Am I really going to have to fight for 3rd c section?

[Connie222]

Just had my booking appointment and was told that my chances of being granted a 3rd section are almost non existent as the hospital and consultants are pro vbac.

Both my previous sections were elective and I had to fight tooth and nail for them (my preference). I just don’t know if I’ve got the fight in me again (different hospital this time in a different area 200 miles away).

The pregnancy had been awful so far and I can’t take the thought of being made to have a birth against my consent, I’m honestly thinking of terminating.

It really doesn't matter what her reasons are. The fact is she is 2 sections in which comes with medical risks now that can be managed with vaginal birth.

*cannot be managed.

That's ridiculous. I'm all in favour of vaginal births (for me personally, I wouldn't dream of commenting on anyone elses) but a successful vba2c is very unusual I think. I had 3 vaginal births and then 2 c-sections. The registrar who did it and also 2 midwives said that although they couldn't force me to have a c-section, they would strongly recommend I have a c-section if I have another baby.

There is no way I am doing this again but if I did, I would be choosing a c-section, despite much preferring my vaginal births. I am shocked that someone who has had 2 c-sections is being encouraged to have a vbac.

I’ve not emotionally blackmailed anyone and nor would I.

I did have personal reasons for the 1st one. Too personal to disclose. I tried to during my first pregnancy and I was brushed off with “lots of women have gone though that” which meant I had to fight.

I won’t disclose that again nor will I be blackmailing anyone.

WHAT is going on on this thread?

The woman is going to create and deliver another human being from her body. She can do that however she fucking wants.

The concepts of too posh to push, vbac is best for baby, why do you think the NHS should give you a c-sec are so backwards and formed from patriarchal bullshit. The UK is so behind in this area. And you can bet your ass that if men gave birth there'd be c-secs all round if wanted.

OP has a choice and is well within her rights to have some degree of control over one of the most stressful and painful moments of her life.

Don't explain OP. You have your own valid reasons. People are wankers when it comes to maternal requests.
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Push to get a section. There is a risk of uterine rupture with vbac. They should know this.

If you’ve already had 2, in my trust they strongly discourage vbacs. I had to fight for my second.

It was just verbally said to me when she came to do the post op check. I don’t think it was ever written down. It’s certainly not in any of the discharge notes. It was 7 years ago as well.

Just another option OP. A friend of mine had a difficult first birth. When pregnant with her second she paid privately to see a consultant. He agreed that a section was best and accepted her onto his NHS list. Might be worth a try?

This is not hugely pertinent to the OP's position but it is a factor that many people who believe women should be granted CS on request seem unaware of, and so is relevant to the general discussion.

If you intend to have several children, the risk of placenta accreta and percreta goes up with the number of previous sections. Accreta is unpleasant, but percreta (where placenta grows through the uterus and onto organs) is life threatening with a maternal mortality rate of 10 percent and life saving hysterectomy being necessary in delivery very common. I do think this is something that first time parents should be made aware of when they are thinking about birth options.

Private care even at consulting stage is a lot of money to find.

If the explanation regarding the mental health effects a vaginal birth could have on you have been brushed off by the midwife then I would state the physical risks a vaginal birth could pose at each appointment till someone takes you seriously.

Why do you think 30 weeks is too late
I had 2 sections - one emergency (but would have been planned) and another planned
Mine were for medical need but even then they weren't booked in or discussed in detail until after 30 weeks and I was a high risk pregnancy for both.
DS1 actually came by emcs on the day I was supposed to be confirming and booking my planned section (36+5) and they only booked my planned section for DS2 the week before I actually had it (37 wks)
If you have no medical complications they would be unlikely to book a c-section until right at the end of your pregnancy anyway.
So at 30wks you should have plenty of time to make your case and be booked in.
I would say from what you say, you may not have a physical health need but certainly a mental health need which is just as valid.
I would also say MW advice on the subject can be extremely dubious - I was told with DS1 by MW they would want me to try labour when I booked in and a c-section would be as last resort - when I met the consultant, spoke to my GP and my rheumatologist they all said they would really prefer me not to try naturally due to the risks for me although they would support that course if I wanted to.

@Callimanco pregnant women should be provided with the risks associated with both types of birth, with consideration given to their own personal risk factors, and should be given the choice as to which set of risks they would prefer to take.

In my experience these risks are discussed. When I met with the consultant when I was pregnant with DS2 she advised me that I may wish to give more consideration to a VBAC if I planned further pregnancies. I have no plans to have further DC so it wasn't a consideration for me but it was raised.

Goodness you are costing the NHS a fortune!

Is it possible for you to try a different hospital? How far along are you? I can't imagine actually wanting a major operation like a c section instead of a vaginal birth so you must really have thought this through. I hope you get it. Good luck.

@Callimanco actually that's one of the first points the consultant raised with me at 16w when going through the pros and cons of a c section vs vaginal birth. I still think women should be offered the choice. We don't all want several children so for many that consideration isn't particularly significant.

I agree it's shocking the way women are treated around childbirth in this country. I am very surprised two c sections isn't an automatic referral to a consultant and honestly I would push for a referral citing concerns over risks for a vbac. And I don't see why the op should be slated for not wanting a vaginal birth. Mine was a fucking disaster and I ended up in HDU. It's a genuinely dangerous and horrible experience that can easily be avoided with an ELCS which I found much better, easier and smoother to recover from. Incidentally, to the pp who said she leaks after birth- it is not par for the course and you need a referral for physio.

sunshinegirl katniss
That is reassuring to hear. To be fair my youngest is no longer a toddler and my friend who very nearly died during her 4th section, her daughter is 6 or so now . It was never mentioned at all in my day so I hope that there has been a policy change.

@Forcryingoutloudwtf I get you, however I think the cost difference of a c section and a vaginal birth is something like £800? So not a huge amount in the scheme of things. And that's for a SVD.
Add onto that admission for induction, drips, extra painkillers need to get through the forced induction my second labour probably cost the same if not more than a CS due to the induction taking 4 days to work my 8 night stay most likely over took the cost of a CS.

I'm gobsmacked at some of the nasty, judgey attitudes on this thread.

Ejecting a tiny human from your body is a monumental thing to go through and there's an unbelievable attitude that those who don't feel able to put up with the pain/want an alternative birth are somehow unworthy.

Why in this day and age is there such an outcry about a woman wanting to choose her own birth plan??

Can you imagine any other type of medical treatment where there was an alternative viable option available but the woman was pressured into taking the one that's potentially more painful and traumatic just because it's what society expects??!

I understand C-sections have risks and of course there needs to be sensible conversations around this. However, we should get a say in what happens to our bodies during pregnancy and childbirth, we're not just a vessel to produce a baby!

As for the comment about how much she must be costing the NHS, I've never heard anything more ridiculous. If her mental health is damaged from a traumatic birth she doesn't want, she'll end up costing the NHS far more. I'm pretty sure the NHS can cope with the few hundred quid difference.

I don't understand why there's such animosity - all the OP is asking for is the right to choose the birth plan that she feels the most comfortable with. A birth plan which is freely available on the NHS and thousands of other women have.

People make me weep sometimes.

Wow, the attitude of some people is shocking! OP, you absolutely have the right to a CS. I had an emergency one with my first and was basically given the choice with my second. No fight at all. I have heard that consultants can refuse but that just means you need to find a new consultant. With my second, I had a meeting following 12 week scan where the pros and cons of both options were put to me and I could ask any questions, I had a follow up at 36 weeks to give me decision and then booked me in as I opted for CS.
I'm also sure there was some recent research which stated that CS was the safer option now following a previous one.

People tend to forget that situations arent as black and white. You dont need to explain your reasons on here. I dont understand why people feel the need to be rude and ignorant because the dont get an explanation to you your needs!

I dont have any answers for you but can you go back to your GP with your request?
The problem with this is your need isn't meeting the criteria. Which is shocking because we as women need to have say over what we can do with our body's without bloody conditions. We are second guessee with EVERYTHING, YET we know our body/mind a hell of alot more.

I'm sorry you are being treated like this.

And also, you shouldn't be use to be spoken to in a ignorant or shitty manner that's just disgraceful!!

Wow. I can't believe some of the judgemental posts on here.

It's a personal choice and she has her reasons, which she has no need to disclose here.

There are reasons that multiple c sections aren't good, such as excessive internal scarring, but the hospital should at least be discussing this with you.

I had an emergency c section and I will have an elective next time (if there is a next time) My baby got stuck and I'm convinced my pelvis is too small and I told my midwife before who just measured my feet and said that because my feet weren't small, my pelvis shouldn't be.....but it is. If I have to go privately then I will, but I'm hoping my hospital will understand my reasons and grant my decision.

I think if your reason is trauma OP, the hospital should ok this.

I dont think women should be able to have a section just because they want one and the NHS should pay for it. Get id costed out and go private, your choice you pay. The NHS is not a bottomless pit and should be needs led

The NHS is not a bottomless pit and should be needs led

Personally, I would consider a woman's wish not to deliver vaginally to be a need. Principle of consent and all that.

This thread is awful.

OP, I'm sorry you're having to fight for this. I've had one EMCS (not in the slightest bit traumatic), and at my booking appointment this time, the consultant said "So we'll try for a vbac". I said "Actually, I'd prefer to go straight to an elective" and he just said sure, wrote it on my file and put a particular sticker on the front of my notes. I doubt the conversation took more than 90s (although I'm sure he would've been open to more discussion if I had had questions).

That is how it should be.