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Star Hobson verdict in

754 replies

Lougle · 14/12/2021 11:08

Savannah Brockhill Guilty of murder. Frankie Smith Guilty of causing or allowing death.

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6
FanGirlX · 16/12/2021 20:02

So what has actually changed since lessons learned after the death of Peter Connolly in 2007?

Malibuismysecrethome · 16/12/2021 20:27

I hope the Attorney General reviews the case and give FS a much higher sentence, in keeping with her participation in the murder of Star.

AnotherOneWithNoGoodName · 16/12/2021 20:45

@FanGirlX

So what has actually changed since lessons learned after the death of Peter Connolly in 2007?
Absolutely nothing, same as with Victoria Climbié in 2000 before that, and all the other poor wee souls before, after and yet to be come.

To a certain extent, you can't save every child, but when other people have raised concerns and social services are aware of them, it's just another layer of horror really.

Itsnotover · 16/12/2021 20:53

@Malibuismysecrethome

I hope the Attorney General reviews the case and give FS a much higher sentence, in keeping with her participation in the murder of Star.

But there was literally zero evidence that FS participated in the murder. She failed to protect Star, and gave SB unsupervised access to her knowing that she had likely harmed Star.

All the evidence points to FS being out of the room. In the 999 call, SB says 'so I called mum into the room'.

You can't just jail someone for a longer time because you're angry that they failed as a parent, it's not what the law supports.

Malibuismysecrethome · 16/12/2021 21:00

Itsnotover I would jail her for being complicit in the murder and abuse of her daughter. She could have got help or removed Star. She is equally guilty and knew what was going on.

EmergencyPoncho · 16/12/2021 21:16

Did SFB laugh at the sentencing, or was she not laughing at a technical issue just before? Someone wasn't able to turn off their mic and she laughed at that. If she laughed at the sentencing, she's even more hateful.

KittenKong · 16/12/2021 21:20

News reports she laughed at sentencing and was doing heart hand signals to the gallery. Maybe she just doesn’t know what the hell is going on?

FanGirlX · 16/12/2021 21:21

To a certain extent, you can't save every child, but when other people have raised concerns and social services are aware of them, it's just another layer of horror really.

I can't get over the 5 referrals and the photo of Star's bruised face. Social Services needs root and branch reform. Surely they have the power to have taken her away for a respite stay with foster parents or family while they investigated further. It seems to me like they aren't putting the welfare of the children first.

EmergencyPoncho · 16/12/2021 21:23

Please God do not think I am defending that hateful bitch, but I think it was before, the trial notes don't mention a reaction when the actual sentence was passed. I looked on purpose as she'd laughed a little beforehand. At the tech issue. May every day of her sentence bring her misery and suffering.

FanGirlX · 16/12/2021 21:26

Star's death has really affected me because she was the double of my niece when she was the same age. My niece is a happy, thriving, well looked after, beautiful 6 year old now.

I'm not even going to say that Star never stood a chance because she would have stood a chance if the authorities, the professionals, had done their jobs. Like Arthur, she had family who would have given her a happy and safe home but were actually prevented from doing so.

Imdreamingofapeacefulxmas · 16/12/2021 21:54

They seemed to focus on the bruising which was horrific (sw) but nothing on why they didn't seek to medical help for the bruising??
Why didn't they ask that? And pursue that..

I hate hate hate the way Brockhill says star is also her little girl and she's raising her.

FanGirlX · 16/12/2021 23:16

They seemed to focus on the bruising which was horrific (sw) but nothing on why they didn't seek to medical help for the bruising??Why didn't they ask that? And pursue that..

Because they couldn't be arsed? Or because they were putting the sensitivities of the mother and her girlfriend above the safety of Star.

ColinRobinson · 17/12/2021 00:45

@FanGirlX

To a certain extent, you can't save every child, but when other people have raised concerns and social services are aware of them, it's just another layer of horror really.

I can't get over the 5 referrals and the photo of Star's bruised face. Social Services needs root and branch reform. Surely they have the power to have taken her away for a respite stay with foster parents or family while they investigated further. It seems to me like they aren't putting the welfare of the children first.

No, they wouldn’t have had that power. They asked a paediatrician to look at the bruising to give a view on whether what FS/SB were saying about the bruising was likely to be true. The paediatrician decided there wasn’t evidence of non-accidental injury. Therefore the social workers would not have had grounds or evidence to apply to the court for a care order. Had the paediatrician formed the view that the bruising may have been caused by one of the adults, the response would have been different.

Clearly there was some investigations done by social workers, we will see when the serious case review comes out at what point things went wrong, but they wouldn’t have had the power to remove Star as things stood, sadly. There is a legal threshold that needs to be met and evidenced.

I agree that it can be daunting and scary to visit families where you know someone is violent and will hate you and may be violent towards you - I’ve had death threats, I’ve visited homes where I’ve sat down to see a strategically placed hunting knife just in view, I’ve been intimidated and threatened regularly. I have walked into homes where police officers wouldn’t go unless they were in pairs. But I always tried to keep the thought in my head - if I’m scared, how must it feel to be a child here? However I think there needs to be more robust protection for social workers, joint visits etc. no resources to do that though.

As for saying social workers are scared so instead pick easy targets who don’t need intervention - completely wrong, we don’t have time to spend on visiting people who don’t need help!

And as for saying it’s not a money issue because social workers get paid - we do, but how many of us are there? They need to invest in more social workers, better conditions to keep experienced people in the job, more resources to support us in doing work with families and helping families at earlier stages. Sure you can pay three social workers, but if each of them has 35 children on their caseload that they’re supposed to visit weekly, it doesn’t take long to fall down when you’re actively having to choose who to let down and who of that 35 is at least risk of dying, because you can’t do it all.

AnotherOneWithNoGoodName · 17/12/2021 01:39

@ColinRobinson, it must be an exhausting and usually thankless job. Thanks to you and you colleagues for doing your best in a broken system.

SammyScrounge · 17/12/2021 01:44

@KittenKong

And FS father committed suicide on the back of this, so the family is just smashed now.
Yes.He said he was going to look after Star. Tragic.So she is also responsible for her father's death.
SammyScrounge · 17/12/2021 01:50

@Malibuismysecrethome

Itsnotover I would jail her for being complicit in the murder and abuse of her daughter. She could have got help or removed Star. She is equally guilty and knew what was going on.
The pair of them couldn't be bothered with Star, except to use her in a sadistic power game. But there were people in the family who loved heer and would care for gher. Why not just hand Star over to them?
LondonWolf · 17/12/2021 03:14

Yes.He said he was going to look after Star. Tragic.So she is also responsible for her father's death

The father she learned how to wake her child up by bellowing at her from? Maybe he couldn’t stand the guilt of having been a shit, uninvolved parent himself?

Malibuismysecrethome · 17/12/2021 03:58

I really don’t understand why no politician has mentioned the cases of Arthur and Star. I know Boris said something apparently but really there is no horror expressed by the Government.
I think Child Protection should be investigated as they are making some seriously bad calls regarding abused children and then letting the people with ultimate responsibility resign just prior to major court cases.

Re SW’s visiting known violent homes they can arrange for police to accompany them and request this. Ffs even a bailiff has the right to get police to attend. They just can’t be bothered.

Badnightguaranteed · 17/12/2021 06:18

Yes @LondonWolf.

YourenutsmiLord · 17/12/2021 06:29

I really don’t understand why no politician has mentioned the cases of Arthur and Star. I know Boris said something apparently but really there is no horror expressed by the Government.
I think Child Protection should be investigated as they are making some seriously bad calls regarding abused children and then letting the people with ultimate responsibility resign just prior to major court cases
1 to 2 children die per week at the hands of their parents.
One of the probems imv is the screaming headlines for 'dealing' with bad social workers. They are juggling balls, parents have rights, people are malicious and social workers have huge caseloads.
On top of that they've to walk a tightrope of political correctness - an accusation of racism or homophobia and you most likely lose your job - same for police I would think. We have crazy demands and expectations then bleat when things fail.
Boris said they'd look into why things went wrong.

TreesoftheField · 17/12/2021 06:40

What's changed since Baby P? 11 years of Tory government slashing funding for health visitors, Sure Start and child protection.

I have a caseload of 13 young people who are all motivated and capable and lovely to work with and I'm still stressed. How is a child protection social worker supposed to effectively function with 30+ children to protect, in much more chaotic and dangerous situations, and double the paperwork? Plus a lack of safe Foster placements and children's homes to put the children. If we're serious about stopping these cases, we're going to have to invest massively in preventative services as well as social services.

(I'm not a social worker, I wouldn't last 5 minutes in that job)

Malibuismysecrethome · 17/12/2021 08:12

Yes but in Arthur and Star’s case there were people who loved and cared for them who were reporting and asking for help and making their concerns known. Surely you can see that or are you trained to ignore family members concerns.

ColinRobinson · 17/12/2021 09:08

@Malibuismysecrethome

I really don’t understand why no politician has mentioned the cases of Arthur and Star. I know Boris said something apparently but really there is no horror expressed by the Government. I think Child Protection should be investigated as they are making some seriously bad calls regarding abused children and then letting the people with ultimate responsibility resign just prior to major court cases. Re SW’s visiting known violent homes they can arrange for police to accompany them and request this. Ffs even a bailiff has the right to get police to attend. They just can’t be bothered.
Can’t be bothered indeed.

Try working as a social worker and trying to get police to routinely accompany you. Too many people have no idea of the reality. I think in four years I managed to get police to attend with me perhaps three times. It’s usually “no officers available” or a promise to send someone who never actually turns up. Plus we are going into these homes weekly, every single day there are visits, you think a police officer would do nothing but follow a social worker around like a personal bodyguard?

I also don’t think people realise how common it is to receive numerous referrals about a child, and clearly the concerns weren’t ignored as social workers were visiting, there was a paediatric medical arranged etc. perhaps if they’d had more time they would’ve been able to look closer but when you have 35 children all of whom could be the next Arthur or Star, you’re supposed to visit them at least weekly, and you don’t have enough time to see them all so have to make a judgement call on which child is least likely to be harmed if you don’t visit, it’s bloody hard to be as thorough as you know you should be. Plus there’s the limitations on what you can legally do, and the level of evidence required to escalate things particularly to court.

sixpencenonethepoorer · 17/12/2021 09:37

Absolutely. Massive caseloads of tragic cases.

We need to educate on how to raise a child - why isn't it up there as a core subject alongside (or instead of!) English and maths?! And i said that as an educator of 25 years. It's possibly the most important lesson to learn.

Why are 'academic' subjects still seen as the most important in our society. Many kids have terrible role models as parents, and go on to parent their own children the same appalling way. As we have seen this week!

vickyp0llard · 17/12/2021 09:59

@sixpencenonethepoorer

Absolutely. Massive caseloads of tragic cases.

We need to educate on how to raise a child - why isn't it up there as a core subject alongside (or instead of!) English and maths?! And i said that as an educator of 25 years. It's possibly the most important lesson to learn.

Why are 'academic' subjects still seen as the most important in our society. Many kids have terrible role models as parents, and go on to parent their own children the same appalling way. As we have seen this week!

Because not everyone wants children? I agree there should be a lot of free parenting evening classes. Seems like there's a lot of classes on how to give birth, but not much for the 18 years after!
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