Private renting so much more than housing association!

[Generationrenter]

Just moved to a new build and the rent is £1300pm, neighbours are HA tenants and paying £500 for the exact same house. We both earn around the same amount.

I’m not saying their rent should be more and think HA properties are great (I’ve been on a waiting list for 6 years as renting is bankrupting me so certainly not knocking it!) but surely efforts should be made within budgets that make HA rents so low to reduce private rents?

I know private renting has become so unaffordable but is there anything that can be done? £800 difference a month for the same house just seems insane!

Guess it is just a vent but it doesn’t make sense to me!

There are streets and streets of empty houses owned by HA in Liverpool.
Mostly in crap areas.

But they need so much doing to them and if people on the list were given them they may or not be able to afford that.

So they remain run down and the areas never get any better.

But Pannalash the market rate is not an arbitrary figure set by mystical forces on high that we must all just learn to live with. It's the result of undersupply, and that can be changed. Perhaps it's not the landlord's fault but it is wrong for us to shrug our shoulders and say that's just how it has to be.

I get what your saying makingmiracles but what about people like me
Who have had to pay out to make it nice for my family. I've had to put thousands into this house.

No flooring, garden rat infested and full of flagstones mixed in with the grass. I've put it all right at my own cost.
I'd be furious if after all that I was forced
To move.

Subsidised was probably the wrong word, sorry. The overheads and profit margin on ha will differ, they may even not have paid full market value for the properties. The spec is probably not the same and they often own less desirable plots. Therefore they can charge less to those on the housing register.

I don’t want anyone to suffer! But I will admit that it doesn’t seem fair to pay less than half price rent just because 10 years ago you were in a bad financial position.
If these people didn’t occupy social houses, perhaps they could have more being let out at slightly lower than the market rate with a reliable landlord.
Something needs to be done about unaffordable rentals, landlords are private individuals, you can’t really make them do anything but if housing associations had more incentive to build (e.g more affordable but not crazy low rents to the squeezed middle) it might help.
I don’t think I’m getting my point accross very well!

Wales is building social housing.

There's some lovely looking houses in an area I drive through. Some have some fantastic views.

Generationrenter - you absolutely don't have to apologise for anything you've posted on here. You are right to be concerned - it's a very unfair system. The government isn't remotely bothered about fixing it - only interested in owner-occupiers and boosting their numbers through right to buy and therefore keeping house prices high.

There are laws against artificially inflating prices in other industries, so it's not true to say as it is a business you can't regulate it. You can- but nobody would want to because it would be arguing with money.

People who can afford to own two houses, are being paid a tidy profit by people who can't afford to buy one. It traps people as they are paying more than a mortgage in rent, so theoretically could afford to buy the house they live in, but can't get the deposit together because they are paying so much more to the landlord.

Nobody should be forced to move into private rented or buy if they can't afford it. There should be enough secure housing for all to keep communities and families together, continuity of school life. Loads of empty housing is owned by foreign investors. If no one can afford to live in city centre who will service the rich? Jobs are a problem in run down communities. Some people, students, transient workers don't want permanent housing but still need some security. Stop blaming the victim.

E.g Ha owns a house and is renting it out for £500pm, private rentals at £1300
Instead HAs buys multiple houses there and rents them out at say £1000 pm just to normal tenants on the open market as opposed to just those who qualify as in need... then they’d have more incentive to buy more houses as they make more money and the fact there are cheaper houses on the market makes it more competitive and landlords have to lower prices.
Why aren’t things like this happening? Like split stock between housing register and open market? I might be totally missing something though!
And if rents increased in HA properties once you earn a certain amount, it would either release more funds so they can buy more houses or people that can afford to move, Will and this frees up social housing. Why doesn’t this happen?

The pictures don't do them justice, they are actually much nicer looking. I saw the houses go up as I drove past and thought they were just new build and was surprised to find the were social housing.

Some are painted a pale blue and look very attractive.

www.google.com/amp/s/www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/state-art-homes-first-council-13696277.amp

Private landlords charge as much as they can get away with for rent. Letting agents encourage it. As there is a shortage of rental accomodation there is great scope of ridiculous rental prices. More people cannot afford to buy, a situation that has got far worse with the Governments help to buy scheme which meant developers just put up prices even more. Just look at the ridiculous profits Persimmons make, their sales being “subsidised” by the government! Their chief got a £110 MILLION bonus!

I think the solution is enough social housing for everyone. My rent is really cheap (we had to be homeless to be housed- not pleasant) but the organisation that owns my house makes a profit. Rents don’t have to be sky high. It’s unfair to say you should leave if you earn a wage. Private renting is so volatile, it’s unfair to put people back in the situation where they are likely to be kicked out again on a section 21 (no fault eviction) before too long, and it would put people off working! Also if you are in social housing you have to put a lot of your own money/effort into it. Flooring, fences/gates decoration, window coverings, white goods, storage all has to be paid for by the tenant, in addition to the furniture. If you are broke (many tenants are) it can take years to get the basics sorted out.

OP, it doesn't happen because a lot of government have stakes in private lets.

Landlords will not charge less than market value unless regulated, why should they?
Second homes in holiday areas also a problem, forcing prices up.
It's not about being in a bad position, people need secure homes. Average wage is not enough for decent private housing. Homelessness and poor quality rented housing is a real problem, why should people move from their homes, you are looking through the wrong end of the telescope.

generationrenter that isn’t happening because it is a daft idea.

There is NO NEED to charge £1000 rents and they are unaffordable for many “normal” people. And usually it’s after all those in need of housing are housed, that people with lower priority are offered places. In many towns anyone can apply for council/social housing...you just might either never get anywhere, or wait a very long time.

Yes £1000 is unaffordable for a lot of people but if they’re already paying £1300 for that property, then it makes it a lot more affordable? I’ve been on the list 6 years I think I was position 210 or something last week - I’m not holding my breath!

Social housing is not subsidised, the rent is the "correct" rent for housing of that type and covers the cost of administrating and maintaining the housing stock whereas private rent covers that plus profit for the landlord/letting agent. It is also not exclusively for people in need, anyone can apply for social housing, many social housing tenants work a d pay full rent. Booting people out of social housing once their income reaches a certain threshold or dramatically increasing their rent would never work as it gives people no incentive to progress in life, to work for promotion, to look for a better paid job, etc.

Have you not thought about buying? That would be cheaper than your rent surely.

There isn't a shortage of social housing everywhere and lots of councils are building new social housing too.

To be able to buy a run down house with 3 bed i need a 37k ish deposit and an annual income of £88k roughly. Under help to buy it’s not much better as they’re 20% ish more anyway. It’s way out of reach for us. I have considered purchasing up north and renting it out for the mortgage price so that I have some security for my children but I have £0 saved so far.

@NotSuch with rents costing £1300 I'm sure many people think wistfully about buying, unable to save the deposit because of the cost of renting...

landlords are private individuals, you can’t really make them do anything

You can! That's what laws are for! For example you can make them get your boiler checked every year, you can make them put your deposit in a scheme so they can't just spend it on a holiday, you can make them keep the fabric of the building in good order - all these are legal requirements that cost the landlord money and yet it's been decided that their right to run a profitable business doesn't trump your right to a safe and secure home.

I totally see where you're coming from but I think you're trying to solve the problem from the wrong end. It's not that HA tenants are paying too little, it's that you're paying too much. If your neighbour's rent went up yours wouldn't automatically go down, because your landlord would still have their mortgage to pay and you will still need somewhere to live.

I know someone who got a tenancy on an assured rent 30 odd years ago. He pays £60 A week for a flat in Central London that would be way over a million to buy.

He earns around £70k. Personally I think housing association properties should be for those in housing need. It really annoys me when he crows about how low his rent is, so low he can afford a second home. All the while calling himself a socialist.

The point is lots of people are in housing need, still don't meet criteria for social housing. It's so bad now you have to be homeless, and have some serious difficulty. Poverty alone isn't in it. Lots of people who could afford a mortgage can't get one. A decent wage not enough to buy or rent a decent house. I couldn't afford my house now, it does me no good that the price went up, I'm living in it, not making money from it, renting from the bank.
Even ppl earning £70k are not the enemy (is he private rent, otherwise he shouldn't hav 2cnd home) there are a few people getting many multiples of that exploiting us all.

OP I feel for you, such a high proportion of your income is going on rent. HAs can only do so much though. They mainly borrow to build, receiving much smaller grants through the HCA than in the past. It's much harder to get those grants, therefore a major part of the problem is the reduced government subsidy. The govt need to fund it in order for it to be turned around.