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Original poster

Would you let your 14yo come?

81 replies

ShadyGable · 28/08/2018 09:03

Day at the seaside planned tomorrow.

9yo DS with ASD and 14yo DD. Yesterday DD and some friends were upstairs playing, next thing I know bathroom door is slammed and children come down saying DS has locked himself in and is crying. This turns into 3 hours of sobbing, self harm, crying he’s not meant to be in this world and we’d be better off without him. It was heartbreaking.

This was all started by DD who called him a baby, told all the friends that he cries and gets angry all the time, started playing pranks on him and scaring him (locking him in his room in the dark - he’s petrified of the dark). This is all I can get out of DS, he’s still not talking today.

DD is refusing to take any responsibility, there’s history of her being pretty awful to her brother and not understanding him at all. She definitely makes a hard life more difficult.

I was so angry last night I sent her to bed as all she did was try and start a fight with me and do the usual ‘I did nooooootttttthhhiiinnnggg’ teenage whine.

I’m tempted to ban her from coming tomorrow, DS will be so much happier without her there. She won’t be missing out as she’s already had a few beach days and a holiday abroad this year whilst this will be DS’s first outing of the year.

OP posts:
EmmaStone · 28/08/2018 10:04

Oh gosh, this is a tough one. My 13YO DD and 11YO ASD DS generally get along really well when it's just the 2 of them. Add other children into the mix though, and she will often get all the children on her side, and DS will slink off to his room alone. We talk to her about being on his side - she's his only sister, and if she doesn't stick up for him, who will? But I'm also aware that she needs to be able to to let off steam about the frustrations of having a brother with an ASD, and sometimes she needs to confide in her friends about it.

We tend to word it with her that she's actually the lucky one - she doesn't struggle to understand the nuances of friendships, the unspoken rules of the playground, but for her brother, it's like living in another country where you don't speak the language, and that we do appreciate how much she does for him (she really looks out for him when they're at grandparents or whatever. We get a lot of comments on how good she is with him).

But as much as we appreciate her help, she also needs to understand the distinction of bullying someone - when not everyone is enjoying the game. And actually, that sometimes we need to adjust the rules of the game a bit for other players.

I think I'd still include her in the day out, but try and have a grown up conversation with her today about it, and how she's feeling about it all after she's slept on it. She's probably been feeling a bit defensive, knowing she behaved badly.

Original poster
ShadyGable · 28/08/2018 10:06

Yes I feel like 14 is old enough to know better. It was deliberate and malicious. Maybe I shouldn’t have mentioned he had ASD because a lot of the responses are implying he could have deserved it if he was annoying them or that she resents him so this is her payback. No one deserves to be treated the way he was yesterday, ASD or not.

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Original poster
ShadyGable · 28/08/2018 10:09

We talk to her about being on his side - she's his only sister, and if she doesn't stick up for him, who will? But I'm also aware that she needs to be able to to let off steam about the frustrations of having a brother with an ASD, and sometimes she needs to confide in her friends about it This is what we talk about a lot.

The dynamics of the group are very even, DS is never left out, they all get on really well when in a group. They don’t normally even bicker. But for some reason yesterday DD turned on her brother.

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Perfectly1mperfect · 28/08/2018 10:11

If you are sure she was as bad as you say then I would make her stay with your mum and miss out on the day.

My children are also 14 and 9. They may wind each other up as siblings do but they absolutely know that their loyalty lies with each other and would never show each other up in front of friends. They may mock each other but if someone else did it they would completely stand up for the other one. I think that your daughter needs this instilled into her, especially as your child has ASD. At 14 I presume she understands that he has ASD, she should feel protective of him if anything.

StrumpersPlunkett · 28/08/2018 10:12

I would def let her come.
They sound like they could do with fun time together out of the confines of normal day to day stuff
Facilitating them having bonding fun together is more important to me than punishing her choice of behaviour.
Dividing them could be counter productive.
Imo

JeffJarrett · 28/08/2018 10:12

My DS has SN and I really feel for you coping with a 3 hour meltdown with self harming.

14 is old enough to know what she was doing and her behaviour needs to be punished. Absolutely agree with leaving her with GM.

Original poster
ShadyGable · 28/08/2018 10:19

Strumpers they’ve had plenty of time together these holidays, all day every day in fact. I think they are spending too much time together, so I think the opposite and they actually need time apart.

OP posts:
Original poster
ShadyGable · 28/08/2018 10:23

Yes she understands about ASD. We did a lot of research together when he was diagnosed.

She knows he doesn’t like being laughed at or mocked, and this is exactly what she did to him. There was no loyalty.

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GeorgeTheHippo · 28/08/2018 10:25

I think she doesn't get the day out, she goes to grandmas without her phone. She knows she was nasty.

Original poster
ShadyGable · 28/08/2018 10:26

Thanks Jeff. I find it so hard. I don’t get any support from the DC’s dad, they don’t even see him. He was severely abusive and thinks the DC are my responsibility Hmm as it was me who threw him out. He was arrested and as it was me who called the police, apparently it’s all my fault Hmm

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NotAnotherNoughtiesTune · 28/08/2018 10:28

I'm sorry if I missed it but how old is DS?

I do feel a lot of the responses are insinuating she did it because he was violent or it's always so difficult to have a sibling with ASD.

Of course it is but that doesn't make it okay. Just like it's not okay to knock your cerebral palsy's sibling on the floor or tell a severely depressed sibling they should die.

There are ways to let out your frustration that don't involve hurting the sibling, especially as she's a teen.

I'd send her to Mums.

Original poster
ShadyGable · 28/08/2018 10:31

I’ve already told her she isn’t coming tomorrow and the waterworks have started. Apparently she was ‘pranking’ DS by locking him in the dark. Even though she knows we have to sleep with the landing light on every night, even though she knows he hates being mocked and laughed at. She knew exactly what she was doing, when he was crying for them to stop she carried on and laughed at him for crying.

Eurgh, who said parenting got easier as they got older?!

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30hours · 28/08/2018 10:33

It is nasty and unkind but I’m pretty sure living with him is harder for you on a day to day basis. Why punish her more for having an asd sibling? She exists too.

ReservoirDogs · 28/08/2018 10:35

I'm not really sure why you asked the question as you seem to have made your mind up already.

iklboo · 28/08/2018 10:36

They don’t normally even bicker. But for some reason yesterday DD turned on her brother.

I wonder then if she was egged on by her friends and felt pressured to act up against him / show off if this behaviour is usually so out of character.

stillnotTheDoctor · 28/08/2018 10:41

She needs to understand her actions have consequences. Asd or not that was pretty cruel. She's older and doesn't have sn- she should be behaving better and setting an example.

If you think she should miss out on the trip, leave her at home. Maybe next time she'll think twice.

Also, if she can't behave acceptably in social situations then maybe she should be excluded from social situations.

Speaking as a mum of three, two with asd who are disciplined as much as the nt child. Eldest dd is bratty and cruel.

CarolDanvers · 28/08/2018 10:42

I think you're very wrong in your decision but you're the one in the ground so it's up to you obviously.

Original poster
ShadyGable · 28/08/2018 10:42

I’m not punishing her for having an ASD sibling. I’m punishing her for her vile behaviour towards her brother. Haven’t you read where I said I compensate for this, and I get more one to one time with her than I do my other DC. I’m very aware she exists thank you Hmm.

And no I hadn’t made my mind up when I posted. Hence posting. But I made my mind up the more I thought about it and read people’s reponses. As is the way it generally goes on threads asking for advice.

No I don’t think so, she was the ringleader and it was the other children who came and told me what was happening. All their stories are the same/similar.

OP posts:
Original poster
ShadyGable · 28/08/2018 10:43

I think you're very wrong in your decision but you're the one in the ground so it's up to you obviously. How would you deal with bullying then?

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CarolDanvers · 28/08/2018 10:49

I've already said.

Original poster
ShadyGable · 28/08/2018 10:50

Sorry NotAnother I missed your post. He’s 9.

And yes I feel like DD is getting sympathy for having to live with an ASD sibling (which on the face of it is fair enough), but there is no excuse for the way she behaved yesterday. She’s being excused just because he has ASD. I don’t excuse his ASD, I discipline him exactly the same as my two NT children.

He wasn’t being violent, or annoying, she just turned on him for a laugh and did it deliberately. She did everything she knows he hates and humiliated him infront of everyone. How can anyone excuse that?

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DorothyL · 28/08/2018 10:51

My youngest has asd as well and can be very hard to learn live with, and I appreciate it's not easy for his older sisters, but behaviour like that displayed by your dd would be punished by me without a doubt. Like you I do my best to compensate but they must understand that they are amongst the very few allies the asd sibling has and that they are the lucky ones.

DorothyL · 28/08/2018 10:53

Unlike you btw I don't discipline exactly the same, why discipline for something that isn't a person's fault? Would you discipline a non-walker for not getting up the stairs quickly enough?

Original poster
ShadyGable · 28/08/2018 10:54

And I’ve already said I also remove electronics for low level behaviour. This isn’t low level, it’s bullying. If a child in a park did this to your child, would you expect their parent to just remove their phone? Or would you expect a firmer sanction and for them to be punished appropriately?

I can imagine MN would be up in arms if I said this happened to DS in a park and another child deliberately stood their laughing and mocking him in front of people, and all the other parent did was remove the child’s phone.

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DorothyL · 28/08/2018 10:55

I ask my dd's to understand what causes ds's behaviour traits. Of course we still work on modifying them, but fair doesn't mean equal.

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