Daughter being asked to move to Isle of Man, do I speak up?

[Beatief]

NC. You’ll no doubt see why! My daughter is about to have a baby to a man she has known for 10 months. They didn’t spend the pregnancy together, mostly due to lockdown and obviously they weren’t actually in a relationship. It turns out now, after a meeting last week, that he wants her to relocate to the Isle of Man. We live outside Birmingham, I’m about 45 mins from her. I want to make it clear that this is NOT about me, I’m retired, have money to travel and can visit whenever I want, if she does move. But I am worried for her. She doesn’t know what to do, he’s offering to help her, she can live there for free, he’s sending her photos of where he lives (she visited his place once during the month they were dating, so she knows of it). He’s encouraging her to give the relationship a go. He has his whole family there so an easy decision for him! He seems like a nice man but I find it very strange he is making this request of her.

She’s a teacher so she could get work I suppose but I worry for her. I’ve not put my voice forward yet and just left her to consider things. Would you say something? Should I keep out of it?

If he has a decent income and is Manx he likely works in the Offshore Wealth industry (what us folks call tax avoidance) which would explain his money and the fact he couldn't easily work from the mainland.

Not saying that makes it all ok, it's still a very tricky situation. If she's determined make sure she's well versed in all the red flags!

thats exactly my point she would be isolated no family and he could stop her leaving

That’s a good point.if she moves there, presumably the Isle of Man courts could make an order that the child should continue to live on the island which would mean she would have to as well. They could argue that was the child’s home and all he/she knows . If she stays where she is They can’t make that argument.

@Coffeesnob11

I would get her to check the laws before she moves there just in case she has the baby but wants to move back. I am just thinking if they split up would there be different rules on moving children off the island? She doesnt want to find herself stuck on the island with no family until the child is 18.

This.

I don’t know the full ins and out but my friends sister got stuck when the relationship broke down and she wanted to move back to the mainland because of the kids she had to stay until they were old enough.

You really need to tell. Your DD all this just so she is prepared.

If they were not in a relationship, whose child is it?

If she's happy to live there for the next 18 years, why not.

Because it'll be very difficult to leave without her child if it doesn't work out.

Speaking from experience, I would strongly advise that she stays near her support network. She can tell the father the Isle of Man isn't going anywhere, once she's had the baby and she's seen how he is with her and a newborn she can judge better about relocating then. It should definitely not be about his life and options - she's the vulnerable one at the moment, so it should be about hers. I moved to a new country with a newborn to an isolated area with a husband who travelled frequently. It was lonely and hard.

@Honeybobbin

Did your daughter post her side of this recently? Sounds incredibly familiar.

I thought that. I had a strange deja vu feeling reading this post.

So many red flags here, but I think all you can do is advise her to check the legal situation before she makes a decision. If he's well off and able to afford cleaner etc, then presumably he can afford to travel over here to visit her and try to build a relationship before she uproots her entire life to be with him?

I think she needs to separate out the IOM issue from whether she is prepared to move anywhere to build a new relationship with a newborn. Would she feel differently if he lived in Newcastle or Truro?

It's not just a relationship with him, is it? His entire family will be there, and presumably expect to be involved with her and the baby. That's a hell of a lot to cope with, especially if she doesn't really have a relationship with the father yet.

[quote RandomDent]Can she even move there at the moment?

covid19.gov.im/general-information/travel-advice/[/quote]
They've pretty much eradicated the virus on the Isle of Man and social distancing, indoor & outdoor restrictions etc. were lifted on 15th June, but the borders remain closed. However, exemption certificates are available in certain circumstances for people who wish to become permanent residents. She would have to quarantine for 14 days on arrival. I am currently looking to move there myself and would enter under a similar exemption.

She should wait until the baby is here and make some visits first. He really needs to be coming to her if he wants to make the relationship work. It sounds more like he wants her there because she is having his baby and not because he wants her and in the long term whilst understandable won't work. I would also be worried that she could go there then find it difficult to move away due to contact etc.

As long as she could easily return home again if things didn’t work out, I’d be inclined to give it a go. It’s the IoM, not Outer Mongolia. She’s on maternity leave anyway, so no need to burn bridges.

I feared 'I told you so' so much that I stayed in a bad relationship far longer than I should have

Same here, @Belle1983

My mum was/is great, but still tended to go down the "I told you so" route. She was right, but it made it very, very difficult for me to escape from an abusive relationship. I wish she had been a bit more gentle about it, as the OP seems to be.

Everything in me is screaming to tell her not to go. I gave birth far away from my family with a loving supportive husband and I found it incredibly difficult. I had no one while he was at work. I struggled immensely.
If the guy is financially supportive then he can be that without her moving. If she doesn’t really know him then no, god no, keep her with you.
If he truly wants the best for her and the baby then he won’t mind her staying where family can support her.

As soon as I found out i was pregnant with DS i made arrangements to move home to my mums. I couldn't imagine being away from my mum and having a newborn.
I probably couldn't have stayed in London and saved myself a big hassle with work etc. but it's so good to have a support network, i realised i had my aunts and nan and cousins to help out. DH's family live abroad so only had one family

If she moves there, has the baby , and the relationship fails ... then what?

Will she be forced to stay?
Will he pursue custody?
If she returns to the UK, will she have to pay for and facilitate his access to the baby?

She won't have the 'protection' of marriage, either.

I think she'd be mad to move, frankly. if he wants to see if there's a possibility of them working, he should move for the time being, no?

I would be quite anxious about this too but I wonder if it’s as good a time as any to give it a go. Could she go on maternity leave from her job for a year and if it doesn’t work out she still has her job to go back to. Maybe after a month or two living together it will be clearer one way or another.

My concern is that the IoM becomes the babies residence and if she moved back she would be responsible for the travel to facilitate contact or he could take out a prohibitive steps order against her moving back.

There are all sorts of alarm bells ringing really loudly here.

This man would be my worst nightmare, speaking as the mother of daughters in their 20s.

A quick search give this.

Note that if he has Parental Responsibility, she cannot remove the child from the island at all without his express consent.

If she moves there, the baby stays. Whatever she wants to do. Whatever happens to her whilst she's there. And they will enforce this.

If she leaves Birmingham will she have to pay back her maternity pay? Does she have a mortgage/tenancy agreement? Could she go stay fir a month during maternity and see if they have a future?

How would he react if she stays here, has the baby and doesn't put him on the birth certificate, all of which she is perfectly able to do.

If she doesn't name him here in the UK where the baby is born, he has few parental rights.

However, I don't know Manx law. Are there some sort of legal and financial advantages to him having a son born in IOM, and if so, what are they? He seems quite pushy for the baby to be born there, even though the relationship with the mother isn't a strong one.

MitziK's link is a good place to start.

She needs to be aware of all these types of things before she thinks of is brainwashed into joining him over there before the birth