Talk me through this - male on placement with brownies

[nevernotstruggling]

The dds have been to the same brownie unit for around 4 years (dd1 waiting to move up to guides). I know the leaders quite well and there has been one staff changeover in that time. The communication with parents has been excellent. I have felt safe letting the dds go on sleepovers knowing that I know all the adults involved. It's actually been brilliant in terms of safeguarding. No surprises or anything parents haven't been informed of. The dds love it. Dd2 is thriving there because it's a small closed group where she feels safe and familiar.

I dropped the dds off this week and a man came up to dd1 touches her shoulder and said 'you're it' I said to brown owl - who is that?? She replied oh it's Dave (not his name obvs). Me - who is Dave??? BO - he's on work placement (something about youth work) . Me - Er is he DBS checked?? BO- yes. Me- Brownies is a girls group!! BO - we have dads helping! No they don't. Not once the whole time we have attended.

Apparently Dave will be there for 4 weeks.

My reaction has been negative. I'm quite annoyed there was no warning of Dave jointing the unit. There have never been 'work placements' before. I think it was be something to do with the church though.

I think parents should have been told. They use a private Facebook group to keep in touch with parents and this works really well so I'm a bit baffled by the surprise!

This is a WTF thread. Are all men evil. Don’t be fucking ridiculous.

And if you’re so worried get yourself down and fucking volunteer.

There absolutely are women who abuse children. Arguing it’s impossible for women to pose a threat is silly.

Regardless - playing chase in church hall isn’t likely to provide any opportunity for abuse.

I teach in an all girl's school, we have male trainees on placement, should parents be informed first ?

gamer of course my fear of being dropped off, team games & strange men was an extreme reaction, that’s why it was so hard, but not uncommon and I think adults volunteering with children should be able to empathise with children, and not assume that everyone is the same.

Monkey - do they run up and ‘tag’ some of the girls as they enter the classroom in their first lesson?

We have PE students who obviously will play games in lessons.

OP was your daughter uncomfortable with the shoulder tap as an invite to play? I'm wondering if there was non verbal communication before that between them. Maybe he was being very empathic and she'd non verbally communicated that she'd like to be in on the game?

of course my fear of being dropped off, team games & strange men was an extreme reaction, that’s why it was so hard, but not uncommon and I think adults volunteering with children should be able to empathise with children, and not assume that everyone is the same.

If the adult KNOWS about a chid's problems, of course they should empathise and adapt. But you can't have every teacher and group leader/volunteer treating every child as if they might possibly have every variety of hang up.

absolutely unreasonable!
If it had been a female work placement would you be reacting this way? Dave could have links to anyone of the current group leaders - nephew/dss etc.
He has been DBS checked. End of

Many many years ago when it really wasn't a 'thing' my ExH helped at our dds Brownie group and Scouts after that (who traditionally have a female Arkala! I wonder if those parents are equally as reactive!

I wonder what Dave’s up to now - probably sitting eating his shreddies blissfully unaware he’s the subject of a Mumsnet bunfight.

Would your dh and son want to lead brownies though?
If your a GG leader then yes they probably would.

Men are a threat. They are always some ones son, husband or brother.

Yes take heed anyone considering marrying a man and do the sensible thing and kill your boy children or accept the consequences.

In full agreement with your post, myplate, except I think this

Dave could have links to anyone of the current group leaders - nephew/dss etc

is a bit dangerous. Assuming that a person isn't a risk because they know the child, or another member of the group, would let a lot of abusers off the hook. In terms of risk, everybody needs to be treated the same, regardless of who or what they know.

I wonder what Dave’s up to now - probably sitting eating his shreddies blissfully unaware he’s the subject of a Mumsnet bunfight.
I hope he's having a lovely day

I do too. I love this being called a 'bunfight'

I want to give Dave a hug.

I hope his mum wouldn't freak out.

It’s the 21st century!! Imagine the outrage if someone was unhappy with a woman volunteering at beavers or scouts or whatever the boy equivalent is.

Would your dh and son want to lead brownies though?
What a bloody ridiculous statement.
It's attitudes like this which stop men entering female dominated professions.

Monkey - in lessons as part of a lesson, not unexpectedly. And presumably with an ‘is it ok if I...’ if touching is involved.

Anyone having done a safeguarding course will know there are many different forms of abuse, many of which women are capable of carrying out. So should we not have any children's activities as we can't trust any of the leaders/coaches etc?

Sara- and while you hug him you could remind him that safeguarding is about protecting himself too, and to think carefully about any touching in order to avoid future accusations, and that maybe playing tag with little girls is potentially opening himself up to problems.

He tapped her on the shoulder, that was it

This thread has be interesting in ways I can't get my head around. I see lots of straw man practice right here 😂.

And the Maude Flanders hand wringing has also been excellent.

Are you actually saying men and women are an equal threat to children?

I’d say it’s about equal. Child murders of under 18s are 54% done by women, and 46% done by men according to a study of 33 countries by the BMJ in 2017.