Air source heat pumps - a bit off putting, or is it just me?

[FolornLawn]

I was surprised to see how big and ugly they are.

This article shows a picture of one, and I wouldn't want it in my small garden. Also the report says people will need room for a boiler and a water cylinder.

I'm quite surprised at how negatively I feel about the new plans. There's something about having to remodel bits of my house and garden that feels like an imposition, when I happily recycle, use washable sanitary pads and kitchen roll, go without a tumble dryer etc. Is it just me?

My (gas) boiler is due to be replaced, and I've looked at air heat pumps as an alterntaive. The cost is prohibitive, the funding - inadequate. I'd like one, but it's just not an affordable option at this point.

[quote Herhereherhere]@RichardMarxisinnocent. I dry all my clothes indoors because the MVHR system takes the damp air or straight away so I don't have to worry about mould. We can have windows open in Feb on a sunny day if we want - keeping an eye on the temperature though. Temperature needs to keep very stable, the house can't do wild swings so it is always 20-22 degrees we aim for. It will lose 0.3 degree overnight in winter. If it gets cold, it can take a while to heat and vice versa. Not all pasivhaus are like that, but ours is due to construction method.

I love living in it though - it changes your life never being chilly, fresh air at all times, no harsh radiator hest. We also have hard floors and the reduction in dust has made such a difference to DH sniffles. Alot less insects come in the house too and the sound proofing is great. I will be doing my best to avoid living in a non-passivhaus again.

Heat pump for water has decent sound insulation on in, and is tucked in a plant room - but more sound insulation can be added so the noise shouldn't be a reason to put people off. MVHR is greedily sound proofed anyway.[/quote]
Thank you to you and the other poster for the passivhaus info. I had heard of them, was aware of them as being environmentally friendly as they don't need heating, and have a vague memory of one being built on Grand Designs, but didn't know how it all worked.

Thanks for the info about MVHR. It might not be impossible to retrofit that to a relatively modern house.

I just can't get over the fact that if you can afford one of these things the government will give you £5000 towards it, but if you can't afford one you will get no help at all. The same goes for most green initiatives; they're a subsidy to those who can already pay upfront. It's a really insane and illogical way of doing things.

They require massive servicing every 4 years cost me £2000 in repairs when I moved into my brand new house with one - only on call out for ‘free’ eg £300 maintainer contract for 12 months after that - you are buggered. Try to get anyone to come out - all local service / plumbers etc don’t have a bloody clue.

@EsmaCannonball

I just can't get over the fact that if you can afford one of these things the government will give you £5000 towards it, but if you can't afford one you will get no help at all. The same goes for most green initiatives; they're a subsidy to those who can already pay upfront. It's a really insane and illogical way of doing things.

Yes, it's a bung for the well off

Where people are talking about them being able to cool aswell, they are talking about modern split wall mounted 'aircon' units, which nowdays can both heat and cool. They are essentially the same as an ASHP & just as efficient, but are a fan heater on the wall instead of radiators, and can't do hot water obviously. They kick out a fair amount of heat & are really good.

I've no idea why these have not been mentioned by the government at all - they still provide efficient electric heating, are far far cheaper to buy/fit, can be easily fitted to smaller properties/where a full ASHP is unsuitable, & also obviously have the bonus of being able to keep your well insulated house cool in the summer, where, because their usage generally ties directly with how sunny it is, any environmental impact of using as 'aircon' is pretty much directly offset by high solar production in the summer months.

I have 2 room AC and a 4kw solar PV system, and can have the AC on full on summer sunny days, energy consumption covered entirely by the solar. As the climate is expected to increase in temperature over the next few decades, I think they will become ever more important.

MVHR is relatively simple in any bungalow, not so simple in two or more story buildings.

Anyone considering an extension should investigate passive standards, we converted our bungalow to a house and don't need any heating in the new upstairs.

@FurierTransform Are these definitely air source heat pumps? Are they not just electric heating/air con units? Everything I've ever seen about ASHP doesn't show wall-mounted units indoors?

My radiators aren’t 2.5 x normal size, to whichever poster wrote that. That would take up the whole wall!

They’re all double thickness but don’t seem larger than ordinary radiators.

There is no A/C with my ASHP.

My house in an 1840s terrace (2 up 2 down miner’s cottage) and it works fine.

@FurierTransform if a home is insulated to reasonable levels domestic hot water requires more energy than heating - hence the focus on air to water heat pumps.

There is no way it would work or be affordable here. People should resist this as long as they can. Even if the state paid 100% of the installation and all the repairs forever it would still be worse - cold inside the house, break downs more often, unsightly - just horrible on all scores.

[quote riverpebbles]@FurierTransform Are these definitely air source heat pumps? Are they not just electric heating/air con units? Everything I've ever seen about ASHP doesn't show wall-mounted units indoors?[/quote]
Yes, technically the heating bit works exactly the same as an ASHP - they have valves in the refrigeration bit and essentially just reverse operation so the Indoor bit gets hot and the outside but gets cold .There are no traditional electric heating elements in them. My one for example is rated for approx 3.5kw of heat output, for circa 800w-1kw electric input.

@FurierTransform three are two types of air source heat pump. Air to air or air to water.

Most people here are talking about air to water where you still have radiators. I have air to air on the mvhr and air to water for my hot water. The air con units are air to air and work in the same way but the heat point is quite concentrated without ducting.

The sooner Tesla invent efficient electric central heating the better.

I was reading today about £450 average annual service and repair costs one bloke had.

The sooner Tesla invent efficient electric central heating the better.

Electric heaters are already 100% efficient, so they will have their work cut out.

@Coogee ASHPs are around 300% efficient.

@FluffyBooBoo

That looks like a ground source heat pump to me. I had an air source heat pump, and we didn't have anything outside like that.

I could be wrong though, I'm not an expert.

The photo is an air source heat pump, it's almost identical to the one we have, though slightly larger.

We moved into a housing association bungalow in the summer and it has one in the garden, in front of the living room window and it doesn't really take up that much space, though we only have a small one bedroom bungalow. A larger house would need a larger ASHP. We hate it. The boiler is in a cupboard in the bedroom and it's so unbearably noisy, we can't use it when we sleep. It's so loud, I can hear it through ear plugs

@Moonmelodies

The sooner Tesla invent efficient electric central heating the better.

It would be a thing of beauty - but I suspect it would also be announced about 8 years before they could actually deliver it, have a waitlist 5 years long, be really expensive, and possibly get sent in to space first

I'm a fresh air freak and need it for health and wellbeing. The thought of sealing myself up in the house so one of these things can work properly just horrifies me. I won't be having one. We don't use our central heating anyway, just rely on a smokeless fuel stove in the sitting room. If they're banned I'll just freeze I suppose.

@bestcattoyintheworld look up MVHR.

I'm a fresh air freak and need it for health and wellbeing. The thought of sealing myself up in the house so one of these things can work properly just horrifies me. I won't be having one.

You don’t have to seal yourself up. You can leave all the windows and doors open if you want. It will just cost more to run, but so would a gas boiler.

I was so pleased to get rid of our water tank and water cylinder when we had a combi boiler fitted a few years ago. We had water leaks before. Also can now drink from the upstairs bathroom tap. As no fear of what might be contained in a water tank.

ASHPs are around 300% efficient.

I think you are confusing efficiency with coefficient of performance.

Also can now drink from the upstairs bathroom tap. As no fear of what might be contained in a water tank.

You can do that and have a hot water tank. Just make sure that the cold water taps a connected directly to the mains rather than the tank.