Talk me through this - male on placement with brownies

[nevernotstruggling]

The dds have been to the same brownie unit for around 4 years (dd1 waiting to move up to guides). I know the leaders quite well and there has been one staff changeover in that time. The communication with parents has been excellent. I have felt safe letting the dds go on sleepovers knowing that I know all the adults involved. It's actually been brilliant in terms of safeguarding. No surprises or anything parents haven't been informed of. The dds love it. Dd2 is thriving there because it's a small closed group where she feels safe and familiar.

I dropped the dds off this week and a man came up to dd1 touches her shoulder and said 'you're it' I said to brown owl - who is that?? She replied oh it's Dave (not his name obvs). Me - who is Dave??? BO - he's on work placement (something about youth work) . Me - Er is he DBS checked?? BO- yes. Me- Brownies is a girls group!! BO - we have dads helping! No they don't. Not once the whole time we have attended.

Apparently Dave will be there for 4 weeks.

My reaction has been negative. I'm quite annoyed there was no warning of Dave jointing the unit. There have never been 'work placements' before. I think it was be something to do with the church though.

I think parents should have been told. They use a private Facebook group to keep in touch with parents and this works really well so I'm a bit baffled by the surprise!

Surely asking if dbs checks have been done gives you an indication as to weather the situation is “official” or it’s a casual arrangement?

We have a DBS System for a reason, and OP is entitled to ask if it is being used

I wonder if the OP has asked this of ALL volunteers...both male and female?

If he is DBS checked it is no issue at all.

I think it’s fine to ask and we shouldn’t be making it feel uncomfortable for carers to do that.

What you're not getting though is why is she asking in the first place?
Is it just because he's male, that's all she's basing "need to check" on?
As that's not OK.

I think it’s fine to ask and we shouldn’t be making it feel uncomfortable for carers to do that.
Of course, and most organisations will promote that fact that staff/volunteers are checked.
However, if this question is being asked then it should be asked of everyone ...no tjust the men.

I've always worked in jobs that require CRB/DBS checks. I have complained about people and organisations that only ask this question about my male staff/students.

More asking is better than less.

More asking is better than less

The EVERYONE should be asked. Not just men. Surely you agree with that?

I don’t think people should worry about appearing sexist when it concerns their children’s safety.

I don’t think people should worry about appearing sexist when it concerns their children’s safety

He hasn't done anything though to warrant people wanting to keep their children safe, why can't you see that?!

This post is ridiculous. Yes girls should have more male role models, more male primary school teachers and all, pleas edo not be one of those people who think all males are a risk

I don’t think people should worry about appearing sexist when it concerns their children’s safety

You do know women can pose a risk too?
So you think it's acceptable to just ask men if they have a DBS check? If a DBS check is required then we should ask anyone who has unsupervised access to children. That is best practice.

I recently made a huge fuss at a school for only asking my male students for their DBS but not my female students. It's not the first time and won't be the last but i'll complain every, single time.

You do know women can pose a risk too?

Precisely. I was reading over the weekend about a female drama teacher currently on trial for allegedly grooming an under age girl.

And op et al weren't just asking if this man was dvd checked - apparently he's weird because he's helping out at brownies, clearly high risk because he touched a girl on the shoulder (perish the thought), and all parents should have been ore warned of his very existence. So, it's not just asking about a DBS check at all is it?

Exactly hear
I train people to work in a female dominated profession and we experience this issue regularly. Part of my job is to encourage more men to enter the profession but there are times when I don't blame them for not being interested.

I also have a couple of male friends who teach dance and there have been cases of parents not sending their children to their school because they have a male teacher. This is despite them being some of the best teachers/dancers in the world and fully au fait with safeguarding ( both primary school teachers too)....not to mention that there have been some instances of female teachers abusing kids yet they don't seem to struggle to recruit. It baffles me.

A DBS does not just include sexual offences against children, it includes your whole criminal record, so why wouldn't you ask whether a female helper had one too, as they could have committed some offences which would mean you wouldn't want them round your DDs.

DBS also only shows what people have been found guilty of. Just because someone (Male or female) has a clear dbs doesn’t mean that they don’t potentially pose a danger. I think some people put way too much faith in the dbs system

A DBS does not just include sexual offences against children, it includes your whole criminal record, so why wouldn't you ask whether a female helper had one too, as they could have committed some offences which would mean you wouldn't want them round your DDs.

Exactly. And if it did show sexual offences then it is unlikely they would be accepted as a volunteer anyway.

This is why I handed back my Tawny Owl badge. This is the utter batshittery the volunteers have to put up with. It just wasn't worth my time.

The distrust of men on this thread is ridiculous. Are you all men hating feminists?

This is why I like Chat and AIBU.
It's like a breath of fresh air as opposed to the Feminism Chat board, you breathe a sigh of relief when you emerge out here and you realise that most people are actually rational, still have common sense and call out utter batshittery as opposed to all egging each other on and making each other more and more paranoid! (Not aimed at anyone in particular, just an observation I've made lol)

I don’t think half the hysteria described is even said. There isn’t a female volunteer in this situation. So how do we know it would or wouldn’t be asked? There seems to be an on going suggestion that carers shouldn’t ask in case it’s sexist, makes the volunteer uncomfortable, or even that because they are volunteering carers should just be grateful that they give their time.

DBS also only shows what people have been found guilty of. Just because someone (Male or female) has a clear dbs doesn’t mean that they don’t potentially pose a danger. I think some people put way too much faith in the dbs system
I think you’ll find in guiding even with a dbs check you wouldn’t be left alone with children as a helper because everyone knows it’s not fool proof already.

It was pretty obvious in the OP that she was questioning DBS etc. because the volunteer was male

So would you rather people voiced their concerns or not? If only males are asked about would you prefer people not ask at all?
I would prefer we just let parents voice their concerns. In fact I think we should encourage it.

WHAT concern though?!
Sorry for shouting but FFS lol