or my friends were told off by a teacher, we wouldn't think to involve our parents. Now you'll have people queueing up to tell you the teacher was bullying or harassing your child and you must tell the governors/Head about it and start a vendetta against the teacher.

I agree with @UnicornsReal the modem world is much more complicated then the one before. Life is less predictable and straightforward.
Come back to us when you’ve got DC. You might be a lucky one for whom things are ok and on average but you might be in a different situation. In my experience parents rarely want to be over involved they just have to because there are problems. But not all problems are easily visible from the outside.

I agree OP and am surprised by some of the hostile responses on the thread.

The Higher Education board on here is a great example of over-involved parenting. Parents simply don’t need to be so involved in their student children to sustain long-running threads talking about the minutiae of their ADULT children’s lives at university - the essays, the seminars, the housemates - it’s crazy.

@greenlynx

I agree with *@UnicornsReal* the modem world is much more complicated then the one before. Life is less predictable and straightforward. Come back to us when you’ve got DC. You might be a lucky one for whom things are ok and on average but you might be in a different situation. In my experience parents rarely want to be over involved they just have to because there are problems. But not all problems are easily visible from the outside.

Exactly

There's a strong politcal culture in education to involve parents as stakeholders, and with good results needed for the political survival of schools, getting on to courses and ultimately into any half-decent stable job, it's a game that parents need to play to some extent.

Then technology keeps parents and older children with constant avaliability. No more weekly ringing home from the halls pay phone and getting a call back. (I did have a mobile in '99 but it was too expensive to make more than perfunctory calls)
There's the double-edged sword of with older primary/ secondary children, that technology removes boundaries on things like friendship issues. Problems don't stay contained in their setting. Inappropriate content can spread like wildfire. More problems are caused than solved.

Transport is harder. Fewer reliable bus routes, roads busy for cycling, the rise of out-of-town destinations, large school catchments.

In my area, it feels like your children aren't old enough to play out until they are too old to play and it's difficult to be the first one to break that bubble of safety. Another factor is that many of their peers don't have much avaliability due to childcare and organised activities.

By and large, we've swapped one set of problems for another.

One of my best lessons at school was flunking my first piece of GCSE coursework. It taught me a huge amount about time/ project management, far more than being micromanaged ever would.

I've got a DS approaching the y6/7 transition. We've got the added complication of ASD so working out an appropriate level of independence and his comfort zone is a minefield. I can't just say "there's the bus stop, crack on" nor would playing safe at ferrying him door to door do him any favours, and it will take time and patience to guide him through that change.

I find Scouting great as a benchmark of developing skills and independence. I had a very protective parent and DoE was great for me. Being able to navigate my way around the countryside in a group meant that travelling around by public transport seemed a doddle.

Because kids grow up in a pressure keg where they are kept indoors, mistakes live on social media for ever more, and there are vanishingly few routes to financial stability. Exams matter, getting a degree matters and costs £50k, houses are unaffordable. Letting kids do what they want and mess up has way more consequences now than it used to.

Personally I think as a society we need a reckoning where we balance the negative impact of keeping kids cooped up and wrapped in cotton wool versus letting them go out, play in the street, make mistakes, take responsibility for themselves etc. There would be incidents of stranger danger etc but I'm not sure keeping kids locked up the whole time is a price worth paying to avoid that.

I agree OP, the higher education board is a classic example Russel Group bla bla bla, STEM etc etc etc. And if your child doesn't achieve these things they're doomed to a life of failure.

It makes me a bit sad for my DD, she's a grafter but she's not "academic", likely to get 6s mostly at GCSE, re a level again she's not going to be one of your A* types. And there's no way she'll be going to "Russell Group". Is she therefore condemned to a life of mediocrity? You'd certainly think so judging by a lot of the posts on here...

Any niche board is going to be self selecting.
Go on the dog board and you'd probably end up thinking that 'everyone' owns dogs.
Go on Relationships and be amazed that anyone ever finds a long term partner that doesn't eventually go bad.
Go on Education, and surprise surprise you find parents there who are more informed & involved than the average.

I think technology has changed things a lot - parents often don't have an option not to be involved.

I was at school in the 80s - my parents came to parent's evening once a year and that was it. If I didn't take letters home ,they knew nothing about other things.

These days I am bombarded with emails from school. I am contacted if my child is late, has a detention, did well in a piece of work, school reports, exam results, online booking for parents evenings etc. I had to sign forms to confirm that we had discussed and agreed GSCE choices and A level choices. Meetings to choose options, meetings explaining the uni application process. We even have a website to tell us what homework is set. Even at primary school we had a meeting every year to be told about the curriculum for the coming year, and meetings to help us help our child with maths and English.

It's hard not to be involved.

And my DC seem happy to talk to me about there lives in a way I wouldn't have dreamed of with my parents. I love that, and am not going to try and put them off!

Also, as an employer of students and young people, the effect of this over parenting is really clear. So many are completely unable to cope with the working world.
It’s sad. Their parents are hindering them in the long term.

Totally agree with you, OP.

I've been thinking about this a bit more. In the last few days I've heard/seen the following from various friends with adult children 18-21+

• Ringing her DCs driving instructor to ask how he is getting on
• Doing a personal statement for her DD - actually doing it, not just helping
• Emailing a local council regarding a parking fine
• Ringing uni halls to complain about a damp patch in their bedroom, and being very annoyed that they weren't willing to discuss it with mum.

It's baffling! It's lovely to be supportive and 'there for them' obviously. I'd drop everything if my DDs seriously needed me, but come on!

@TeenPlusCat

re Universities. These days parents are asked to contribute more ££. I think that leads itself to more involvement Which is partly why many universities now have specific talks aimed at parents on open days.

I'm more involved than most parents I know. I don't want to be, but kids with SEN tends to lead you down that path.

I do feel that the London Indie / Grammar school stuff tends to lead parents to have to be more involved, and maybe that carries on?Whereas with a state comp system you can let nature take its course more.

Agreeing with TeenPlusCat's posts.

For parents who use independent schools, they are the consumer and paying customer. They generally expect to be involved by the school. Grammar school needs tutors and sharp elbows to negotiate at an age (11+) very few kids have the drive to propel themselves on their own steam.

That attitude does bleed over into university selection. The independent schools have careers advice teams that recruit from ranks of parents to give talks to the 6th formers. It is the culture for parents to be involved in that environment because the stakes are higher.

That is why studies show that state school children can do better at navigating university. But that is not a reason to NOT get involved just because benign neglect is the way to train independence. I did not learn to swim by being thrown into the deep end.

Some children just need more support along the way. As a parent, my job is to let the stronger ones go and support the weaker ones until they can come into their own. A parent makes that assessment of their child. I have no doubt that some parents are over-involved even by my standards. But there could be reasons behind it that are not obvious. I am only glad to be able to be there for my dc.

I agree OP. I am routinely amazed by the level of concern parents on here show for the most normal or mundane ‘problems’ in their teenager’s lives. How to ‘support’ them through a totally normal minor friendship spat or failed exam.

But my parents were also completely disinterested in my life, couldn’t have told you who my friends were, what subjects I was doing etc. So probably a bit of that as well.

I’m also to see parents posting in the local Facebook group asking for jobs for their adult children.

last summer when hiking I was earwigging on the conversation of a couple of middle-aged women behind me. one was telling the other all about her son's brilliant new job, then dropped the bombshell "Of course, I wrote the application for him. He'd never be organised enough to that himself!". There's a mumsnetter, I thought, and wondered how long it would be before Jonty was in trouble with his boss for being insufficiently organised to get the quarterly reports in on time.

I completely agree op. My parents never got involved in anything like that when I was a child.
My dsd is 20 and her mum does absolutely everything for her and knows every single detail of her life. Dsd doesn't know how to do anything for herself or how to be an adult. It's bizarre.