Peter Sutcliffe has died

[Ginfordinner]

I was a student in Leeds during his reign of terror. I won't mourn his death.

1.The police investigation was scandalously inept and resulted in the deaths of more women than would otherwise have been the case. They interviewed Sutcliffe eight or nine times

Yes the police did interview him many times, or rather made enquiries. I believe these interviews, as was usual, were informal and at his home address. They would have also interviewed, or spoken with, his wife...

The howling throng outside the court in Leeds at the time was truly medieval and utterly abhorrent and was the reason he could not be tried here.

Do you mean Dewsbury court? When he first appeared?

It was shown on the local news at the time. The crowd was shouting "die bastard die". Its on YouTube I think

He had been held at Dewsbury due to the safety and security of the cells there. People wanted to kill him. I don't blame them.

May it rot in pieces. It’s family can fuck right off too, I’ll save my compassion for people who don’t support serial killers, thanks, you fucking degenerate.

Aww, did the serial killer hear a noise that may have hurt its feelings on the way to court? So sad, let’s all weep for the poster who is pro serial killer, her heart must be breaking on this lovely day. What THE FUCK is wrong with you?!

I really recommend Somebody's Mother, Somebody's Daughter . It explores the lives of the women he murdered. Its restorative writing.

He certainly hurt and irretrievably damaged more women than the ones he was charged with killing. And these women were treated abysmally by the police, descriptions not believed, crimes downplayed. Even today it was reported that he killed "prostitutes" despite most of his victims not fitting that criteria. The victims families were let down by the most awful prejudices (of the time)

25 children left without mothers because of this man, and those poor women who lost their lives. Just horrendous. Good riddance to him.

The misogyny of the press and police was truly medieval and utterly abhorrent. His crimes were truly medieval and utterly abhorrent and the reason women were living in terror

I agree to some extent about the police and the press. There was uproar in one town in West Yorkshire over press coverage and front page photos at the time

But it wasn't just the police and press. It was a different age and set of standards for society as a whole. The police and press were a reflection of that. There's news footage from the time where local gossipy women were interviewed, and they also said things we wouldn't consider to be polite or correct now. It was a different age.

Rotting in hell for all eternity 😂😂😂 🎉🎉🎉🎉

It costs more to execute somebody than to keep them in prison for life

Good. Now we don't have to waste any more of taxpayers' money keeping this filthy creature in comfort any longer.

Here it is. The footage I mentioned of the first appearance in court, at Dewsbury

A pp has said the crowd at court were wrong, but living in the area at the time, I don't remember it like that. I remember that seeing the crowd on the news shouting "die bastard die' actually made me feel safe. It made me think, people care enough to shout this in the street. Such was the strength of feeling at the time and relief. The crowd shouting was reassuring

You can't hear the audio but the crowd are really shouting

@user1471565182

It costs more to execute somebody than to keep them in prison for life

How so ? Genuinely interested in this

@Flaxmeadow

Yes it was a different age and the public were of the attitude that the victims were only prostitutes, until they weren’t. I remember hearing people say he’s made a mistake Josephine Whitikar is not a prostitute, it was as blatant as that. The message being, prostitutes were not innocent women.

However the media and police would have taken the murders of these women more seriously, earlier had they not been prostitutes. He was murdering women every three months! The police also had reports of hammer attacks of the women who survived. The media gave him the notoriety of the ripper title conjuring up some sort of legend borrowed from a previous serial killer who was never caught, instilling greater fear into women.

Even last night in 2020 on some news programmes he was referred to as the ripper who killed prostitutes. He was Peter Sutcliffe, he killed women, he chose easier targets as his victims.

My comments that you highlighted need to be read in the context of my reply quoting the pp.

I see from this thread there are a lot of people who have not emerged from the dark ages

You disgust me

Wait... what?

You find people who are angered and repulsed by an individual who murdered at least 13 innocent women and brought fear, terror and grief to so many more reprehensible than the murderer himself?

You are ridiculous.

Can semmingly be up to ten times more expensive to execute

www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna29552692

Also theres the fact they can often do something productive to society whilst locked away

I think we can say with total certainty that Sutcliffe did nothing productive to society whilst locked away.

I read the story of Ms. McCann who he murdered first. It was terribly sad to read that she had apparently escaped an abusive husband with her children.

[quote BessieSurtees]@Flaxmeadow

Yes it was a different age and the public were of the attitude that the victims were only prostitutes, until they weren’t. I remember hearing people say he’s made a mistake Josephine Whitikar is not a prostitute, it was as blatant as that. The message being, prostitutes were not innocent women.

However the media and police would have taken the murders of these women more seriously, earlier had they not been prostitutes. He was murdering women every three months! The police also had reports of hammer attacks of the women who survived. The media gave him the notoriety of the ripper title conjuring up some sort of legend borrowed from a previous serial killer who was never caught, instilling greater fear into women.

Even last night in 2020 on some news programmes he was referred to as the ripper who killed prostitutes. He was Peter Sutcliffe, he killed women, he chose easier targets as his victims.

My comments that you highlighted need to be read in the context of my reply quoting the pp.[/quote]
Totally agree. Even yesterday the Fail were at it, nasty undertones othering the women who were prostitutes as less worthy victims than those who weren’t. Totally vile.

This is why Sutcliffe got away with it for so long because the victims were seen as less as they were prostitutes. Absolutely awful. Poor women.

Reading links from that article, it says 167 on death row in the US have been found not guilty since 1973. Obviously we dont know how many innocents they've put to death. Thats crazy.

If you read a lot of Sutcliffe's interviews and stuff, the fact some of them were working in the sex trade didnt really come into it mostly. He just found what he called 'likely victims' by them being alone walking at night generally. That aspect of it was almost entirely the media and Police's making.

As well as the misogyny and judgement, I was really horrified to hear some of the racist comments made by the police about Marcella Claxton, including ignoring her clear description of a white man with dark hair in favour of insisting her attacker must have been black. I hope Marcella has had a private apology from West Yorkshire Police.

I also don't know much about Sonia Sutcliffe but I got reading a few articles today and there is a lot of implication about her when I understand theres no evidence she ever knew a thing. It's as though a woman must be to blame somehow in some part.

@BessieSurtees

As I said, I agree with you too an extent but what has to be remembered is that Peter Sutcliffe was not the only man in West Yorkshire killing or maiming women, whether they were prostitutes or not.

The metropolitan county of West Yorkshire was/is an urban working class highly populated area, and it is also a very high crime area. The highest in the country for serious crime. It is now and it probably was back then. The police were also dealing with other extremely serious crimes, all the time. Meaning it took time for the police to understand that they were dealing with a serial killer and it took time to understand motives.

The suggestion that the police would not have cared as much, or failed to investigate as much, because a women was a prostitute I think is not always a fair summary. The police investigated all serious crimes and were duty bound to do so. It also has to be remembered that many female police officers also worked on the investigation.

Yes the WYP made mistakes, but to tar all police, or public as not "caring" because the women were prostitutes, and only caring when they weren't, is too much of a blanket statement for me. I lived in WY at the time and remember the news and TV coverage. The death of Helen Rykta in particular received fair and sympathetic coverage, especially as she was quite young. That's not to say they didn't care for women who were older, people did and especially for the children who were orphaned. Its just HR is one of the victims that stands out as being relatable to people back then in some way

If you read a lot of Sutcliffe's interviews and stuff, the fact some of them were working in the sex trade didnt really come into it mostly. He just found what he called 'likely victims' by them being alone walking at night generally. That aspect of it was almost entirely the media and Police's making

This is true and some of his early victims, who survived, were attacked away from urban and city centre areas, and nowhere near red light areas, but I'm not sure the police and media were wilfully ignoring that. As I said in a PP, the police and especially in such a high crime area as WY would not have been aware the cases were linked. That wasn't understood until later.

PS was using some of the busiest road networks in Europe and unfortunately this meant he was able to hide and cover his crimes within that. WY has a population of millions of people. Linking crimes across a huge urban area like this was not always that easy

I'm not excusing the behaviour of some police, but I'm just trying to explain the area. If he had been committing these crimes in a rural area, the crimes would have stood out more, been linked, and PS would have probably been noticed a lot earlier, especially on more rural roads at night.

PS was a lorry driver. Unfortunately he would have been very well aware of the road networks in WY and aware of how those roads were policed