It's a (British) dogs life

[Cruddles]

To set the scene, I'm originally from Australia and my wife is from London, and we live in the South East of England. We have two children under 5. My wife has always talked about getting a dog one day.

A few weeks ago we moved into our forever home, part of it is a fairly decent size garden, would be about 20m long by 8m wide. Also there's a large garage at the rear of the garden, and a utility room in the house accessable from the side.

When the discussion of having a dog comes up it seems my wife and i have very differing views of how it's managed. Growing up in Australia we always had a dog. It would live in the garden and provided with a kennel. At night we would put the dog in the garage with a basket with blankets in it. The dog would be allowed in the house when the family was at home, but there would be strict rules about where in the house it could go, bedrooms were definitely a no no. The dog would be walked 3-5 times a week, weather dependent, and it never travelled in the car anywhere.

My wife's experience of having a dog is it lives inside with the family, including sleeping on beds. It would remain inside if everyone was out, letting it out in the garden was just for going to the toilet or having a play. It would be walked two times a day, no matter the weather, and would often go in the car with them to places.

I believe that our house provides the kind of set to i had in Australia for keeping dogs, and I'd be happy to get an appropriate dog now. My wife insists that the "Australian" way is cruel for the UK as Australia "is always hot" so dogs can live outside. This is utter jibberish and my wife partly says it tongue in cheek, but she insists the "British" way is the only way to keep a dog. I would be happy to set up an area in the garage or the utility room that the dog could access that would have heating for the really cold days as a compromise, but this isn't enough.

If it is the "British" way i don't think i ever want a dog. I already have two children, i don't want a hairy, slobbering third one.

So my question is, is my wife correct? Does everyone else keep dogs the "British" way and I'm cruel, or is she over the top?

OP you have not been unkind in your ways. British have an obsession with dogs, multiplied during the pandemic.
There is a huge industry behind it all and the propaganda that comes with it.
I agree with you and your wife is being unreasonable to push on you a way of living you are not happy with. It’s intrusive.

Should have added that the utility is likely connected with the central heating system in your house so weather is not a problem at all.

In the uk, working dogs often live outside. That would be farm dogs used for herding. Working gundogs sometimes live outside in well constructed, warm, dry kennels. Others live indoors with their family and handler.
Pet dogs live indoors. They are family members. I currently have two, in recent years often had 3. My dogs sleep in the kitchen or large utility. I don’t want them sleeping with me, they need to be confident left alone. I never leave mine longer than 4 hours. They’re walked twice a day, the pup goes with me to training groups twice a week.
Dogs need routines, including walks on and off lead. If you don’t want to fo these things, stick to goldfish

I'm Australian and would be more your wife's way. Agree outside sleeping common in Australia, but it's largely a different climate.

I know lots of working dogs kept outside, what I would say though is not too have just one, they need company. Also they need work - a good walk every day. 3 times a week just doesn't cut it.
In addition, dog theft is a massive problem here.

OP are you from a traditionally rural area of Australia?

I think what you describe would have been relatively common in rural areas of the UK a couple of generations ago, but over time dogs have moved into all areas of the home and life. My grandparents had a dog, it was treated well and spent alot of time with them, but it wasn't allowed further than the kitchen. In those days children weren't encouraged to spend time inside the house nevermind the dog, both were chased outside to play!

I know people who keep dogs on the UK as you describe, but they are always working dogs. Some of those people also have one pet dog in the house.

I think there is a mid- way which is not letting your dog sleep on beds etc, so maybe in a few years when your children are older you and your wife could compromise?

My grandparents had a dog, it was treated well and spent alot of time with them, but it wasn't allowed further than the kitchen. In those days children weren't encouraged to spend time inside the house nevermind the dog, both were chased outside to play!

I think this comment has probably reminded me of something: we would run our dog ragged in the garden, throwing a ball or chasing it until it had no more energy left

The way you kept dogs sounds like how some people keep farm dogs in the UK. My PIL, when I first met them and were still farming, kept their dogs in the garage, and they weren't allowed in the majority of the house, but came and lay by the fire in the evening. I think you would need at least 2 dogs for this type of system and you would need an outdoor lifestyle.

Now my PIL are retired they have house dogs, although they are not allowed on the furniture or upstairs.

Our dog is a member of the family and she goes where she likes, I choose to keep her out of our bedroom and so does DS1 but DS2 lets her sleep in his room if she wants.
Unless you spend the majority of your time outdoors I think you need a house dog.

I think your way sounds alot better for the dog! More walks more outdoor time especially when no one is home!
But people treat dogs like kids and not animals!

I think 90%of people I know with dogs don't look after them properly! They don't exercise them enough they leave them at home on their own too much! Overfeed them shite etc and don't get them insured!
Buy breeds that are not healthy
And don't appreciate how hot a dog can be

Less people should have dogs in my opinion they are animals and not kids

But I know I'm in the minority

Working dogs may live in kennels yes, but they are bred for that and they are constantly exercised in their jobs!
And British weather is miserable for a large part of the year..why would you leave a family member outside?
My dog is not babied..she's a dog, but my responsibility to her includes her comfort, several hours a day exercise and good dog care if we have to leave her more than a few hours.
I think your neighbours and children's friends would be pretty perplexed to find a dog living outside here!

My dogs sleep inside. The puppy has a crate, the big dog has the run of downstairs. Neither are allowed upstairs/ on beds/ on sofas. They get 2 walks a day as well free access to the hard when we’re home. Sometimes they’ll travel by car for a walk somewhere nicer.

I’m qualified dog groomer and I’ve also worked with DEFRA on their ‘Petfished’ campaign.

Having a dog as a family pet is like having a giant hairy child, you are absolutely correct.

The way you are describing sounds like a way to create an unsocialised, bored dog.

An unsocialised, bored dog is a potential liability to you, your family and a nuisance to your neighbours.

Bored dogs escape, can cause traffic accidents and get themselves hurt or worse.

Unsocialised dogs can be fearful, nip and bite. They can be destructive. If they’re not used to being walked, it becomes harder to take them for a walk so owners walk them less and less it becomes a vicious cycle.

Perhaps consider researching a different type of pet. Or if you do decide to have a house dog, may I recommend a greyhound or whippet? They’re fairly easy-going, not too hairy and don’t smell.

@TheDoctorDances

How is his way going to make for a u socialised bored dog?
Because its kept outside (with a shelter)
when no one is home anyway?
Walked more than his wife recommends!
Not locked in a crate half the day and actually has the run of a big garden

I don't get it

I'm not looking for an argument I'm curious

[quote Greenrubber]@TheDoctorDances

How is his way going to make for a u socialised bored dog?
Because its kept outside (with a shelter)
when no one is home anyway?
Walked more than his wife recommends!
Not locked in a crate half the day and actually has the run of a big garden

I don't get it

I'm not looking for an argument I'm curious[/quote]
It's not walked more than the wife wants, he is suggesting 2-5 times a week, that's less than twice a day by quite a lot. It would be a lonely time for a dog, especially since it will have minimal interaction with other dogs.

I imagine the warmer, dryer climate in Australia means a wider range of dogs are hardy enough for an outdoor or semi-outdoor life.

‘ I think this comment has probably reminded me of something: we would run our dog ragged in the garden, throwing a ball or chasing it until it had no more energy left’

That comment also shows a lack of understanding about dogs and their welfare.

Dogs are people pleasers and some dog breeds have a natural instinct to chase when something is thrown and will carry on even if they are exhausted. Depending on the breed and the age of the dog excessive dogs exercise is also detrimental to their joints.

One of my three is a sighthound and he would chase and run after a ball day until he dropped down dead such is strong prey drive and wanting to play.

As a responsible owner I make sure that he not ‘run ragged’ as the very thought is appalling.

Would you make your children run until they dropped? It’s the same with a dog if you live and cherish it.

Please don’t get a dog.

^ excuse missed out words etc, I was annoyed at the op’s ignorance about the cate of dogs.

You cant live your life as though you are still in Australia! You must have noticed it's not only different weather but a different culture here. I'm married to a South African yes his childhood dogs lived outside too, but they were guard dogs not family pets. He recognises that life totally different here, and owning a dog is also different.
Our dog will only go in the garden if one of us is with her! She's super clingy to dh in particular and is always on his lap on the settee. We pay for doggy daycare (£75 a week) when we are at work. Dont get a dog if you aren't prepared for what having a dog in the UK really entails.

@Snoken

Ohh dear I read that as 3-5 times per day!!

Fuck sake

Too cold for a dog to be outside or in a garage. Maybe get a cat instead

Your description of your childhood dog pets is how I remember things used to be in this part of the world too. Nowadays, so many dogs are hopelessly pampered and anthropomorphised. I wouldn't want a dog going by your wife's conditions.

Interesting.
My dog mad GPs had dogs sleeping outside but they can in if it was cold and were allowed in kitchen and sitting room. Never upstairs . They were fed first and walked at least once a day as well as having the run of outside ,which was large, during the day.my experience of keeping dogs and that of other family members is that dogs sleep in the kitchen or utility and are confined to these areas when family are out. No dogs upstairs and only into sitting room when the family are there. Daily walks at least and lots of time in the garden ie door left open if fine , dog door if available etc. If we are going out and the dogs can come they do. Would a model like that be a compromise. As above working dogs often sleep in kennels or sheds they aren't necessarily less well loved.

Sorry OP but your way sounds horrendous and neglectful towards the dog. Dogs are not all the same, different breeds have different needs and temperaments. Working farm dogs live outside as PP have said but they’re exercised and worked every day, because such breeds need a job and mental stimulation. They’d be bored shitless living in a kennel in a suburban garden which could lead to them being anxious, destructive, vocal, aggressive. Similarly, while a husky could physically withstand being outdoors in the cold, the summer would be too hot. A chihuahua wouldn’t tolerate living in the garden, it could freeze to death in the winter. I could go on - the point is dogs are not a homogenous species, but really, no dog bred to be a pet should live the life you’re suggesting. We also know much more about dog behaviour and psychology now, and how to appropriately train dogs and teach them to behave and interact with the world. Shutting them out is not it. I personally sleep with my dog on the bed and pamper him silly but plenty of people train dogs not to be in the bedroom or on furniture while still having them live indoors.

Lots of my house/pet sits in australia have outdoor dogs that are either never allowed inside or only allowed inside during rain or storms. They have lovely kennels, plenty of shade and most of the time I'm outside running around with them. But England is a damp little island, it's really quite miserable to be constantly cold and damp. Would you spend hours and hours running around outside with the dog in freezing January drizzle?