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I can’t bear him. God I just can’t

108 replies

Williesfillies · 07/08/2021 06:33

Ex husband. Abusive. Divorce pending.
Having abused me financially so that I’ve had to go to court for finances he is now just moving onto the next thing. The. Children.

Currently he doesn’t do overnights, he is gearing up to take me to court but right now that’s how it is.

He’s seeing them this weekend. This has taken a week to arrange because he seems to have started some rule in his head that he won’t reply to me for 48 hours, so eg “can I see them x day?”
Me “yep, what time”
48 hours of total silence, until the day before at which point he will re appear and start arranging it last minute. It’s always last minute.

This week it’s over a return time, the youngest is fairly young, but I just said “what time roughly will you be dropping them off?” Which I don’t think was unreasonable, however, apparently that’s me dictating, he can’t possibly give a time, it will be whenever it is etc etc.

I would argue that I too need a life and having no time at all arranged means he can (and probably will) drop them back really early, so I can’t actually go out.

Tried setting a time ie “ok, well let’s say 7 then” which also got refused.

Eventually had to say that no time, no children and after a full day he came back with a time that is as late as possible and that he may change.

I can’t bear it. I’m a ball of anxiety and rage over this every time we have an interaction. I try to be polite, I try to say it’s for the children’s welfare, but you just can’t reason with him. He’s decided that I “won’t tell him what he’s doing” and that’s that, so that a reasonable question just becomes a battlefield until I have to say they aren’t going.

I can’t bear dealing with him. Even with him getting a court order it will continue like this.

OP posts:
Retrievemysanity · 07/08/2021 08:11

He’s playing games and it’s all about control. Do the kids enjoy seeing him and are the older two aware of the issues surrounding contact?

I think you need to be firm and have a routine in place so it’s not him saying ‘can I have the kids on x day’, it’s more certain so Saturdays 9-5 for example.

If relationships are good then flexibility can work better and you can give more leeway but it sounds like he’s just taking the mick so be firm but reasonable and don’t back down. Keep a record of all correspondence and get good legal advice. Good luck.

Williesfillies · 07/08/2021 08:17

Yeah I’ve had issues with him rearranging contact through the eldest without telling me and putting her in a difficult position, times in the past when he’s asked for a day, I’ve rearranged so he can have that day, he’s then changed to the original day then refused to see them because I’ve been difficult and stopped him!

Now he is planning on court he’s trying to be more well behaved, but what he is just keeps coming through. He thinks he’s being clever, but he’s just reinforcing my view that I just can’t parent with him.

OP posts:
Williesfillies · 07/08/2021 08:20

The kids like seeing him, but they are aware of what he is like, they take it for what it is, he will shower them with days out (but refuse any requests from the eldest for some extra clothes money in case I get given it as “extra”) but they know that eventually he will let them down, or lose his temper and ignore them etc

OP posts:
nothingcanhurtmewithmyeyesshut · 07/08/2021 08:23

If he does this even with a court order he will lose access to them altogether. Courts do not like being ignored and if he does so repeatedly he will face prison time.

RandomMess · 07/08/2021 08:26

Just offer fixed contact every Saturday 10-6 he takes it or misses out. Sure he will return late but you have enough evidence that being flexible isn't working and court will arrange fixed contact anyway.

robotcollision · 07/08/2021 08:32

@MyOtherProfile

I would say to him right you have the children from 11 til 7. I will be out. Please drop them back at the time arranged.
This is a good idea. Tell him clearly when you are free for drop off. Give him a clear window. And say if you don't hear from him within 12 hours with a clear alternative time, you will assume this is convenient. Be absolutely fair and clear.

You could also say (so it's on record) that his regular 48-hour delays in replying to your reasonable co-parenting queries are not tenable long term and you will need to raise this issue legally if he finds he is unable to communicate in a more timely manner.

notanothergoodname · 07/08/2021 08:36

I do think about that, but I can’t really justify it and I’m always very aware of how I will look in court, because he’s given it a good try of painting me as abusive and controlling in the past (he is also an absolutely accomplished liar he can lie barefaced but somehow he’s convinced himself it’s actually true so the lines blur for him) so don't want to seem unreasonable
I understand this exactly. Mine is the same. Its like a mental torture, they are able to convince others as they absolutely believe their own self-serving lies.

AnxiousAndUnraveling · 07/08/2021 08:42

Think Randommess is right. Offer a time that is reasonable that is child centred and if/when he doesn’t stick to it you have evidence of his inability to do what is best for the kids to show the court. If he doesn’t return them at that time eg 7pm you send a message at 7.10pm asking where the children are, then again at 7.20pm etc. Another time stamp for the court.

Be as factual and non emotive in messages as you can. It’s not being controlling.

Ostryga · 07/08/2021 08:44

You need to make the children available for contact. If he doesn’t turn up then that is his decision.

He still has all the control here and you’re allowing it.

Set a regular day for contact every week, say Saturday 10-6 or whatever works for you. Tell him with zero emotion that that is when then children will be ready. If he doesn’t show up then that’s on him.

Do not reply to any messages unless they are specifically related to the children. And when you do make sure it is factual and calm. No emotion.

You need to take the wind out of his sails, but in a way that isn’t going to look awful if you’re in court. Keep all the evidence of you being calm and making sure the children see him, and him being a twat.

DD’s dad used to be like this, and it was a long and stressful process but 4 years on it’s so much better.

cauliflowerkorma · 07/08/2021 08:45

It sound truly awful. And i'd hate it. But...for the sake of your sanity is there any way you can stop chasing him and hanging on his every word. Especially when he is getting a rise off it.

So you have a list of jobs and things to do for the day. If he turns up back on the drive whilst you are at the gym or out food shopping then they wait-or he tries to drop off again later. Just don't sit waiting for confirmation and wasting your day. Crack on. If he wants flex then you get flex too. If he doesn't communicate a time you can't sit around waiting. Or ask eldest to text when they are on their way. That way you are at least being productive. And again its the nonchalance. Oh on the drive-super on my way back see you in ten!

beigebrownblue · 07/08/2021 08:45

OP I feel for you and so sorry you are going through this. I know this dynamic well. And it is nothing less than insiduous gaslighting.

My ex, (DD now sixteen) does this with just about everything and has done over a number of years. I think some people underestimate how upsetting it can be and I really feel for you. Dealing with a narcissist is not the same as dealing with a normal, thinking person and some people don't realise this.

You sound like an organised, caring mother who is trying to do her absolute best for her kids. He is quite clearly pretending to forget arrangements, times etc and I recognise this as attempted coercive control. They do it in such a way that to others it can appear trivial. And such people are very good at playing 'Mr. Reasonable' in front of others. But you will hopefully find that courts and judges have seen this kind of behaviour before, which is some comfort perhaps.

After having dealt with this for the past eight years and still dealing with it as needing to deal with the last throes of a divorce settlement during which ex violated yet another court order, I want to say a few things that I wish someone had said to me years ago, things that ay have helped me.

OP I realise you have said you don't have a third party to do the handovers.

In your position, I would at present stop facilitating any contact at all and use the time and energy to be with your kids, do nice things if you can, and prepare for going to court.

If you use a solicitor or are able to, ask them to make it clear to the judge that what you want is stability for your kids and an organised arrangement. Make it clear that you feel that your ex is likely to keep coming back to court if you don't have this. Courts don't like people to do this as ultimately it is a waste of public money.

Before you get to court, try to work out what kind of an arrangment would work for you. Write it down and be ready to suggest it to the judge to go into a contact order.

Be aware that you will need to put things in place to support yourself emotionally in this process.

Someone on here suggested 'The Nurturing Coach'. Website. This is run by a former social worker and is all about dealing with a narcissist ex partner. Can't remember her name but she has videos about dealing with the family court and also offers one to one sessions which may be useful.

As others have suggested, going forward you are going to need practical measures to keep your personal boundaries around yourself and your kids.

Some things have been suggested here such as being very careful about communication.

Listing handover times and places in court order. You may wish to even think about a public place for example a public library or a train station, even the foyer of a supermarket where there is CCTV. So that there is no scope for ex to mess about and where it will be noted if he is late or doesn't turn up at all.

If you possibly can i would also get yourself a counsellor who is aware of these dynamics.

I don't envy you but you will get stronger as others have said. Unfortunately I have experience of all this, so I really don't mind if you need to PM me going forward and I will try my best to pass on something which might be useful.

Once again. so sorry you are experiencing this, stay strong.

AnxiousAndUnraveling · 07/08/2021 08:46

Also my therapist used to say have a neutral stockphrase you keep repeating if he accuses you of being controlling and practice it and don’t deviate. She also said take a deep breath in and slowly let it out before speaking or replying to something. Weirdly it works because it just gives a little focus. It is such a hard situation.

Nonmaquillee · 07/08/2021 08:49

@MyOtherProfile

I would say to him right you have the children from 11 til 7. I will be out. Please drop them back at the time arranged.
Yes, me too.

Failing this, you have an agreement drawn up by a solicitor which clearly states drop off times etc. Make some very black and white rules.

Poor you. What an arsehole.

Allthelights · 07/08/2021 08:50

I don’t know about op’s ex but giving him exact times and going out would not work for me with my ex. It depends how much he genuinely wants to see the children and how much he is being awkward and playing games.

PrincessNymeria · 07/08/2021 08:52

Add something like "if you don't get back to me by tonight with a time, I'll assume you've changed your mind".

CornishPastyDownUnder · 07/08/2021 09:07

as a p.p said.. My abusive&controlling ex who's lifes work was making mine&d.c as unpredictable&high maintenance as poss-block all contact.
Id be told on a sat afternoon he could have them for dinner but was going out so had to return them by7..and that random weekday nights every month or so were all he could manage-again with 1 or2hours notice,designed to be as awkward and unappealing as possible.
I had a great legal aid lawyer who simply said hes one of hundreds she deals with&block him on all media-force him to deal with everything through court.Well suprisesuprise he got as far as getting a lawyer himself for us only to be told he'd be"forced"into regular contact hours and to make a plan the we could work with-this wasnt what he wanted at all and within a coupleof months he'd left for another city..that was over10 years ago and we have heard the occasional email that goes straight into junk..never received a penny maintenance but thekids&I have had such a peaceful &free existence compared to most of the women i meet who still have their dickhead-ex puppeteering their lives.Small mercies😉

Hugoslavia · 07/08/2021 09:07

Re his comments about how he won't be constrained by time if he's having fun etc, then you need to point out that, as fun as it is spending time with your children, unfortunately you do also need to be able to keep an eye on the time to ensure that they have a beneficial routine including mealtimes and bedtimes and that, if they do see him more regularly, to ensure that he can do simple things such as get them to school on time etc. If he can manage to park his car and return to it before his parking ticket expires, then he can certainly stick to a time or, be reasonable and text you to ask if you mind extending it.

CBroads · 07/08/2021 09:09

Play him at his own game. If he texts you "can I have the kids on this date?" Wait until the day of or day before to reply so its more or less too late for him to change his kind. Just reply with "yes, get that at this time and I want them back at x time, if they're not back at the specified time I'll report you to the police for kidnap" simple.

2catsandhappy · 07/08/2021 09:24

My ex would deliberately bring our dd back later than agreed.
I never said a word. Just greeted dd enthusiasticaly.
Eventualy he worked out it was eating into his own free time and he stopped doing it. Took months though.

TheFoundations · 07/08/2021 09:28

A little mind trick for you, as you've had plenty of practical suggestions already:

Does it help to think of this as 'He is unbearable', rather than 'I can't bear him'? It just takes the pressure off you to even try to be climb the ridiculous mountains he keeps putting in front of you, and places the responsibility for the difficulties he's causing with him, rather than with your lack of ability to deal with him.

Also: Flowers

callmeadoctor · 07/08/2021 09:29

Great ideas on here (in the meantime, get your 12 year old to text you when they are on their way back)

RandomMess · 07/08/2021 09:35

Don't start playing games.

Seriously just offer fixed weekly contact.

"DC are available on Saturdays 10-6 and Wednesdays 5-6pm, if you turn up more than 10 minutes late it will be assumed you aren't coming"

Less is more. No discussions or negotiations just repeat grey rock/broken record technique.

If he says that doesn't work for him ignore don't negotiate etc.

Obviously choose a day and times he doesn't work everything else is up to him.

Perhaps Friday evening and Saturday work best as it's less of an issue if he returns them late plus he will likely want to go out and therefore bring them back.

If he returns them just message him once they are back. The late return this evening at x is noted. Nothing more.

He wants to keep you engaged in the endless messages etc so drop the rope.

BrilloPaddy · 07/08/2021 09:36

You need a shared calendar. Give him the times that the DC are available, and give nothing else. Perfectly reasonable on your part and nothing that a court can use against you.

It's on him then if he turns up or not.

NewlyGranny · 07/08/2021 09:42

Our Family Wizard app will do all the record keeping for you and once he knows every nasty message, every unreliable arrangement and every time he breaks an agreed time, or is rude or unreasonable, it is on record, unerasable and accessible to any legal professionals you give access to it, he will calm right down and behave. You will save yourself a shedload of note-taking and evidence gathering as the app does it all.

Moreover, your 12 yo can learn to say, "Just put it on the Wizard, Dad," whenever her DF tries to use her to carry messages. He mustn't be able to do that, it's not fair.

She, or he, will just end up refusing to communicate with him at all if that goes on, and next he'll be claiming you've alienated her or him. 🙄

Go the Wizard route!

icedancerlenny · 07/08/2021 09:44

Yes it’s our family wizard. We didn’t use it as my daughter is old enough now to make her own arrangements but it does look very good for situations like this.