Could I really hand Xmas over to him?

[Heruka]

DH and I have just had a massive argument . Long story but we just had a Xmas weekend with my side of the family. Massive amounts of work for me planning, preparing and cooking it all. DH is a grafter and definitely pulls his weight in family life, but can’t cook to save himself.

He totally doesn’t grasp the mental as well as practical load of it all, and got so upset about me yet holy telling him an hour before everyone arriving that I didn’t have time to listen to some chat he was trying to make. Not the best behaviour from me of course, but I was stressed out my head and I think most people struggle a bit when cooking for loads of people. He barely spoke to me all weekend and I felt he totally did not have my back.

Tonight I apologised for being short but said I thought he had apologies to make as well. Lots of talking later, he ended up saying (what I knew he thought all along) that I had gotten worked up about ‘fuck all’. I am so upset.

So for Xmas, we have one of his siblings and family staying for 3 nights, and the whole lot (17 including us) for Boxing Day. I so want to say that I am not doing it and turn the food and planning over to him. He would likely buy pizza and a few ready made things, the food standard would be considerably lower than if I did it. Yet the world would not end. Should I? Could I? I feel strangely liberated even considering the possibility as it all feels so stressful, but doing it as a ‘fuck you’ feels like it could backfire and I may just be mortified.

@thelegohooverer

I wouldn’t and this is why.

It won’t matter if he runs out of food or orders pizza - no one will judge him (the way you’d be judged and will be judged for this). If the house isn’t cleaned no one will judge him. In fact what will happen is that everyone will think he is marvellous and a hero for whatever half assed mess he manages.

As I see it you have two problems - the entrenched patriarchy that puts higher standards on women. We don’t do this to ourselves. You can choose to not perform, but you can’t opt out of the judgement, but you can try not to care.

Your second problem is you have a dh with no empathy. And leaving him to order a pizza will not make him grow empathy. It’s likely to do the opposite.

So I would do one of two things - either massively reduce your workload and just ring for pizza on Boxing Day and be done with it, or

I’d make a mahoosive list of everything that needs doing and pin it to the kitchen wall. Tell him to put his initials against any job he does and you initial what you do. I started doing this years ago (with the dc too). It is much harder to ignore reality when it’s in black and white in front of your nose.

Totally agree. Have to get kids up but will come back

YABVU to want everyone else's Christmas's together to be cancelled, just because you and your DH can't agree who does what.

We're meant to be having 12 all together and I could cry about the possibility it won't happen. FWIW we buy everything ready made and prioritise portion size and hotness over presentation. DH also doesn't know that I'm planning to serve his family oven ready pizzas and buffet food on Christmas Eve as it's less hassle.

I don’t know if this will help but I literally had this conversation with my therapist today so it’s fresh in my mind.

My husband loves food and likes cooking. He thinks about meals all the time. What do we want, what should we make etc etc. he doesn’t want to meal plan and likes spontaneity.

I have little interest in food but like the experience of eating out. I cannot stand thinking about what to eat each night after work and would rather bulk cook on the weekend.

He cooks 80% of our meals and we eat out or get takeaway maybe twice a week (was more like 6-8 pre covid).

I often feel guilty but also am genuinely happy having toast or cereal for dinner. When I was single I would often eat out at lunch with work then have a snack for dinner. No breakfast. He wants cooked food for lunch and dinner every day.

It’s so hard to find a happy medium. My therapist told me to agree with him what the “good enough” was and anything over and above that has to be done by the person who wants it without expectation the other will make up for it elsewhere.

So if I want to go out, I organise, book and pay for it. If he wants a specific meal at home he plans and cooks it.

Yes do it if.. He is sensitive enough to read the faces of people being served pizza!
Some people don't notice do they when others are upset if the clues are small.

But op, definitely step back and let him do it he really won't know until you do.

Loads of our local takeaways and pubs actually don’t serve food or close Boxing Day. We’ve tried Boxing Day pub walks in the past and ended up raiding the freezer ravenous at late afternoon when we finally got home as the pub we walked several miles to was closed as they’d run out of food.

I do see where you're coming from OP but I also think you're being a martyr and I think lots of us women are guilty of this...... wanting things to be absolutely perfect, taking on too much and then getting stressed out.

I have a similar DH in that he does loads around the house.....he does more laundry and cleaning than I do but he can't cook to save his life. After one really stressful year when I cooked for his family on boxing day.... about 15 people and was a frazzled, sweaty, grumpy mess by the end of it I thought enough. We now do a buffet, most of it shop bought e.g. salami, nice bread, butter, cheese, crisps, pate, salad, smoked salmon, nice quiches etc etc and a few bits of shop bought party food that I bung in the oven. Mince pies, lebkuchen, stollen bites and a nice box of chocolates for afterwards. Yes, it would probably be nicer if I made it myself but life is nicer as there's less stress and everyone is fed and happy. The environment is nicer and no arguments as DH just helps with putting it all out on the table. Job done.

Is it worth all this arguing over? He was wrong to say you were stressed over fuck all but maybe he wonders why you do this to yourself if you do get this stressed. It's not enjoyable for anybody!

If Christmas preparations are just ‘fuck all’, I’m sure he more than capable of sorting it out himself.

Surely Boxing Day is just cold meat/salads etc, maybe some bubble?

Do not help him out by planning meals and writing out a long list as suggested by a PP !

Why is it your job to instruct a grown adult like that ? Answer: it’s not.

Oh, stop it everyone. You're really all telling Op to have 17 people round to her house and involve them in this scrap?? You're all on the edge of your seats, wiling him to fail. Either cancel the party (you can think of an excuse) or seriously pare back your elaborate plans. 'DH, whether you accept it or not, catering on that scale is just too stressful for me. what shall we do? Are you ok with lasagna, shall we order in, or do you want to cook?'

I think whatever you do, it has to be because it is a happy solution for you, and not as a stunt to try and prove a point or a passive aggressive argument.

For one thing, that is no way to treat guests. Relaxed, welcome, happy to see them, DH turn to cater, all happy is fine.

Using them as the guinea pigs to enjoy seeing DH learn his lesson, or feel upset because they have pizza when you invited them for something different: not fine.

Your DH will order pizza, and from this time onwards, every time you get a bit stressed catering, you will have a dominos leaflet thrust under your nose.

The way to sort this is with communication, compromise, understanding and more communication. Not pulling stunts and ultimatums.

Exactly @TheresACrackInEverything

@MatildaIThink

I have to ask, how are you catering for these people if it creates "mental as well as practical load of it all? Surely cooking is not that stressful?

Yes also hand over some or all of the cooking to him, it is not that difficult, as an adult he should already be able to cook,mor at the very least follow a recipe.

FFS are you my husband?!!

Thank you all so much, there are so many helpful comments and I want to reply individually to you all. Thank you to the pp who took the time to write a big list, in trying to help me - that’s very sweet and thoughtful.

I agree with those saying that if I hand it to him then I do. No ‘not letting him do take away’ - it would be his gig so up to him. Also I would help with all the other bits like he does. He does most of the dishes and tidying in our house, I do cooking and laundry.

It is more about empathy and me feeling hurt he isn’t emotionally supportive, as well as me feeling stressed. When he goes away I notice how many dishes I have to do, and feel grateful to him! I think he’s never had that experience as when I am away it’s all oven stuff and v basic meals.

He also does not know what it is like to be a woman and be socialised all your life to take care of other peoples feelings and needs. This is a particular pressure on me - my mother is an example of a woman who doesn’t even know what her own needs are, she is so guided by needing other people to be ok. As an adult I am trying to unlearn all these habits, and this experience has already taught me that I do not have the capacity to host like this without getting stressed - won’t do it again.

I agree with pp who said even if he organises pizza etc and it’s fine, it will not teach him to appreciate what I want him to appreciate. Also agree with pp who said it’s about patience and communication- getting angry is not likely to have helped him want to see my point of view. So will need to talk it over a lot and try to listen as well as ask him to understand me.

However, I still feel tempted to say I am not project managing it all. Perhaps the best option is the list on the wall and him to take some of the meals on the list, or even for him to see clearly, the proportion in the list that’s about food prep. I’m still upset and hurt, need to get through that a bit before deciding plans hastily I think. Agree a ‘stunt’ is a bad idea all round.

And ps to the pp who was upset I am privately hoping for restrictions to cancel the party - sorry - I know that would be devastating for lots of people. Here I go trying to take care of feelings. I don’t wish it on others but I think it’s ok for me to feel privately that a small and quiet Christmas with my own brood and no need to perform, would be my dream. Thankfully restrictions are not my decision! It’s too late to create the Xmas I actually want now but I will in future.

I’m a more experienced cook, worked in restaurants when very young to pay my way through University and worked as a volunteer cook for a food project it means I’m much faster so a big buffet or a dinner is much easier for me. So the actual cooking tends to be done by me but he is there doing a lot. Basically I’m chef and he is kitchen porter. The work is shared.

Share the load regardless of whose side of the family is coming.

He also does not know what it is like to be a woman and be socialised all your life to take care of other peoples feelings and needs

This is the real issue, I have never bought in to this ever. I will put myself first, it just becomes selfish if it is all of the time. I saw my much older sisters behave just like society wanted and remember thinking I’m just not doing it because quite frankly they always put themselves and their needs last.

FFS are you my husband?!!
Why would you think I was your husband because I think cooking is not stressful? I cook, my husband cooks, but I organise it so it is not stressful.

I also said that he should be doing some or all of the cooking, he is an adult, he should be able to cater for his family.

Oops, I'm going to buck the trend and say I think you're being a bit mean actually. Your DH seems to pull his weight and according to you does all the housework bar cooking, shopping and laundry. So you already know he doesn't / can't cook. So he can't appreciate the stress you're under. Making him do the cooking to force him to understand seems harsh. Anyone can make beds and hoover - it's grunt work, but cooking is a skill. One that you've spent time perfecting whilst he does the other stuff - an agreement I assume you were happy with? There's no way he can suddenly do a meal for 17 with all the timings if he's never done it for even your family - even you who are experienced have said you find it difficult.

A much better idea, like @Bubblecap says, is to get him to help you with the prep to relieve a bit of your stress and to give him an idea of the complexity of what you have to do. Or maybe get him to do one course, starter or pudding say. Share the tasks instead you being either a martyr or a tartar.

Don't sacrifice Christmas on the altar of 'told you so'. You'll eat less well and there will be an atmospheric here and you'll have dragged his family into it as well.
Talk. He's already admitted that he was upset over nothing. You've already acknowledged that you were tetchy and it wasn't his fault.
So sit down and do the planning now. Get in writing what needs doing and who is doing it and tick off as you go so you don't need to keep it all in your head and he can have some responsibility too.

I misunderstood and now see that he doesn't realise that he was upset over nothing and is in fact oblivious and being a bit of an arse.
My original comment applies though. Don't waste Christmas on this argument. Find a way to rid yourself of the mental load and share the actual tasks.

@Bubblecap

He also does not know what it is like to be a woman and be socialised all your life to take care of other peoples feelings and needs

This is the real issue, I have never bought in to this ever. I will put myself first, it just becomes selfish if it is all of the time. I saw my much older sisters behave just like society wanted and remember thinking I’m just not doing it because quite frankly they always put themselves and their needs last.

I am really working on changing this, I don’t want to buy into it, and my younger sister is more like you but I am the oldest and my mother is also a bit of a child so I have been taking responsibility for this shit for a looooong time. I am making progress but it’s hard, it’s pretty ingrained. For me to even be considering a future Xmas just us, which is not what others will want, feels like it makes me a bad person (100% know it doesn’t)

@madisonbridges

Oops, I'm going to buck the trend and say I think you're being a bit mean actually. Your DH seems to pull his weight and according to you does all the housework bar cooking, shopping and laundry. So you already know he doesn't / can't cook. So he can't appreciate the stress you're under. Making him do the cooking to force him to understand seems harsh. Anyone can make beds and hoover - it's grunt work, but cooking is a skill. One that you've spent time perfecting whilst he does the other stuff - an agreement I assume you were happy with? There's no way he can suddenly do a meal for 17 with all the timings if he's never done it for even your family - even you who are experienced have said you find it difficult.

A much better idea, like @Bubblecap says, is to get him to help you with the prep to relieve a bit of your stress and to give him an idea of the complexity of what you have to do. Or maybe get him to do one course, starter or pudding say. Share the tasks instead you being either a martyr or a tartar.

I think you make fair points - maybe I over sold him, he doesn’t do all of it, he does far more of dishes and tidying toys away etc. I am also constantly tidying and clearing dishes etc, he does more. He does most of bills and holiday planning type stuff these days. I still carry the ‘wifework’ like kid school liaison, sorting out clothes, toys, yada yada. I don’t really want this to be a compare our lists of work which is old and boring and we’ve had many negotiations to come to an arrangement that generally suits our strengths.

I just want him to recognise that in a situation like this, I take a heavy load that he simply can’t take, and it’s fucking hard work! A bit like child birth. He is also not one of these men that will be like in awe of her wife for the great feat she completed (not saying dinner is quite like child birth but hopefully you know what I mean). I want him to recognise a big task that is solely my responsibility and be like ‘fair play Heruka’ that is no small thing, what can I do to make it easier. Like you say, anyone can hoover so I would appreciate that being recognised instead of made out to be fuck all.

And no he thinks that I was being a total bitch to be tetchy at that time and thinks it’s reasonable to expect me to calmly explain ‘I’m just a little stressed just now, would you mind terribly saving this conversation til later?’ Yes in an ideal and perfect world I would have said that but wtf!! Most of me knows that my reaction is not wildly unusual but I suppose he’s gotten to me a bit too.

Sorry for all these long posts