Why is everyone referring to "Santa"

[WinWinnieTheWay]

DH and I (from different UK countries and different social class) were both brought up with Father Christmas. Why are so many people calling FC "Santa" these days? Is it just the impact of American culture? Each to their own, but I don't like it.

,Maybe, but I think most people who live in England consume more modern American culture than we do Scottish culture, for example.

Those signs, for example, that say "Santa stop here for xxxx", were they made in the uk? Perhaps they were!

[quote Dadaist]@midnightstar66 - yes - Catholicism survived in parts of north west scotland and pockets of England after the reformation. Liverpool is of course heavily influenced by Irish Catholicism. So essentially it’s not regional at all! Same also in Scotland. I’m suggesting that in essence - Santa Claus is more of a Catholic thing - Father Christmas is more of a UK Protestant thing and ‘Santa’ is more of a North American thing.

But regional differences in the UK might reflect religious history also?[/quote]
I live in Scotland and I’m also a UK Protestant and have always used Santa are you getting the UK and England mixed up ?

I think yes it’s possible that the Puritans and Presbyterian church may have been more zealous - and successful -(like Crowell briefly in England) in repressing Celtic and pagan traditions in Scotland than the Church of England was perhaps less intolerant. Possible also that ‘Father Christmas’ as a figure of feasting and winter merriment from medieval times was an English folklore name - but I’m pretty sure the same folklore persisted in Scotland, but perhaps with a named bringer of winter that didn’t survive? What I can say is that ‘Santa Claus’ became merged with much older Celtic folklore that already had the green man - there are etchings of him in Celtic churches that survived the reformation in England and Scotland.
So what I’m saying is that Scotland may have not successfully revived the Green Man - Father Christmas tradition - but is was certainly there before Santa Claus was established.

Adding nothing to the debate but who gorgeous is this card? Postcard style, postmarked 1902. Love it.

@RaspberryCoulis what a lovely picture of Santa thanks for sharing .

Scottish here and it’s always been Santa. I always imagined that kids who said Father Christmas were the ones who only had wooden toys, never got muddy, and weren’t allowed to watch Magpie or Tizwaz.

I was responding to Choli who believes using the name Father Christmas is entirely an affectation. I am arguing that it is not and Choli is wrong. I used the examples of the Raymond Briggs books but everyone has conveniently overlooked that.

What is wrong with using the word 'snobbish', why is it 'ghastly'?

Oh look, yet another of offensive post about children who refer to Father Christmas. ChaToilLeam, your imagination must be quite limited if you can't imagine people using a name that is different to your own experiences!

Seriously @Goldenbear if you aren't one of those then really no need to be so offended. Why are you taking it so personally if it does not apply to you, yet you are happy to make sweeping generalisations in the pusher direction!

This thread is comedy gold. I am especially liking the people with 'no accents' ( I think even sign language probably has an accent so no idea how these people communicate - through the medium of interperative dance, perhaps?).

I'm also loving the odd poster randomly popping in to decry Santa as an Americanism, having obviously felt their pearl of wisdom was so fresh and vital they didn't need to read a pages long thread to prevent themselves looking foolish.

Anyway, it has always been Santa for me - all the wee old ladies saying 'has Santa been good to you?' is a childhood memory - I don't think I have ever heard him called Father Christmas expect in books and on TV and in films.

A bit of googling reveals that Raymond Brigg's parents were working class, his Dad was a Milkman and his Mum was a lady's maid so why does he refer to Father Christmas, was he enormously insecure and wanting to raise his status, is that the whole reason for writing the book?or was it more because it was the terminology that was used where he grew up- Wimbledon! I'm thinking it is probably most likely to be the latter like many people who have being brought up in this region!

This thread is comedy gold.

Isn't it? 😂😂

@Goldenbear it’s an overrated book anyway .

Santa in Scotland could be explained by historic immigration of Flemish people into Scotland from 1100-1600 or thereabouts.

Been not 'being'.

Why do you mean the 'pusher' direction and what specifically have I said that is a sweeping generalisation, please enlighten me as I can't recall anything.

@ChaToilLeam

Scottish here and it’s always been Santa. I always imagined that kids who said Father Christmas were the ones who only had wooden toys, never got muddy, and weren’t allowed to watch Magpie or Tizwaz.

Quite.

I massively disagree Peppafrig!

What's 'Magpie', I think it may have been before my time?

Thinking more on Santa in Scotland. While the country isn't majority Catholic, the CoS went full on banning Christmas after the Reformation. So illicit celebrations carried on, and they would have stuck with the variation on St Nicholas. While it wasn't too long before Christmas was reinstated as a bank holiday etc, it wasn't given prominence by the Church of Scotland so there would be no reason for them to have Father Christmas - so Santa prevailed as our character of choice.

That's my theory anyway, based on what I know of our festive history.

@Goldenbear, just a thought; I think your main issue here is actually with the op, who originally brought class into the whole argument. She isn't the first by a long way. It comes up every year and posters usually say it's classier / naicer to say FC and Santa is the word of the commoners. You are absolutely right that it didn't start that way, but that is unfortunately what some people believe. So, yes, you will get social climber types going out of their way to sound naicer. This doesn't apply to you, so maybe you need to take a wee step back? Just a very gentle suggestion!

Never got muddy- how quaint, growing up in the London suburbs in the 80's 90's you had to worry about more than a bit of mud!

Someone wait up and ask him what he prefers.

@Audreyseyebrows

Someone wait up and ask him what he prefers.

I think he wouldn't mind so long as you weren't being a dick to other people about it

I know it does I've posted on here since 2006!

@Audreyseyebrows I know him I was kissing him under the mistletoe last Christmas Eve just text him and he said he is called Santa . I’ve got the text here as proof.