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It's a Sin - AIDS in the 80's - Real life examples

147 replies

smellywellies9 · 28/01/2021 10:44

I have just finished watching It's a Sin and it's really hit me hard, I was born early 80's and had no idea how AIDS victims were treated back then, I feel like this has almost been hidden from us.
I would be really keen to hear some real life stories from people older than myself who lived through this. Things that have shocked me:
They were imprisoned in hospital wards with no one allowed in or out.
Homosexuals were not allowed a mortgage in the 80's and possibly 90's?
People use to destroy all cups etc that homosexuals had touched for fear of catching it.
The general ignorance from the government on this.
The attitude from the general public, were people really that cruel??

OP posts:
Thoughtsfortheday · 28/01/2021 16:43

Wow there is there is some very skewed views of those times (late 70’s - late 80’s) and anyone who think gay people were predominantly accepted and in turn AIDS only brought out sympathy and understanding in society is really kidding themselves....

Especially considering the law only changed in the late 60’s in England and early 80’s regarding homosexuality and clause 28 (“shall not intentionally promote homosexuality or publish material with the intention of promoting homosexuality or promote the teaching in any maintained school of the acceptability of homosexuality as a pretended family relationship") was not repealed until 2003.

I have felt absolutely compelled, since watching Its a Sin to inhale any reading, footage, interviews, films on HIV and AIDS and the prejudice, rage and fight they must have felt has really got to me.

I don’t care what age you are, anyone who thinks young gay people with AIDS back then and to a certain extent now lived a life of acceptance is fucking deluded!

I also recommend the the AIDS memorial Instagram page, Always wear Rubber Gloves to wipe tears (Prime) and last nights viewing How to Survive a plague (also prime) (the latter being absolutely incredible!)

Thoughtsfortheday · 28/01/2021 16:44

*early 80’s in Scotland.

SushiSoozie · 28/01/2021 16:46

I don’t care what age you are, anyone who thinks young gay people with AIDS back then and to a certain extent now lived a life of acceptance is fucking deluded!

I don't see that anyone has said they did. But anyone who thinks the whole of society hated them or wouldn't go near them is also fucking deluded!
Probably a good idea for those who weren't born then not tell people who lived through it and were in the thick of it how it was. Just a thought.

Ballstothis148 · 28/01/2021 16:46

But that’s the problem, we don’t know :) gay history isn’t taught really, we only know what we’ve experienced. I’m a kid of the 80s - I only know how people were treated in our area (badly). We had a similar approach (at best) as the pp, anyone different by sexuality or gender was lumped together in a “they’re eccentric” way. In our area I only know our teacher who was fired, some gay guys who were married and came out later in life, now some lesbians in our area. But that’s it! Now in the city I work in... another matter :) but my childhood it was so different, and it’d be SO interesting to know more - personal history and first hand experience - of what it was like. Otherwise we only have articles online etc. I don’t mean history you can buy books about, I mean in living memory like 70s to present. But it’s hard on people to say “oh open up and tell us how awful it was” and put the onus on them to correct us/ reveal sensitive info... but I don’t know how else to ask Blush Me and my friends are all on WhatsApp wanting to know more, but we need to speak to people who went through it. And we don’t know how to find those people.

Anyway people are keen to learn and I hope it keeps solidifying any progress made!

Thoughtsfortheday · 28/01/2021 16:48

@SushiSoozie I have given you no indication from that post when I was born...

SushiSoozie · 28/01/2021 16:50

But we do know. We can read about peoples lives and experiences and find out.
I remember talking to an elderly aunt many years ago about the subject, she would have been young in the 1940's. She didn't just know about gay men and lesbians, she knew them, socialised with them. She knew their stories, their lives. She wasn't in anyway odd by that. Everyone knew of gay people, there were well known codes.

Of course there has always been a lot of prejudice, but don't make the mistake of thinking thats all there was.

frogswimming · 28/01/2021 16:52

At the same time 1980s, women were fired for having a baby outside marriage. There was more permitted in terms of discrimination but again that doesn't mean everyone discriminated.

wowfudge · 28/01/2021 16:53

I never said it only brought sympathy - you and others are seeing things as black and white and they weren't. The AIDs epidemic led to a lot more openness about being gay and the breakdown of taboos around it. No said it was a panacea for the acceptance of homosexuality across society. Not everyone in society is accepting of homosexuality today. It's become taboo to state such views publicly in most arenas though.

Ballstothis148 · 28/01/2021 16:56

Well my grandparents are dead so can’t ask them Grin we’re also stuck in a lockdown so can’t really ask in the pub :) other than my mum who’s totally oblivious to anything outside her immediate circle of 3 friends I don’t have anyone in that generation to ask really. And you’d need to ask quite a few to get a sense of the different experiences so not getting tunnel vision. Not sure what the answer is.... maybe an AMA on mumsnet! But we’d need a volunteer and not harass them into doing it

SushiSoozie · 28/01/2021 16:58

At the same time 1980s, women were fired for having a baby outside marriage. There was more permitted in terms of discrimination but again that doesn't mean everyone discriminated

Exactly. It happened, sure, but most women in that situation were not fired. Most women in that situation, nobody cared if they were married or not.

Icandothis123 · 28/01/2021 16:58

WARNING - this is very sad. But a real life insight of a couple who wanted to share their experience.

SushiSoozie · 28/01/2021 17:03

nd you’d need to ask quite a few to get a sense of the different experiences so not getting tunnel vision. Not sure what the answer is.... maybe an AMA on mumsnet! But we’d need a volunteer and not harass them into doing it

Theres books on the subject. I have a friend who is a historian specialising in gay history, she taught me a lot. It's rich and nuanced and often not at all what you think.

Oneearringlost · 28/01/2021 17:12

Thoughts
See my post before yours at 16.42
Is this a UK version of what I have mentioned? I haven't seen it but thought the Swedish drama was quite, quite beautiful as well as brutal. So well done.

Icandothis123 · 28/01/2021 17:17

WARNING - This is the epilogue to the first video I posted. Also very sad.

gegs73 · 28/01/2021 17:26

I was a teenager in the 80s and into the early 90s. Most of my friends were terrified of AIDs and were extremely cautious about sexual relationships. In older teens, friends would have short flings then go get tested at the hospital clinic giving a fake name as you had to declare the test if you went to your doctors. Where I lived there were very few if any openly gay people I knew of so I can’t overly comment, though I don’t remember being scared of them as in they were bound to have it or discriminating. I know Eastenders had a storyline with Mark Fowler (?) with HIV where people in the pub wanted him to have his own pint glass and knife and fork. I also seem to remember people saying they wouldn’t swim in a public pool in case they caught it and similar. There was a lot of these kind of ideas from some people but most knew it was nonsense. HIV/AIDS was constantly talked about in TV, adverts, programmes, discussions on chat shows like Oprah and how it was going to spread. Basically if you slept with one person without a condom (or even with if you were unlucky) you were sleeping with every other person they had slept with too which to me was terrifying. Straight people I knew were not worried about gay people infecting them, rather each other. As to AIDS bringing about acceptance of homosexuality, I’m not sure about that. I lived in a quiet backwater at the time. I think gay musicians like Freddie Mercury (because he was amazing not AIDS) or hugely talented gay actors or presenters did a lot for acceptance. However I’m straight so that’s just my take on it.

Shaniac · 28/01/2021 17:32

Some right fucking nutters on this thread. Do people not realise 1980 was 40 years ago therefore its history and ofc younger people like me dont know much about it. Why would we its not a part of history thats taught in schools or routinely spoken about. This bloody forum exists for personal stories and conversations i have no idea why anyone would bloody take offence. How is it any different from "have you had covid" threads.

I didnt know about the mortgage thing. I really want to watch its a sin ive heard really good things about its accuracy.

Shaniac · 28/01/2021 17:33

Seems a bit of gay censorship going on on this thread. Posters adamant no one should give their personal experiences and instead op should google, read books or watch films some of us have never heard about. Fucking nuts.

JaneNorman · 28/01/2021 17:38

@SushiSoozie I’m not doubting what you are saying at all, but I’m wondering if different parts of society had hugely differing experiences. So the level of prejudice depended on what circles you were in. I’m just trying to reconcile what you’ve said with reports of, for example, men marrying and having a family and then years later coming out as gay. That doesn’t seem like the actions of people living in a tolerant society but maybe I’m over simplifying it.

OldPoster · 28/01/2021 17:51

I remember it and lived through it. I remember the ads on TV for condoms, the kind of ads that weren't shown before. I knew someone that was in one of those ads and he always denied it was him, just someone who looked like him, because he wasn't gay, just trying to make a living as an actor.

The extra thick condoms that appeared for sale, specially for anal sex soon after people realised it was predominantly affecting men.

I lost a friend to it, he was in a relationship with a well known band member and it was a wild time for gay guys, worldwide travel for concerts, parties. It was rife among the band members.

Piercings were popular and people worried about transfer via that, I remember the stuff about throwing cups, cutlery etc. away in case it was infected. Africans being blamed for spreading it because 'they thought that if they gave it to someone else they would be cured'. Drug users being blamed for spreading it. People were bewildered by it all.

My piercings were done by someone who died of it.He was so very careful. I remember cups and cutlery etc. being thrown away, seeing men with Karposi's Sarcoma and the abuse inflicted on homosexual and African men by those who had no idea about it, or were just obnoxious. I remember more information becoming available and HIV being mentioned rather than AIDS, and then treatment.

I am sure I have forgotten many things and will be reminded when I watch the TV series, which I only discovered last night.

SimonJT · 28/01/2021 17:56

@Shaniac

Seems a bit of gay censorship going on on this thread. Posters adamant no one should give their personal experiences and instead op should google, read books or watch films some of us have never heard about. Fucking nuts.
It isn’t the first it’s a sin thread that has been quickly been derailed by whataboutery and homophobia. Not a surprise.
ginandbearit · 28/01/2021 17:59

This is like a teeenager in 1980 asking about the Second World War and being told to piss off and watch World at War and read a few books...or someone who was there saying .."actually for some if us it was like this.."
Those of you being offended and projecting your outrage..yours is only one part of what is now a historical event...be protective about your personal history if you wish but also realise you're not old but an object of historical curiosity 😉

Frodont · 28/01/2021 18:00

@wowfudge

What you have stated is, frankly, bollocks. The AIDs epidemic was a major factor leading to being gay no longer being taboo. Only very ignorant/prejudiced people would think they could catch AIDs from a gay person. There was a lot of sympathy for those people whose health was ravaged by AIDs. There was a massive public health campaign at the time too.

This is yet another example of someone younger thinking the 70s and 80s were the dark ages. It wasn't.

Huh? Loads if people thought you could catch AIDS from a gay person. Yes ignorant but there were plenty of them.

Being gay wasn't illegal in the 80s but loitering in a public place and gross indecency were, which the police used to arrest gay men

OldPoster · 28/01/2021 18:00

@ginandbearit

This is like a teeenager in 1980 asking about the Second World War and being told to piss off and watch World at War and read a few books...or someone who was there saying .."actually for some if us it was like this.." Those of you being offended and projecting your outrage..yours is only one part of what is now a historical event...be protective about your personal history if you wish but also realise you're not old but an object of historical curiosity 😉
I am old Wink.
Frodont · 28/01/2021 18:01

@ginandbearit

This is like a teeenager in 1980 asking about the Second World War and being told to piss off and watch World at War and read a few books...or someone who was there saying .."actually for some if us it was like this.." Those of you being offended and projecting your outrage..yours is only one part of what is now a historical event...be protective about your personal history if you wish but also realise you're not old but an object of historical curiosity 😉
Yes I absolutely don't understand this attitude! I've enjoyed talking about it with my teens. I was 18 in 1984 and remember it all well.
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