I didn't get the job but I'm expected to train successful applicant

[Toblerone345]

I recently applied for a job at my current place of work. It's a grade above me and since the previous job holder left I've been doing that role without any extra pay until they could find a replacement. I applied for the job but unfortunately I wasn't successful, despite doing the role currently alongside my actual role. Apparently they know I can do the job well as I'm already doing it, but someone else (without experience) got the job instead as they gave better examples in the interview.

Until the new joiner starts in a month or so, I'm expected to continue to do this role (none of the duties are in my job description) without extra pay. I'm then expected to train the new starter to do a job that I'm apparently not qualified for.

Does anyone know if I can be fired/disciplined for refusing to do this?

What a shit situation.

I like @FlamedToACrisps advice.

I've been in this situation, and left as soon as I could afterwards. I would advise doing the same, as you're clearly not respected there. I also agree with the poster who said to point out that if you're not qualified for the job, you're not qualified to train someone else in it!

The problem with basing everything on interview is that you will always end up with someone who is good at being interviewed. Which is excellent if you are looking for a panellist for Newsnight but not necessarily so great if you are looking for a computer programmer.

My husband is a computer programmer and does significant amounts of recruitment. After a few (very expensive) he has insisted on putting a technical test as part of the interview. Apparently it is amazing how many people seem brilliant in interview and then don’t seem able to switch the computer on. What is even more amazing is how often his (non technical) boss still wants to appoint Mr Can’t-Code after he’s crashed out of the test on the grounds of his excellent interview!

Oh OP I am so sorry to hear you are unwell and need to take a couple of weeks off around that time. Hopefully you'll perk up enough for day one at a new place.

Not sure who your work fucked over more there zaphod, your team or the unsuspecting woman they gave the job to! Completely ridiculous expectation of theirs.

Unfortunately that’s how interviews are conducted these days. Whilst the new person isn’t experienced, they may still have transferable skills, otherwise they wouldn’t have been shortlisted.

Still a shitty thing to happen though.

Interviewing where you already work is also quite hard, and not always the leg-up people think it is. On the one hand you're a known quantity, but because of that it's much harder to be really dazzling or claim you'll transform the place (because why haven't you already?). While some people would always favour the 'safe', known option others are very drawn to the new. Also, some sectors/employers fetish those from outside it, which obviously favours the external candidates - I've seen some really crap people get public sector jobs because don't you know they have business experience, swoon.

Definitely don't take it out on the new person, and don't be tempted to take time off sick. I'd approach your management in a really pleasant and friendly manner, and explain that as they don't believe you're equipped to fulfil the role, it has made you question your own suitability to train up the inexperienced successful candidate,. You feel it would be best for the organisation that they either train them themselves, or find someone better placed to pass on relevant workplace learning. Thank them for the opportunity you have had to take on the role in the short term, and you look forward to getting back to your usual role and consolidating your position there.
Overt politeness is much harder for them to challenge than if you were awkward and difficult. Be so good at your usual job that they look like the shi**s they are.
If in 6 months it's intolerable. move on.
I've been there and I feel your pain, I just smile and nod, work hard, and remember that 'No' is a complete sentence.
Good luck!

Bad luck, OP. It's a shit interview process that puts more weight on who can talk the talk rather than the one who is walking the walk.

Why are you doing so much overtime? If you're not getting paid for it, why are you expected to do it? Is it that the company is in danger of going under or something? (I mean if you're in an "all hands on deck to stop the ship sinking"? or is it just that they had a shit recruiting policy between the pevious incumbent and the next?)

TBH it would be unprofessional not to do the training. However since you can't be promoted i don't think it would be completely unreasonable for you to ask which tasks you should prioritise and which you should drop since you can't do the 2 jobs in your normal hours.

And look for another job

I think part of the problem my colleague had with me is that my boss really loves my (technically irrelevant) background/former career - and I can see why it annoyed my colleague because it really isn't more use in the job than her experience (again, though, not my fault!)

Its always upsetting to not get a job you wanted but it wasn't because you couldn't do the job, it was because another candidate performed better on the day. In fact if they had not picked the best candidate for the job they would have discriminating against the other person.

Experience is not always a pivotal reason to hire someone, it can often be gained easily. Potential can be more important, a fresh perspective from outside the company and all sorts of other reasons.
Also if they had promoted you then they would have to do another round of recruiting to fill the space you left.

Best just train up the new person so you get a good reference and start looking for a new job. Although in the middle of a recession that might not be the best move.

Your reaction does sort of hint that you felt you were entitled to the position, which doesn't go down well in interviews.

Do not train a new starter, as this is insulting, when you have been going over and above. Are you in a trade union? If not, consider joining GMB now, it's £7.83 per month for part time workers, not sure how much it is for a full time worker, but you need a trade union's backing to help you sort this. Best wishes to you

Just say you would like to step down and resume your normal duties.

You sound quite poorly to me. I'd say it would hit you full force the day the new starter commences. Two can play at this game.

I had this happen to me. I applied for my managers position as she had left and i had been doing both roles. They turned me down and gave it to someome who the director at that time was shagging in another department and she had handed her notice in to leave and he didnt want her to. She was fucking useless and i was expected to train her. 2 weeks later i got a new job. I gave my one weeks notice (as they had never updated my contract) and said im taking my holiday and left that day. She gave it a go but left 2 months later. I still get annoyed about it now.

Also - if you do the training, start making a job manual now.
For every process, every single keystroke. Make the manual of how to do Toblerone's Acting Up Job with screenshots, troubleshooting guide and lists of contacts etc. All relevant information.
Write up a list of what you need to train the person to do and make a spreadsheet of your training.
When they have learned one thing - both sign off on it. Both of you should only sign when you are confident they know what they are doing.
Have 2 copies of this - one for you and one for the trainee. Sign both in original.

When you have finished you can say "if you need help, etc, i'm here" but you can say it in such a way that you don't really mean it and they know it.

Good luck

I meant to add. Id find a new job the relationship would be over for me

I know it’s galling to be asked to train her, but you could argue this is a very fair way of recruiting.

You could, but I would argue that it's a terrible way of recruiting as well. All it tests is how good that candidate is at coming up with examples in an interview, which will often have little correlation with how good they will be at the job.

I will never understand why job interviews aren't based on a practical test, giving the candidates a task of the kind they would need to do in the job. I do this, and it's amazing that nearly everybody who interviews well bombs my test (editing a document, for a writing/editing role) and nearly everybody who aces the test gives a mediocre interview.

I've never regretted hiring the people who ace the test.

The very first job I got was because they set a practical test (statistics) and most people couldn't do it, just as well as I don't think I interview well!

Out of interest, why does this happen so frequently? What is the reason for it? Happens a lot in academia as well to well-qualified, known and liked part-timers who apply for a proper tenure track job and don't get it. I think it's the "Ooh, new shiny thing" mentality that leads people to devalue the people they do know in favor of an exciting unknown quantity

@Mumoftwoyoungkids haha yeah we had that issue somewhere I worked nearly 20 years ago. The guy who insisted on the technical test (and kept getting overruled) is I think the head of engineering at Facebook now, so go figure!

No way would I do this, they're taking the piss, you are worth much better.
Either refuse, go on sick, or walk out but ffs don't do this to yourself.

I'd call in sick too, it's a real dick move.

I'd be looking for a new job tbh. That's really awful of your employer

I have interviewed a fair few people who haven't been successful at getting the job they have been temporarily acting up in (although you get additional pay here if you are doing the job in the interim and whilst handing over/training). They just performed terribly at interview, when they should in theory have a headstart at knowing what we are looking for, and we can't just override that performance at interview to say you can have the job anyway. It's not that uncommon, most people do progress fairly quickly after by using the experience gained by training and acting up as examples in subsequent interviews,

Good grief. Don't you want the person who can actually do the job the best, rather than the person who can do a fucking interview?

THIS is why I became self employed, and I have only small businesses as clients. I won't touch large companies with a barge pole, not even the small divisions of large corporations.