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I’m wondering how some people lack the ability to understand that people have very different experiences/lives

122 replies

Barsh · 08/12/2019 10:39

Musing really. Couple of threads prompted this and a comment from a friend.

Friend was asking what special talent my autistic nephew has....none really unless you count the ability to make his feelings about wanting chips known...but he isn’t a maths genius or RAinman

Posters piling in on poster who didn’t want her Father with frontal lobe dementia to stay at Christmas. Their experience of dementia was obviously limited to watching a bit of telly...with gentle old grannies being a bit forgetful.

The poster who is trying to clear debt and wants a bit of cheering up being told to go and get a £150 hair cut.

Before I get asked what my point is, I’m not really sure.

OP posts:
Mistlewoeandwhine · 08/12/2019 23:07

😁 I’m very opinionated. Just that he said it, not me so why would I take credit for it. He’s right though.

MuffleKerfuffleUSnuffleWuffle · 09/12/2019 00:10

I have thought this many times. It's not just lack of understanding, empathy etc., many don't even read the post properly or misinterpret the OPs meaning.

A couple of years ago and on an old account I posted a very sensitive query on the WWYD board.

My father, in a position of power and trust, had, with other men and women, systematically abused me, all my siblings (boys and girls) and goodness knows who else. I was 'in a right state' about it as I had been asked to give evidence by Operation Hydrant as part of th IICSA (independent inquiry into child sexual abuse).

The amount of replies with things like 'oh do give over, it's years ago', 'well, my dad smacked me, I'm not still crying over it' really shocked me. Someone said that I'd be saying next that Jimmy Saville used to come to tea, really taking the piss.

I was giving evidence that helped other women my age put names to their abusers, that was my reason. It still saddens me.

VanyaHargreeves · 09/12/2019 00:14

That's absolutely shocking Kerfuffle Thanks

That's not even lack of empathy, it's lack of basic humanity and decency

I am sorry you experienced that.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

AlexaAmbidextra · 09/12/2019 00:36

You see it on here all the time.

Just get an Uber

Get a Deliveroo

Not understanding that not all of us live in areas where these operate.

AlexaAmbidextra · 09/12/2019 00:41

My husband says that right wing people just basically lack empathy and the ability to imagine themselves in another person’s shoes.

Thank God. We can all rest easy. A person with a penis has proclaimed. 🙄

SeaEagleFeather · 09/12/2019 00:43

muffle I'm so sorry.

Typed out a huge post in reply to this thread and deleted it in the face of your post.

I'm so sorry that this was your life and experience and that having taken the huge step to come forward to the police and work with this enquiry, you get -this- response on Mumsnet.

On the internet you get a lot of very ... honestly, stupid and rather sick... people who don't listen and don't care, though I guarentee you that a thread about paedophiles would get them suggesting all sorts. They just don't want to know about what it's actually like and what people live with who have to endure and survive this, and then come out to speak about it.

It's a lonely place, but what you did was right. Honestly, ignore the people who get off on being unpleasant online. Not everyone is nice, and not everyone is worth listening to.

Squirrel134 · 09/12/2019 00:48

@ALongHardWinter
Thank you for talking about your experience with Fibromyalgia & (in my case) Osteoarthritis. I sometimes feel those with better health and level of fitness are right & that I am being lazy. Oh for the energy of my 20/30s.
But GP says it's not that simple, its an accumulation of wear & tear on the body over the years. But the last 10/15 yrs have been tough.

So we've got try to keep pacing ourselves, read about spoon theory ... & be kind to ourselves (at least once a day). To manage the energy we have.
I do some basic yoga, stretches & the odd 2 min walk once/twice a week. Even then, I manage to over-do it, and pay for it with acute pain & exhaustion for at least 3 days. Having a bath & the hairwashing thing is a nightmare. At those time get out of the house is impossible.

What some forget is that with long-term disabilities, things don't get easier with age. Those who lack empathy may think some acquired invisible disablilties are like the flu, but if we could shake ourselves & get new bodies we'd be 1st in the queue.

Bear with us - we are only human!

blubelle7 · 09/12/2019 01:21

@MuffleKerfuffleUSnuffleWuffle

Sorry that sounds horrific. I can't believe how horrible some people can beFlowers

anxioussue · 09/12/2019 04:51

IRL I got told how I was lucky my dad only has dementia and not cancer.

And this got completely ignored so proves lack of empathy well thank you very much Sad

daisychain01 · 09/12/2019 05:36

Unfortunately people expect too much of others on MN and other social media platforms.

How can people possibly be expected to understand complex illnesses, diseases and situation that an OP is going through often with incomplete information. Yes, one might say "they are coming in here for support". That's all well and good, but then it attracts an uncontrolled, unfiltered amount of posts from a divert motley crew. What do people expect?

Ironically, people posting on here are bemoaning the fact people are so unempathetic but they themselves don't realise that an OP can sometimes be a confusing, inaccurate and incomplete picture (maybe deliberately so as not to be outed). That's not a criticism but it does speak to the imperfect world of social media where formerly people would only gain access to medical opinion through professionals, now suddenly everyone is meant to be armchair medics, psychologists etc. It's quick and easy for people to dismiss complex problems by saying "you should just...." so they do.

Call me unempathetic but that's what I see on here so much, and rarely post because I know I don't have the expertise.

MuffleKerfuffleUSnuffleWuffle · 09/12/2019 06:50

I have been genuinely surprised by the kind and caring responses, I didn't expect that, thank you.

@VanyaHargreeves I agree. It is sad though that people go through life without empathy - that inate inability to feel others' situations must make their experiences quite 2D instead of 3D with its exquisite emotions.

@Squirrel134 your description there could have been written for me - except you worded it so well. Others who (thankfully) don't have constant debilitating pain either cannot understand (understandable), don't know how to react to you pain and don't know how to help; some people (my mother) will just refuse to acknowledge it, the pain/disability, and have no concept of care, love, encouragement etc. I'm sorry you're having such a shit time; I would love to take away your pain. Be kind to yourself and others may follow.

@SeaEagleFeather thank you, you are so kind and caring. It wasn't a difficult decision to make but it was exhausting and worrying for the 12 months it took to complete all my interviews. I heard some hard to take facts about my father. Overall, I know I did the right thing but felt totally devastated by some MN responses to my plea for help.

Thank you to everyone else who sent kind and caring messages... it does make a difference, for someone to take time to respond, thank you.

MuffleKerfuffleUSnuffleWuffle · 09/12/2019 07:02

anxioussue

IRL I got told how I was lucky my dad only has dementia and not cancer.

And this got completely ignored so proves lack of empathy well thank you very much sad

I'm so sorry I didn't see or respond to your comment about the awful thing some said to you about your dad.

I genuinely don't think the lack of response equates to lack of empathy - more that it has been overnight (fewer people around, tired whilst awake in the night) and I, for one, didn't read all the posts so had missed yours and others. It was unintentional; I'm sorry you feel sad.

anxioussue · 09/12/2019 07:48

Sorry muffle I was tired and over reacting posting at night isn't my best idea thank you

ForalltheSaints · 09/12/2019 09:04

There are about 650 people I can think of who have little idea of the real world described by the OP.

SwampOfDeath · 09/12/2019 09:58

MN has been amazing for educating me about other people's lives, thus cultivating my capacity for empathy. I work in a 'coal face' position in public services with some very vulnerable groups, and I still thank MN for giving me more insight.
I talk to my pupils about this when we study topics involving human misery, such as the transatlantic slave trade, colonial rule, the Holocaust, the struggles of communities in the global South in the face of climate breakdown; they're young and the impulse is often to say "Why didn't they just...?" "Couldn't they just...?" without reflecting more deeply. Once the penny drops, there is an understanding that empathy doesn't necessarily require detailed knowledge of all the issues, but a humility in the face of the predicament of another.

ChristmasSpirtsOnTheRocksPleas · 09/12/2019 10:03

I think it’s quite normal for empathy to have limits. I can understand how other people live, I can understand the types of feelings they have, I can even feel them to an extent but it’s always going to be tainted by my own view of the world.

Woollycardi · 09/12/2019 10:19

Because it is mind blowing to really absorb the fact that we all view the world from different perspectives. Or that's how I view it anyway...That no one other person will ever have exactly the same view point but we are all essentially the same at heart. Remembering that makes me far less judgemental, which I have really needed to learn.

Woollycardi · 09/12/2019 10:23

@darkriver19886 I hear you. I remind myself daily that I don't need to explain or justify myself to anyone. Only those who really 'get it' or have been there will understand. Just keep putting one foot in front of the other. Those who truly care will remain with you. Anyone else can stuff it.

Flusteredcustard · 09/12/2019 10:30

This lack of empathy, realising that people have completely different situations etc, etc lies behind so many problems that people and society have. When you have a baby, friends and family think their way that they did things with their particular children and put all your difficulties with your children down to the wrong way you are doing it, as after all their babies didn't mind being put down at 6 o'clock and slept for 12 hours, or they cried for hours but they realised no one came and were happy to go to sleep ever after. They smacked their children and had to otherwise they'd have turned into hooligans, after all, they were smacked and how right their parents were, they would have turned into hooligans otherwise and yours will do because you're not smacking them, right through to thinking that every single mother is feckless and idle, rather than she fled a violent husband, that every homeless person has somehow brought it on themselves, because they'd never have ended up homeless, the PTA mum whose family live 150 miles away is just lazy because she can't commit to doing xyz, well I managed a full-time job and still did it, that the woman suffering deep depression is just lazy, because she should just pull herself together, that immigrants are just here either to take their jobs or to skive on benefits, that someone who cuts themself off from a family that has mistreated them for years, or turned a blind eye to abuse of one of the members, is in the wrong, sure isn't the mum a sweet old lady and the dad just a bit of a character, that a woman complaining of sexual assault is just attention seeking, that a raped woman was responsible somehow, they'd never have worn clothes like that or gone out after dark; if that woman had paid more attention to her husband instead of getting too bogged down in looking after the children, if she'd kept the house cleaner, if she'd not let herself go, her husband would not have beaten her up and left her for another woman.
I'm alright Jack, and society's ills are because people do not behave just like I do. And yes the criticisms of people who are having difficulties with violent dementia, and everything else people have mentioned. The lack of empathy that deprives an old man of benefits because he is blind and did not read the letter, or sanctions someone for not doing the thing they had to because they were in hospital seriously ill.
Interestingly the ex never could read fiction, or watch programmes or films, not just fiction but history presented in a story form. Neither could his parents, at the time I just put it down to personal choice but in retrospect, none of them could understand looking at things from someone else's point of view. Not interested in museums that were about people, interested in museums about things, but not what the things meant for people, so think transport museum - they liked trains, cars, buses, but not how they affected the lives of those who had access to them. Weirdly the inlaws were heavily into movie making, but the movies were about them and what they were doing, so they could show people. They took footage of the children over the years, but if it didn't fit into their film, they just discarded it, never thinking to ask would we like to have it - at the time we didn't have the equipment.

Foslady · 09/12/2019 10:40

The one thing I have got better at as I have got older is calling people out on this - and when they start acting offended not backing down.

Tableclothing · 09/12/2019 11:05

I think it’s quite normal for empathy to have limits

Agree with this. Being very empathetic is the exception, rather than the rule. If the majority of us were excellent at putting ourselves in other people's shoes, there would be no need for counsellors or therapists. As it is, there are plenty of examples in the Relationships of people whose partners, parents, best friends etc are completely unempathetic, even when well-meaning. If the people we're closest to struggle to understand us, it might be a good idea to limit our expectations of total strangers.

BlaueLagune · 09/12/2019 11:11

I think I'm guilty of the "online shopping is your friend" line. But unless you live in the Highlands of Scotland or similar in Wales, there can't be many places in the UK that you can't get a supermarket delivery to, and the delivery charge isn't going to be more than the bus fare or petrol would be if you choose an unpopular time slot?

The kind of thread where I see this the most is the ones about periods. Some women simply cannot compute that other women have heavy periods which result in floods. I don't know why.

I think MN has given more more insight too especially in relation to hidden disabilities.

ChristineBaskets · 09/12/2019 11:30

Interesting that pp's have mentioned how people in their lives who are like this don't enjoy watching/reading fiction. I have a family member who is exactly like this. I think it's down to a lack of imagination- they just can't put themselves in another person's shoes.

CaptainMyCaptain · 09/12/2019 12:00

I think the point about people who don't read fiction is very true. Fiction gives you an insight into so many different worlds. The same goes for films, dramas, plays.

SourAndSnippy · 09/12/2019 12:24

I think the point about people who don't read fiction is very true. Fiction gives you an insight into so many different worlds. The same goes for films, dramas, plays

Well I never read fiction and am empathetic so you must be wrong 😉

I’m teasing (sort of) but isn’t the line that you can’t be empathetic if you don’t read fiction because everyone I know who doesn’t read fiction is awful exactly the type of dogmatic thinking that the OP was complaining about.