Jehovah’s Witnesses

[Mixington]

Just found out that the tenants in one of our properties are JWs. They are super nice, lovely family and have always been a pleasure to deal with. We have met some two sets of friends of theirs too, in passing, who also seemed really lovely too. All JW too it turns out, active members going to meetings serveral times a week etc. All run cleaning or window cleaning businesses which I was intrigued to find out is very common for JW.

A girl at school was also JW, she was really funny, cool, nice, bright, but somewhat removed from everyone else - ie didn’t socialize with us outside of school, was a bit of a floater with friend groups, didn’t join in with the usual Christmas and birthday stuff. I recall various brief teenage style basic conversations about it and we all just kind of shrugged and accepted it... Then I had read up on JW as an adult ago so looking back it all made sense.

This new info of our tenants being JW has made me curious again about it.

Now, overall I take the approach of live and let live. I have zero religion in my life but have often thought the community side of it must be great and that in times of need I can see any religion could offer comfort.

That being said, from what I’ve read about JW, it feels to be more of a sect or cult, with pretty strong rules and beliefs, with the potential for significant emotional and psychological repercussions. It just seems so severe and I’m struggling with reconciling these lovely people with such an extreme organization.

Clearly it’s not mutually exclusive to be a nice person and a JW. That is not my point. But I can’t get my head around these people believing in Armageddon and The Truth and “shunning bad associations” etc etc. They seem so normal yet I can only assume they are totally indoctrinated given they are still clearly active JWs.

I know that in most day to day interactions people don’t preach their beliefs, it just doesn’t come up in conversation.. but with something like JW that is seemingly quite strict, I am fascinated to think that these people who are really cool/normal/nice have this massive thing going on in their life and probably hold quite strong views which Judy colour the way they look at the world.

I found the past AMA in here and other articles on JW so interesting, and distressing in places (lack of blood transfusions, child abuse, domestic violence) though obviously horrid stuff can take place anywhere religion or not.

So I don’t know why I’m posting really. I guess I’m totally intrigued by this way of life and trying to understand how it fits in with or views the rest of society? Do they think I’m awful because I don’t live in The Truth? Are there different shades of joe much you can join in or follow as a JW? Or is it all or nothing? Do these people I know want to convert me? Do they talk about Armageddon with their kids like it’s a normal piece of life? So fascinating......

@AnnieOH1 that’s an outstanding post up there thank you.

@RJnomore1 - Thank you kindly, once I started I couldn't stop. It's very interesting that as soon as the thread started attracting condemnation and evidences were being shown, that JW101 bowed out isn't it?! =)

My dh was raised as a Jehovah’s Witness. It really is a cult and members are encouraged to shun family and friends who leave the religion. Most of dhs family had passed away by the time he left so this didn’t really effect him but his ex wife also left and her large family won’t have anything to do with her. Not only her but they won’t see my step son or dhs exes son from a new relationship. I don’t understand how a parent can cut off their children or grandchildren.

Kali last
That is quite some story and I’m pleased you are here today to tell it.
My next door neighbours are JW
They seem nice
For now.

Kalula

kalula. I firmly believe the allowing blood fractions, the cake ingredients, but not the cake, is to prevent the many, many families who have lost family to death from suing them. They will never admit they were wrong because of this but give their members ‘an out’

I used to think they were all lovely people trying their best to save people. However watch The Witnesses on netflix, JWs are INSTRUCTED to not report paedophiles, how elders question young girls, how the girls are shunned and how paedophiles can be involved in the church again after proving themselves good JWs for a short time. They have also withheld the records of the abuse on individuals from law enforcement. Since then I can not look at the religion in the same way.

Regarding blood there are many alternatives to blood transfusions, many of them. If you said I can't take ibuprofen but I can take paracetamol it's an alternative right. So why can't we choose an alternative in this day and age we have that choice it's true and as we understand more and more about medical things

My problem is that you do not make an informed choice. You are told that the alternatives are just as good, that people who have refused blood have recovered and done better than they would with blood.

This is not true.

Obtaining a supply of blood is expensive and time consuming, if the alternatives did the job then blood would be dropped in a heart beat.

Also you are allowed 'fractions' of blood, how does that make sense?

You get baptized when you are ready a young person should never unless they alone are convinced it's right for them.

Yeah right. So no pre teens baptized at conventions then? How about the governing body suggesting you withhold driving lessons until after baptism.

"If you want to know more about us JW.org will tell you the facts about us,"
@JW101

Ok then.

wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/201992326
A doctor may claim that blood will ‘make things go well’ for your sick child, but you must be firmly resolved before any emergency comes up to refuse blood for yourself and your children, valuing your relationship with Jehovah as higher than any alleged extension of life that would involve breaking his divine law. Favor with God now and everlasting life in the future are involved!

So, following the religion's rules is more important than the life of your child. Nothing cultish about that.

wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1102008130
Of course, some claim that there’s no point in doing all this, that you should simply ‘embrace your sexuality’ and ‘accept who you are.’ But the Bible says that you can do better than that! It tells us, for example, that some early Christians who had formerly practiced homosexuality changed. (1 Corinthians 6:9-11) You too can win the battle—even if at this point it’s only being waged in your heart.

It's wrong to be gay and you should try to change your sexuality. A great message to give to teenagers.

www.jw.org/en/library/books/gods-love/disfellowshipped-person/
Is strict avoidance really necessary? Yes, for several reasons. First, it is a matter of loyalty to God and his Word. We obey Jehovah not only when it is convenient but also when doing so presents real challenges. Love for God moves us to obey all his commandments, recognizing that he is just and loving and that his laws promote the greatest good.

If someone breaks these ridiculous rules, shun them. Stopping members having contact with loved ones who have left the organisation is cult 101.

All religions are cults. JWs are no worse than mainstream Christian's, Muslims or Jews.

At least they are open about their 'club rules'

All those 'modern' Christians who think because they accept everyone and play dreadful rock music that makes them less of a cult - wise up.

For those at the top it's still all about getting followers and making money and control !

JW are worse. They purposely isolate their chosen victim from family.

First hand experience with a family member who saw through it after a miserable decade.

My cleaner and her husband (also a cleaner) are ex JWs, they are both cleaners because they were denied an education. They have both gone on to study GCSE, A-level and my cleaner starts a degree this year.

They had always intended to leave, she was baptised when she was 11, she left when she was 16. She met her husband at a support group for ex JWs. She was shunned by her family when she left, they also regularly sent her abusive letters as did other members that her family knew.

Cults are dangerous, they prey on vulnerable and desperate people.

I am a militant atheist with no time for any religion, be it Islam, Judaism, christianity or any other deluded cult. That doesn't mean people who are involved can't be nice people. A lot of followers ignore the more extreme parts of their religion because they know it is morally unacceptable. Most Christians for example would condemn slavery, child sacrifice and genocide, despite all these things being advocated by the bible. Secular morality is demonstrably superior to the command 'morality' of holy books and even religious followers are swayed by it, hence the tap dancing around the point they will do when confronted by the awful logic of their 'holy' book.

@JW101 I don't usually write online by the way because people can write a lot of untruths or misinformation. But because of covid we haven't been able to go on our usual ministry.

Ha! I knew it! Reading your earlier posts I thought oh my god she's trying to convert us! And there it is.

I know someone who left the cult church and the whole thing is highly suspect and totally a cult. It's a cult because if someone leaves you aren't allowed to have them around. Human leaders or not makes no difference. Scientology is a cult and they have no live human leader. Why do you want to live like this? It's an awful business being stuck in a controlling religion. No one loves you if they could just cast you out the minute you step out of line. That's just ruthless and calculated not 'gods love'

@Brahumbug

I am a militant atheist with no time for any religion, be it Islam, Judaism, christianity or any other deluded cult. That doesn't mean people who are involved can't be nice people. A lot of followers ignore the more extreme parts of their religion because they know it is morally unacceptable. Most Christians for example would condemn slavery, child sacrifice and genocide, despite all these things being advocated by the bible. Secular morality is demonstrably superior to the command 'morality' of holy books and even religious followers are swayed by it, hence the tap dancing around the point they will do when confronted by the awful logic of their 'holy' book.

I'll join you on the atheist thing. Mil is a JW - she converted about 40 years ago - Fil had no interest in religion. She is a lovely woman - she's not tried to convert the kids - been totally respectful of my non religious views, my blood transfusion, my frequent blaspheming. She's attended the kid's birthday parties - she won't wish them a happy birthday but she'll be there. Attended dh's birthday party...she says they have people who take things too far in their congregation but in general she's happy in her beliefs and none of the rest of us are too concerned about it. I do enjoy a good debate with her over our differing beliefs but it's all good natured.

Actually, the bible doesn't advocate slavery, child sacrifice and genocide. It says over and over again that child sacrifice is abhorrent, because of free will, people in the bible used to keep slaves. This was against God's will because superiority over others in this sense is a sin. Therefore, God/Jesus advocated for slaves to be treat justly and prophesied the end of slavery. It is taking a long time to end slavery because humans are far from perfect and we are dragging our feet even now. But the church in general currently donates a lot of money to charities trying to stop slavery. Saying that 'they didn't spare anyone who breathed' or 'until there was none of them left' could have been the biblical equivalent of a 21st century football team saying that 'they slaughtered the other team' They didn't slaughter them as such but they defeated them, had victory over them etc etc.

I have a JW friend and cannot stand her talking about blood transfusions. She insists there is a better way but our doctors "won't listen". She says JW have come up with a cheaper, better alternative to blood. It's bollocks! Would the NHS not be delighted to have a better solution to blood transfusions that didn't rely on people giving blood and saved more lives? It worries me that she believes this shit and would deny her children s transfusion if needed.

@Mmmmdanone

That is probably my biggest reason for not liking JW. Although I believe that British hospital staff can override JW parent's wishes on blood transfusions now?

purpledaisychain I hope so.

My first job out of uni was for a company where the whole board of directors, and a significant number of the senior staff snd sales team were JWs. Was an odd experience and they treated their staff like shit. Was expected to work long hours for very poor money. Very strict on office behaviour. Strange bunch of people.

I had two Christmases working there and obviously there were no decs or cards allowed up on desks. I couldn't wait to leave and was out like a shot when another job came along.

But the most random thing about it was that their main product range was greetings cards. Obv not birthday or Christmas cards, but cards nonetheless.

Although I believe that British hospital staff can override JW parent's wishes on blood transfusions now?

The hospital has to go to court.

Actually, the bible doesn't advocate slavery, child sacrifice and genocide.

Yes it does.

I knew a JW family growing up. The mum's family had actually been doorstep brainwashed. That alone boggles my mind!

I know one of the sons at least is now part of some other bonkers new age Christian OTT Church. I just think that, for whatever reasonable, JW and other cult (religion) members are just weirdly susceptible to believing bullshit 😂

We had a lovely JW family at work. Their severely needle phobia child had to have extra cannulas to have iron infusions. Because he'd had major spinal surgery without blood or cell saver. He's recovery would have been hugely better if he'd had a unit of blood immediately post op.

@Toddlerteaplease

We had a lovely JW family at work. Their severely needle phobia child had to have extra cannulas to have iron infusions. Because he'd had major spinal surgery without blood or cell saver. He's recovery would have been hugely better if he'd had a unit of blood immediately post op.

That sounds like child abuse to me.

I think the ward staff really struggled with the situation. Because we felt it was cruel. The surgeons had a court order in place to give blood if his life depended on it, and mum had agreed with that.
The JW liaison man was around an awful lot. At first I thought it was because they were just being supportive, but then wondered if it was more of a control thing.