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Could the Gillick Competence test be used on our kids to ensure vaccinations in school?

96 replies

steakandcheeseplease · 22/06/2021 11:29

I feel like I have to preface this with I believe that covid exists, I've been jabbed, family members have had it (luckily all still here), I believe in long covid - I think my father and neighbour have it - so I don't get accused of being a conspiracy nutter.

I think Good Morning Britain went to far this morning, I'm getting a bit suspicious of 'suggestions' being talking about on TV, especially this show as I think they are really testing the waters to how the public will react/behave. And we have seen time after time when people say 'that won't happen, its implemented a few weeks/months later.

This morning they were talking about 16/17 year olds having the vaccine to potentially stop the class bubbles bursting. (This in its self is another thread) & Dr Hilary actually gave incorrect information but it was pointed out and he apologised.

However Adil ray, one of the presenters brought up the Gillick Competency test and this could be used to by pass parents who don't want their children to be vaccinated. Some studies claim that the GC test can be used from 11.5 years old.

So potentially, if this was passed/implemented your child could decide at 11.5 that they will have the vaccination with out your consent.

Vaccinations for younger children will happen. It will probably take place in school and we will be given the option of opting out ( I hope)

Allowing children to use the GC test in this circumstance is a terrible idea. This is not a medical treatment that has been used for years and is completely sound. We are still discovering what this vaccine does. Our children do still need our guidance over this.

We must be really wary of not allowing our emotions surrounding Covid to set a precedence we will not be able to undo. By allowing the government or schools to bypass parental consent we are giving up our parental rights.

You might agree in this circumstance that its acceptable, but what about if the government see how well that worked and decide that they want to lower teenage pregnancies and use these new powers to start giving our young girls birth control injections in school ? What if they ask our children if they want to be part of a new drug trial? Young people are easily manipulated, I've worked with children long enough to know that most things can be easily sold to them if given in the right light.

If your happy for your child to have the vaccine, thats your choice and you should afford that choice to other parents and always advocate pro choice in regards to this vaccine - even if you think every one should have it. Because your not only taking others parents rights away, you will complicit in taking your own away.

Its really concerned me that this was raised on a breakfast show whilst young people are getting ready for school.

OP posts:
MyDcAreMarvel · 22/06/2021 11:33

If children are mature enough to care more about others than their parents do that is a positive thing.
GC is already used in schools with the HPV vaccine so I don’t understand your point.

FricasseeTurnips · 22/06/2021 11:35

It goes both ways - my child at 14 decided not to get the meningitis and tetanus etc boosters - nothing I could do about it. I consented - but she didn't, and no nurse would touch her without consent.

steakandcheeseplease · 22/06/2021 11:37

Both those jabs have had years to be considered extremely safe. Thats one of my points.

OP posts:

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

CovoidOfAllHumanity · 22/06/2021 11:37

The Gillick competence test is a concept in law which already exists and as far as I know can be applied to anything. I think you have it the wrong way round. It would be should vaccines be an exception to Gillick competence rather than should it apply. By default it applies it's a general concept. It certainly applies to birth control as that's what the original Gillick case was about.

I think my 14yr old is Gillick competent about the vaccine. We talked about it and she understands the risks vs benefits including rare side effects and that she is at low risk from Covid but she says she wants to have it to protect others who can't and to stop her schooling continuing to be disrupted which is a much worse consequence to her than the chance of a rare side effect.

If it was up to me I'd perhaps be more cautious but it's her body and I believe she can make her own decision on this matter.

steakandcheeseplease · 22/06/2021 11:38

@FricasseeTurnips

It goes both ways - my child at 14 decided not to get the meningitis and tetanus etc boosters - nothing I could do about it. I consented - but she didn't, and no nurse would touch her without consent.
The difference with this is that young peoples lives have been so restricted. The vaccine is being sold as a freedom jab
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Roonerspismed · 22/06/2021 11:40

Yes I believe so. Did you see Newsround the other week when Shridhar advised kids the vaccine was “completely safe” for children? Since retracted but the damage was done; the kids heard it. What else is being drip fed? The government has control over the BBC - if that I now have no doubt.

steakandcheeseplease · 22/06/2021 11:42

but she says she wants to have it to protect others who can't and to stop her schooling continuing to be disrupted which is a much worse consequence to her than the chance of a rare side effect

like I said - its being sold as a freedom jab. "Have the jab and no school disruptions''

No one knows the true effects of this on children yet - yet so many children are already waiting to have it to get back to normality. How can they be fully informed when the data isn't even back yet.

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steakandcheeseplease · 22/06/2021 11:52

@Roonerspismed

Yes I believe so. Did you see Newsround the other week when Shridhar advised kids the vaccine was “completely safe” for children? Since retracted but the damage was done; the kids heard it. What else is being drip fed? The government has control over the BBC - if that I now have no doubt.
I didn't see it but I believe it.

So many kids willing to have a vaccine that was never tested on kids under 16. The WHO even recommends that its not given to under 16 years old. I wonder if these children are aware of that. I very much doubt it.

Children get very little benefit from this vaccine. Its main drivers is to protect others and not to effect school life now. When before it was protect the NHS. Well we did. So why is the GC test now being talked about on a breakfast morning show for under 16 vaccinations?

This isn't right

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NotAnotherPushyMum · 22/06/2021 11:54

I’m not even going to enter in to the safety debate. However, yes of course Gillick competency should apply. They’re either competent to weigh things up or they’re not, which includes understanding all of the ethics etc around this particular vaccination.

gamerchick · 22/06/2021 11:56

So many kids willing to have a vaccine that was never tested on kids under 16. The WHO even recommends that its not given to under 16 years old. I wonder if these children are aware of that. I very much doubt it.

Was never or hasn't been? I'm sure the trials started a while back for kids.

Why do we vaccinate kids from rubella, isn't that a mild illness in kids?

Personally I think kids should be given the choice. My 14 yr old can't wait to have it. He was well miffed he was too young. We don't give our kids enough credit imo.

Stompythedinosaur · 22/06/2021 11:57

Children above 12 who are competent can make their own medical decisions. I don't see why the covid vaccine would be treated differently from any other medical procedure.

steakandcheeseplease · 22/06/2021 12:29

@Stompythedinosaur

Children above 12 who are competent can make their own medical decisions. I don't see why the covid vaccine would be treated differently from any other medical procedure.
Because its still largely untested

The WHO has recommended that the Pfizer is not given to children under 16 even those who are vulnerable. Pfizer is trialing it on kids but its still on going. Pfizer is already being given to kids.

The results are not long term solid enough to say this safe - then to allow children the choice in whether to have it is wrong.

A child can not apply critical thinking to something that is still in its infancy of trials.

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Roonerspismed · 22/06/2021 12:32

No it’s not right and I believe we are gearing up to vaccinate younger children too who will be brainwashed into the “greater good” argument, and there will be collateral damage. Of that I have no doubt

I am already training my children in critical thinking. They can see that for themselves clearly enough - no sports day for them and then they saw the football....

Sirzy · 22/06/2021 12:36

Personally I think for secondary aged pupils in the vast majority of cases it should be their decision, it’s their body and they should be able to make an informed decision.

We wouldn’t pin down a teenager and force them to have a vaccine against their will so why should we stop them having a vaccine they wish to have?

Soontobe60 · 22/06/2021 12:37

@Roonerspismed

No it’s not right and I believe we are gearing up to vaccinate younger children too who will be brainwashed into the “greater good” argument, and there will be collateral damage. Of that I have no doubt

I am already training my children in critical thinking. They can see that for themselves clearly enough - no sports day for them and then they saw the football....

So did you continue the discussion and point out WHY there are no parents allowed at ~Sports day as opposed to the Euro matches?
Deadleaf29 · 22/06/2021 12:37

It will have been tested on children and given approval before it’s offered. No one is going to mass vaccinate children with an untested vaccine. Why would they? I think it’s a slippery slope to start exempting things from the general notion that a competent person can make their own decisions. Frankly there are far worse/bigger medical decisions that a 14 year old could make.

steakandcheeseplease · 22/06/2021 12:40

@Roonerspismed

No it’s not right and I believe we are gearing up to vaccinate younger children too who will be brainwashed into the “greater good” argument, and there will be collateral damage. Of that I have no doubt

I am already training my children in critical thinking. They can see that for themselves clearly enough - no sports day for them and then they saw the football....

`I think we absolutely will be told to vaccinate all children - maybe to even go to school.

The ONS says that 86% of adults now have antibodies though vaccination or having the illness, well we have passed the 85% that was talked about last year. So not sure why 12 year olds are now being targeted?

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MyDcAreMarvel · 22/06/2021 12:44

@steakandcheeseplease The difference with this is that young peoples lives have been so restricted. The vaccine is being sold as a freedom jab
Ahh is that what you think? All the young people I know my own children included want the vaccine because they want to protect others not so they can personally have more freedom.

MilkTwoSugarsThanks · 22/06/2021 12:44

A child can not apply critical thinking to something that is still in its infancy of trials.

Nor can most adults it would seem 🤷🏼‍♀️

Seriously, if I had to sign a permission form for my 17 year old to have the jab I'd wonder what the hell the college was thinking.

MilkTwoSugarsThanks · 22/06/2021 12:46

So not sure why 12 year olds are now being targeted?

I thought it was 16/17 year olds?

Sirzy · 22/06/2021 12:48

he ONS says that 86% of adults now have antibodies though vaccination or having the illness, well we have passed the 85% that was talked about last year. So not sure why 12 year olds are now being targeted?

The 85% estimate for herd immunity will be for the population as a whole not just adults.

CovoidOfAllHumanity · 22/06/2021 12:48

If 'no-one knows the true effects' then why do adults know any better than teenagers?
14 yr old has the same info I have and she's capable of making her own decision so I will let her

How is she wrong to see it as a 'freedom jab'? Practically speaking for her it is. Very soon we are going to see vaccinated people being afforded more freedom. She literally just had her half term fun cancelled because someone in her class tested positive.

Why should she not weigh up the social and societal benefits and harms as well as any medical ones? Seems like sensible competent decision making to me to weigh all the factors.

Trials of Pfizer have been done on under 18s. If it's licensed then that's fine by me. That's what we pay scientists and regulators for to do studies and evaluate them.

DaisyDreaming · 22/06/2021 12:50

Ffs this is a tv show that has to find something to talk about and debate each morning. I don’t see covid vaccination as different as any others and sadly if a child wants vaccine for anything at 11.5 even if they are Gillick competent they go without until they are old enough. Even for children who are Gillick competent their parents are involved

steakandcheeseplease · 22/06/2021 12:53

@Deadleaf29

It will have been tested on children and given approval before it’s offered. No one is going to mass vaccinate children with an untested vaccine. Why would they? I think it’s a slippery slope to start exempting things from the general notion that a competent person can make their own decisions. Frankly there are far worse/bigger medical decisions that a 14 year old could make.
Deadleaf you don't even know if the vaccine is safe for adults. Data is still being gathered on that.

Ive had my jab - no ill side effect - yet. But we are both in a vaccine trial right now.

Regarding children this really may come to surprise you but Pfizer and the other are still in the trial stage. The out comes seems ok - so far but its too early for any real long term data.

I'm sure the children that developed narcolepsy through the swine flu vaccine felt it was safe too or is some collateral damage ok?

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TinaYouFatLard · 22/06/2021 12:55

I can’t believe parents are okay with this.

Have people been so brainwashed by Covid that they are willing to hand their parental rights over to THIS state?

This is the end of fucking days.