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No more WFH or flexible working

659 replies

Lizzie523 · 17/05/2021 20:39

Been WFH for a year now - about 6 months ago the company MD said we had done brilliantly, was thrilled by how we had risen to the challenge etc. We were then told the future would likely be hybrid working & we all had to complete detailed consultations about our preferences RE this. Personally ive been more productive overall & I feel a mix would work well.

Imagine our shock to now be told we are all to go back to full time at the office 5 days a week. They said they would no longer consider the results of the consultations and wished they hadn't done it - many of us tried to appeal this but were just told 'no'.

I moved during the pandemic which means I am just far enough away that 5 days a week in the office is going to be a hassle (not to mention awful for the environment).

We work with a few people with young kids and it obviously isn't inclusive for disabled people either. Our main competitors have already confirmed their commitment to remote working.

Is everyone else headed back to the office or am I right in thinking most places are being more flexible now?

OP posts:
MrsMaizel · 18/05/2021 09:09

WFH doesn't mean you have to be chained to your desk. Yup, I put washing on, do a bit of hoovering etc when I'm working from home. So what? People in the office will be going for coffee, chatting with collegues etc so it makes no odds

and then some women wonder why they fail to progress ...

Fifthtimelucky · 18/05/2021 09:10

I think it's difficult for employers to get the balance right. Some employees in some roles can be as efficient, or more efficient, working at home. Some roles don't work so well from home and some employees don't work so well from home.

It's often difficult to say that certain people can work at home and others can't. For example, it can breed resentment if the more senior people are allowed work at home when the more junior ones aren't, even if that works from an efficiency point of view. And employees leave themselves open to complaints of unfairness if some staff at the same level are allowed to work to work at home when others aren't.

Sometimes it's easier to treat everyone the same, which of course is annoying for those who genuinely are more efficient at home and those with long commutes.

GrumpyHoonMain · 18/05/2021 09:10

@IrmaFayLear

I agree about it being tricky resetting expectations. I think some people are going to become very pissed off if Jane is never available between 3 and 4. And inevitably it will be those without dcs who will be forced into picking up the slack. I think it is important for employers to be flexible on illness/school plays/sports days etc, but the assumption that you should have the right to have your kids wandering around whilst you are meant to be working or that you can be absent for chunks every single day is going to backfire.
Most large companies are already used to this as they allowed wfh for 2-3 days a week even before covid. The facts are that parents who wfh often do a lot more outside of the usual 9-5 and on weekends too. The benefit for office working is only for young non-parents - because ‘learning on the job’ is easier in person.

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poorbuthappy · 18/05/2021 09:10

WFH for us has worked brilliantly.
But since I work for micromanagement.com it's going to end at some point.
Every time it's mentioned we refer them back to the government guidelines which state if you can WFH you should.
I do actually want to go back into the office some days a week but we've been told that's not going to happen.
Totally their call I get it, but there is no good reason to go back full time.
Well apart from the fact it's prob given the 2 owners stomach ulcers not being able to sneak up behind people to watch what they're doing.
Oh and a lack of women in the office means the kitchen doesn't get cleaned apparently.
As you can imagine I am looking for another job.

RedMarauder · 18/05/2021 09:11

Sorry 3 days WFH.

Hardbackwriter · 18/05/2021 09:12

I guess she means they have no wraparound childcare, and possibly (if the nursery children are funded) no childcare they pay for. Anecdotally I know a few people who moved their children from the private nursery we use, which charges top-up fees for funded children and runs an 8-6 day, to the local preschool, which charges no top-up because it only opens term-time 9.30-2.30 because they're working from home. I think they're mad to think that they can work with their preschooler there for almost half the day long-term, but it's not just one family so apparently it's not a unique conception that this is fine. The one I know that most shocked me is a couple I know who both work full-time but cancelled the nursery place they had for their 8 month old when the woman went back to work in January 'because it's a waste of money when we're both at home'. I wondered if they had some sort of unicorn super-easy baby but I've seen her since and she seems as demanding as the rest of them so I'm not sure how they can possibly be working their hours between them.

Thewiseoneincognito · 18/05/2021 09:12

This thread screams:

  1. Office gossip fans / overbearing desk hoppers

  2. Managers with Control issues / Micro managers

  3. SAHPs desperate for OH to go back to the office so they can watch This Morning in their pjs once again

  4. sandwich shop owners

😆

UrAWizHarry · 18/05/2021 09:12

@MrsMaizel

WFH doesn't mean you have to be chained to your desk. Yup, I put washing on, do a bit of hoovering etc when I'm working from home. So what? People in the office will be going for coffee, chatting with collegues etc so it makes no odds

and then some women wonder why they fail to progress ...

GrinGrinGrin

People can do the washing and progress just fine, but your concern is touching.

Thankfully lots of people work for grown-up employers rather than clockwatching jobsworths.

AlmostSummer21 · 18/05/2021 09:13

@Parker231

We’ve already a flexible working approach. You can work from home, office, clients, coffee shop etc - it doesn’t matter. You know what work you have to do, it’s up to you to work out when and where you do it.
Gosh, it's almost like they're employing human adults isn't it.

It's a shame that many other employers think they're employing children who they need to keep an eye on.

Demanding people are in the office M-F 9-5 will bite them on the bum when good people prefer to work for other employers who treat them well.

It's nothing more than presenteeism, because they can't actually manage the staff/business.

Roonerspismed · 18/05/2021 09:13

This is definitely not the norm. Plus it’s not like covid is over is it?

freckles20 · 18/05/2021 09:14

@GrumpyHoonMain I disagree on several levels that only young, childless people benefit from the learning opportunities provided 'in office':

Plenty of young people have children.

Plenty of older people, with it without children benefit for continuous learning.

Who do the 'learners' learn from if they office is paired down to a minimum of people.

RedMarauder · 18/05/2021 09:15

@MrsMaizel one of the roles I did in the past was 95% remote.

Some days I just had meetings with 10 to 15 minutes between each meeting. So it made sense to get the hoover out or put the washing on in between the meetings as I couldn't do any productive work.

It did also mean that I would end up working early or late to finish things that were discussed in the meeting.

If I had a commute as well I wouldn't be able to do this.

FuckyouCovid21 · 18/05/2021 09:15

I've been working from home since March 2020 and I cannot wait to get back, which will be happening next month. I live on my own and I've really missed the interaction, the banter and my friends at work. Management have given us support staff a choice, go to the office/site as much or as little as you feel necessary which works for everyone

freckles20 · 18/05/2021 09:15

Your employer pays your wages and runs the business. They can run it however they see fit. If you don't like if you are free to leave.

Darkmood · 18/05/2021 09:16

Customer service has been appalling over the pandemic - whatever the reason and moving service providers wasn't an option - they simply weren't taking new customers. As a business we are now starting to vote with our feet, carrying our pre-Covid service providers has become too much of a drag - we initially cut them some slack but they haven't improved...I wonder if everyone else is getting ready to start switching due to poor performance.
I don't understand a business that brings everyone back to work in the office to affect a cheap redundancy programme. Good staff will be the first to go - they know they can get a job elsewhere so they vote with their feet leaving the company with all the poor performing staff that won't leave. Can't imagine the company will fly with poorest performing staff in the office.
From our perspective - we will go to flexible hybrid although the details have yet to be agreed - generally if the client wants us in, then we will be in ( and we expect the client will be in less but we work in projects and often the intensity of the deadlines means people do need to be in the same building) and no one will be able to assume they have the right to arrange their lives around a permanent work from home arrangement and if we lose them than that's frustrating and annoying but our business has always required people who are flexible and happy to travel away from home - they were employed on that basis, nothing has changed.

UrAWizHarry · 18/05/2021 09:17

@freckles20

Your employer pays your wages and runs the business. They can run it however they see fit. If you don't like if you are free to leave.
Great attitude to have if you want to encourage decent, loyal staff.

The fact is, there are plenty of employers who do now offer flexible working. Guess where people are going to want to work?

SamusIsAGirl · 18/05/2021 09:19

Mumsnet is so full of corporate simps!
Yes, a business can be run the way those at the top run it but one-way communication by rights should be dead - it's a model of management confined to the dustbins of history. Any business still using this is either trading on it name or riding the coattails of previous success.
You fail to listen and look after your employees at your peril! Think about what happed to BHS. And the Hotel in the Channel 4 series.

Scottishskifun · 18/05/2021 09:20

OP with a small office and poor ventilation it's unlikely that your work can have everyone back in without breaching covid regs!

If many of you are unhappy then contact your LA environmental health team and also the HSE which can investigate this can be anonymous.
Regardless of what your employer says they need to maintain distancing for a good while yet it's the law!

Coffeepot72 · 18/05/2021 09:21

My employer will be starting blended working, so 2-3 days in the office, the rest at home. There would be a riot if anything other was suggested. Also, any employer who insists on workers being in the office 5 days per week, when the job can be carried out just fine from home, will find themselves very unattractive to potential new staff. The world has changed.

Scottishskifun · 18/05/2021 09:22

@freckles20

Your employer pays your wages and runs the business. They can run it however they see fit. If you don't like if you are free to leave.
No not true employers have responsibility to run work places which are compliant with the law! These include the health and safety at work act and also the covid regulations!
Bluedeblue · 18/05/2021 09:22

Going forwards employers will have to be more flexible to attract staff

They really won't. It's an employers market at the moment. I know people with degrees that can't get a minimum wage job just now.

Iggly · 18/05/2021 09:23

@freckles20

Your employer pays your wages and runs the business. They can run it however they see fit. If you don't like if you are free to leave.
They don’t own you.
UrAWizHarry · 18/05/2021 09:23

@Bluedeblue

Going forwards employers will have to be more flexible to attract staff

They really won't. It's an employers market at the moment. I know people with degrees that can't get a minimum wage job just now.

Not necessarily, it depends on the industry.

I'm changing jobs in 4 weeks. I had 3 offers to choose from and, guess what? The company that didn't offer WFH is not the one I'm joining.

CornishGem1975 · 18/05/2021 09:26

My company are retaining WFH or hybrid - it's down to personal choice. I'd be pissed off if that was pulled back now but it's in my new contract. My colleagues are spread all across the continent anyhow.

ThinkAboutItTomorrow · 18/05/2021 09:29

Companies like the collaboration you get in offices (it's why the trend for fewer coffee, printing, toilet hubs in offices - to mix departments for cross fertilisation of ideas and projects).
Many workers prefer peace and the commuting time, plus lower housing costs away from offices.

Now technology means these two things are in potential conflict.

Will be interesting to see how it works out.

Amazon has opted to go big on back to the office - valuing the benefits of collaboration over people leaving them to wfh.

Twitter has said 'work anywhere' valuing the bigger talent pool over collaboration.

Will be interesting to see which works best.

OP, find yourself a Twitter.