All London schools now closed.

[stayingaliveisawayoflife]

Emergency meeting today agreed it. All boroughs left off now included.

@Babito

The ONS data would also suggest they are amongst the highest groups and on an upward trend

They need to sort that graph out with more distinct colours, there seems to be two black lines. But yes, the highest two groups both seem to be kids. Crazy.

@Babito

The ONS data would also suggest they are amongst the highest groups and on an upward trend

Babito thanks, you mentioned hospitalisation upward trend, do you have figures on this in particular?

@Wannabangbang

Fed up with London always getting their own way. Should have never been in Tier 2 now their kids get to stay safe but mine don't. Government only cares about its own place of residence

Oh, for goodness' sake! How old are you? You sound about 6.

It's obviously still early days and figures in children are still low in terms of hospital admission and cases but they are certainly rising at a rate they didn't in the previous wave/strain and who knows what that will lead to in a few weeks from now so I can see why the government may well choose to act with caution in a scenario like this until its more clear how this is going to play out.
Although I'm also more concerned at the fact they are acting at all !

@MarshaBradyo there have been various charts floating around across various sources on twitter.
I think theres a page longcovidkids on twitter who have been using the coronavirus data from the government website to produce visual charts but there is others out there as well on twitter doing the same

I'm also in Surrey. Our council has a rate of around 550/100,000 but it seems to have stabilised there for the last week or so. However my village, which is inside the M25 but not in London, has gone up today to 1,013/100,000 😳 There is definitely a good reason for treating some parts of tier 4 differently to others as rates are so variable, but I think they need to look wider than just London

@Babito

It's obviously still early days and figures in children are still low in terms of hospital admission and cases but they are certainly rising at a rate they didn't in the previous wave/strain and who knows what that will lead to in a few weeks from now so I can see why the government may well choose to act with caution in a scenario like this until its more clear how this is going to play out. Although I'm also more concerned at the fact they are acting at all !

This London matron is saying they have a whole ward of children compared to hardly any in the first wave twitter.com/bbc5live/status/1345006866829463552?s=20

Like you that the government has acted on this at all makes me worried.

@Babito

Maybe people might like to take a look behind the mainstream media at the scientific reports on this new strain the rise of it in children and also the worrying rise in hospital admissions of children in London. Its much better to take a cautious approach to this than start to have lots of very unwell children ! It used to be the case that children didn't seem to get infected as much by the virus and also didn't seem to get too unwell. There has been further studies into the new strain just starting to be published in the last couple of days that suggests higher viral loads etc....really its still too early to know what the impact on children will be never mind them spreading it to the rest of the population

Not seen anything about the new variant or hospital admissions that suggests this.

They have said that children and adults are equally likely to spread the new variant. What appears as a more rampant transmission shown my children in early data was because not much was open for adults in November lockdown.

There is a rise in younger patients but that is the 40-50 group from what I remember.

I will go try and find your information sounds like it contradicts that?

@Babito

It's obviously still early days and figures in children are still low in terms of hospital admission and cases but they are certainly rising at a rate they didn't in the previous wave/strain and who knows what that will lead to in a few weeks from now so I can see why the government may well choose to act with caution in a scenario like this until its more clear how this is going to play out. Although I'm also more concerned at the fact they are acting at all !

This London matron is saying they have a whole ward of children compared to hardly any in the first wave twitter.com/bbc5live/status/1345006866829463552?s=20

Like you that the government has acted on this at all makes me worried.

It's true though CallmeAngelina All i here about on the news is mostly London this, London that. There is more to the South East than just London. And if you feel i sound about 6, that's a compliment better than sounding like an old crow

www.imperial.ac.uk/news/211793/new-covid19-variant-growing-rapidly-england/

This is the latest from Imperial College London on the new strain as of yesterday afternoon. They have looked at various theories it would seem into the data and rises. All be it i've had a decent skim read of it but will take a more indepth look later this evening

@Babito

The ONS data would also suggest they are amongst the highest groups and on an upward trend

Where did you find this graph please?

*hear better remember to spell as I'm only 6

@Greensleeves90...I have no idea where I came across this to be perfectly honest. I saved it when I seen it. Probably ONS social media accounts tends to be where i look for the latest info so may well have been on there.

However the ONS website publishes weekly infection survery which shows the same albeit not in one single chart

This is the most up to date infection survery

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/conditionsanddiseases/bulletins/coronaviruscovid19infectionsurveypilot/24december2020

Another thread has just spun up citing these links.
I in the meantime have pinged some friends. One ICU dr responded. He has seen absolutely no evidence that this is in any way impacting children any more than the first wave.

The data on the new strain is still being interpreted.

What is known is that it is transmitted more easily (more infectious).

It is found in higher incidence in the 0-19 year groups.

That may be because schools are now the best transmission nexus (most other nodes and vectors having been closed down).

Or it may be something else.

Likewise, we don't know yet if children are more susceptible to this than the previous strain.

Lots of unknowns.

What we do know is that we have soaring rates in areas such as London and Kent and that current measures aren't doing enough to stop that.

We also have a government that is consistently behind events.

It's bloody worrying.

I have a CEV child our consultant is advising caution but as of yet where I am in the country the cases in children are rising but not the severity of the illness but it is something we will be watching closely

When I say 'susceptible' I mean 'catch it more easily'.

And I really do mean there just isn't data at the moment.

The far higher incidence amongst 0-19 year olds really may just be down to the fact it is more infectious, schools are the 'big' thing that is open, therefore you will find more incidence of this new virus amongst those who frequent schools.

At present, there appears to be nothing to suggest that this variant poses any greater a risk to children/younger people than the previous strain.

It's just that there's more of it, and it's spreading mainly amongst 0-19 more (probably because of schools).

But the data really is still being interpreted.

Having said all that, everything really does point to schools being a major factor in the transmission of a very infectious new strain of Covid, particularly in Lindon and the south-east.

Given that, it seems just bonkers not to try and do everything to create a firebreak.

It must seem very weird for those parts of the U.K. that aren't affected - but, likewise, from here in London it seems scarcely believable that elsewhere life is 'normal', without people around you testing positive. 🤷‍♀️

@CreamFacedLoon

Aah so it’s not safe for London Tier 4 primary children to go to school, but it’s fine for the rest of the Tier 4 children around the country to go in...

They need to either drop the other areas back to Tier 3 or raise London to Tier 5.

Isn't it more that London hospitals are overwhelmed rather than the govt placing more importance on Londoners than the rest of the country?

(And, yes, I know it's like this elsewhere - please don't jump on me.
I just mean that spread across the U.K. is very different, so experiences are very different. I inhabit one kind of reality and the one that now seems alien to me is where people are largely unaffected.)

With regards to primary schools and public transport, it is certainly true that for many, they walk their child to school then rush off to get public transport to work. In addition, many, including me, use the trains/tube to leave work and pick up our children from school. Even if it’s not the child travelling on public transport, certainly many parents do.

@JacobReesMogadishu

So what about non London tier 4 areas, some of who have very similar rates, even higher rates? Are those kids expendable?

I don't think the government particularly cares who does or doesn't get it, more that London hospitals are overwhelmed and full right now.

Aah so it’s not safe for London Tier 4 primary children to go to school, but it’s fine for the rest of the Tier 4 children around the country to go in...

All Tier 4 areas are not equal though. I have a friend living in a very low infection Tier 4 area. There's been 4 cases in her DC's secondary school all term. In my DC's similar size secondary school (a different Tier 4 area also not in London) we considered 4 cases a day to be a low incidence day by the end of term. Clearly these 2 areas may both be Tier 4, but are very different. It does make sense to treat them separately.

Re the definition of critical workers - I don’t think that is any wider than it was back in the first lockdown - there were plenty of parents who sent their children in as they had a tenuous link to one of the categories (including SAHMs married to bankers for example...). But in the summer term schools had to keep to bubble sizes of maximum 12 which obviously limited the places available - will there not be a similar limit this time round?

I live in one of the boroughs that were left off the original list. Within 2 hours our MP and the head of council had written to Gav with statistics and numbers of infected.

If you are unhappy write to your MP, they all have published email addresses.

I think they should all be closed.

I am the mother of a teacher and I have DGC of primary age, my DC will still go into work for keyworker children and to teach her class remotely.