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This is very, very long, and yes, I've NC'd.

216 replies

Helpmehelpmydgs · 24/08/2013 14:44

My DS1 and his gf lived together for a few years, half here and half with her family, before finally moving into their own place a couple of years ago. They got together as teenagers and are now mid-twenties.

I will admit I was massively relieved when they moved out, the atmosphere in my home lightened immediately. They were always rather "disapproving" towards dh and me, there was a fair amount of "antler-clashing" (words, no violence) between DS1 and dh, and ds1 and ds2, and it was all just getting a bit tired. While they were here, they contributed nothing; no housework, no bills, no rent. They didn't even provide company and entertainment, they just took their evening meals upstairs to eat and wouldn't be seen again till morning.

Anyway, they have basically cut communications since they left. Ds1 passes close to our home twice every working day and has never called in just for a natter and a cup of tea. He has never phoned just for a chat, and eventually stopped even responding to his dad's friendly sports-related texts. He didn't even acknowledge FB messages. (I know, I know...) Eventually I blocked him on FB because it became obvious that his dp was using the login to post snidey, passive-aggressive comments aimed at me, and I don't need that kind of childish shit in my life.

So, roll on the months, and ds1 drops by to tell us they're having a baby. We say "Congratulations, when's it due?", he tells us and leaves. Five minutes tops, and the next we hear is when the baby is born premature, by emergency CS, and later needs surgery at a few weeks old. We were "permitted" to visit in the hospital, dh and ds2 went, I didn't because I had a streaming cold and didn't think a tiny newborn should be exposed to that. Eventually I met him at about three months when they dropped by for five minutes; he was taken out of the car, but not the carseat (fair enough, he was asleep) so I could admire from a distance. I was never invited to visit him in their home, and I have never been the kind of person to drop in uninvited; particularly where dil2b is so clearly hostile towards me I wouldn't even consider it. I know how hard the early days are and would never just "drop by" on a new mum, especially one who'd just had major abdominal surgery, I don't even phone in case I'd disturb a nap.

I don't think I've emphasised how much dil2b actually hates me, btw, she really does. She maintains I broke her trust, I think she's an attention-seeking drama queen, this is never going to end well. As is right, ds1 is fully supporting his dp and the mother of his pfb, and as a result relationships between ds1 and me have completely broken down. Frankly, I'm past caring. I've run the full gamut of emotions from hair-tearing grief, through shock at their blatant rewriting of history, to rage at the fucking using wee twat I birthed. I'm now "meh" about the lot of them.

DIL2B, however, has other ideas. She has started to demand that I have a relationship with their ds, which sounds positive, but what she actually wants is "stuff", and her email to me makes that very, very clear. She hates me, will not forgive me, does not accept my apology and will not be in the house when I visit (by arrangement, of course.) She's upset because I bought dgs1 (ds2's boy, now 4) lots of "stuff" when he was little, and I should be buying the same sort of "stuff" for dgs2. Thing is, when dgs1 was born it to two teenage parents, only one of whom was working (pt, zero hours contract, nmw), and who did not, at that time, live together, though they spent most nights together either here or with her family. Dgs2 has been born to two fully-adult parents, at least one of whom is ft employed on a rate considerably higher than nmw (am unaware of her status) and who have their own home. And who don't speak to me.

So, yes, I probably did go a bit daft on the toy front, but most of it is usable by other dc. I bought the bigger-ticket items, indoor trampoline, chute, paddling pool, ride-on toys, that sort of thing; they're all durable. I keep them here because my house is big enough and although ds2 and his ex are no longer together, they have resolved their differences and dgs1 stays over two or three nights a week, so he gets a lot of use out of these toys. But dgs2 won't be brought here to visit, so he'll never get to use them; does that mean I should shell out again for stuff they'll keep and I'll never get to see dgs2 enjoying? It's not that they can't afford this stuff if they want it, ds1 got a substantial inheritance from my uncle a couple of months ago, but they want me to pay for it.

So, well done if you've read this far, go and put the kettle on for a Brew because there's more.

If we're sitting comfortably... So, she emailed me this vituperous claptrap four weeks ago. I put off opening it, I'll be honest, I was scared to read it, actually shook at the thought for days. Eventually I had a drink steeled myself, and actually ended up snorting in derision at how blatant her demands for "stuff" were, which was a relief tbh. The email is a complete rewriting of history, apparently she has tried everything to keep communications open blah blah blah. I do intend to reply, but I veer between the emotions decribed above (though I left out the rending of hair this time) and can't quite get the right tone. Ds1 has sent dh horrible texts demanding to know when I'll reply, really nasty in tone, and snotty about me. Yeah, that makes me get the rage want to communicate calmly, and forge a relationship with your pfb.

So (I use that too much, eh?), I am pretty much in a place where I want absolutely nothing further to do with any of them. She hates me, and I don't recognise the ds1 I raised, he's grown into an unpleasant bully, and I'm ashamed of him. It's a pity I won't know dgs2, but dh and ds2 are persisting so I'll still have news, and perhaps he'll choose to visit me when he's older. He'll get nothing positive about me from his mother, but his cousin (dgs1) loves me, so he might get curious.

Then ds2 visited dgs2 during the week, and took photos. He showed me, and I am genuinely shocked.

DIL2B has been overweight, massively so, all of the time I have known her. She has had an eating disorder in the past, and I don't think she's resolved any of the background issues (of course, she might have had intensive counselling, I have no idea) and I think she has a problematic relationship with food, equating it with love in some way?

Anyway, dgs2 looks to me (not a trained professional) to be clinically obese, dangerously so. He is HUGE, he can't move because of his weight, he can't even wave his limbs in the air. This is not "normal baby" chubbiness, cute wee dimples and squidgeyness. This is baby walrus territory. And it has been achieved in about three months; he was a perfectly normal size when I last saw him, and is only 6 months now.

Apparently she has been adding baby rice to every bottle feed since 12 weeks, and spooning purees into him from 16 weeks. :(

So, do I start to take an interest in the child, perhaps rebuild bridges with ds1 (tbh, I don't want to, I don't even like him much any more) and persuade him to see how wrong this is, how dangerous for his pfb? Do I hope the HV sees and says something? Why can't ds1 see for himself? I think he does, he put up a video of the child blowing raspberries and carefully showed nothing but his face (and that's pretty fat, too, but not as revealing as his limbs). Why does he want me involved, and why does he think that being bullying and aggressive will do that?

Sorry, wandered off on another tangent. Wwyd, re-establish relationships in the (quite possibly vain) hopes of changing dgs2's diet to something more babyish, or tell them all to piss off and hope they come to their senses? They're not going to listen to me anyway, are they, I'd just be a judgemental and interfering MIL.

Ok, talked it all through now, they can fuck off. Sorry, dgs2, hope you and your mum get the professional help you so much need and deserve.

Thanks for reading, I don't really expect replies, but it's been cathartic to get it all out.

OP posts:
paperlantern · 24/08/2013 20:16

pinup - genuinely don't think it isSad

paperlantern · 24/08/2013 20:17

how can anyone call someone lovely who calls there grandchild a walrus Sad Sad Sad Sad Sad Sad

Pinupgirl · 24/08/2013 20:17

Well from the kiss arsing that's going on its clear that some posters think they know who the poster is.

Carry on op-this thread could run and run....

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

Helpmehelpmydgs · 24/08/2013 20:19

Waltermitty, thank you, sincerely. You're making me think. Damn, I was supposed to be set on my path by now. I'm back to swinging wildly in the wind...

Honestly, would I like the opportunity to get to know him, fall in love with him, watch him grow up and spoli him? Yes, I would, of course I would. But I don't think I have that opportunity however I play this, and I don't want to end up giving or receiving "duty visits" just so I can hand over another toy.

There will be a load of xposts, I expect.

OP posts:
NoSquirrels · 24/08/2013 20:20

I do feel a little as if this is not worth posting, as you made your mind up from the very beginning (and, tbf, you did say so in your OP, so can't accuse you of not being honest:Ok, talked it all through now, they can fuck off. Sorry, dgs2, hope you and your mum get the professional help you so much need and deserve)

but you've just posted this:

the motivation for starting this thread; would I be able to make a difference to the long-term health of this baby if I made nice.

and I just want to say Yes, you could make a difference. But it would be playing it for the long-game, not a quick fix, and you will have to put up with some provocation and bad behaviour in the short-term, almost inevitably. If you can't do that then up to you, your loss, I guess. But please do as Mrs DV says and maintain at least birthday/Xmas/significant occasion contact.

Pinupgirl · 24/08/2013 20:20

But how could you possibly love him op-he's too fat?

Helpmehelpmydgs · 24/08/2013 20:21

I did not fall out with dil2b over comments about her weight, I made no such comments to her. The only times I commented on her appearance was to compliment her on, eg, a new hairstyle. I really don't know where you get this stuff, paper.

OP posts:
TheFalconsmistress · 24/08/2013 20:21

Sad that people like OP exist and so many agree. Your son and dil would have went through the most awful time with a premmie going through surgery and all you can say is I had a cold?? They would have really needed you to be there even in spirit/on the phone/just cared!! Cant you see that?? Even if relationships are not great they prob thought you would want to be involved and tried. All you can say is about poor you. I am baffled Confused

paperlantern · 24/08/2013 20:23

no you commented behind her back. better and better

RandomMess · 24/08/2013 20:23

Well just because you end up with duty visits doesn't mean that you have to hand over another toy, just accept/encourage the visits so you do get to build up a positive relationship. Sure you can sometimes give gifts, ask what dgs2 could do with for birthday etc.

Don't see it as being blackmailed, or used just see it as offering an olive branch.

Underneath it all your DIL may be desperate for your approval etc but is just so screwed up she is trying to demand it rather than work at a relationship with you - using you as a scape goat for what isn't good in her life?

Helpmehelpmydgs · 24/08/2013 20:24

Do you think so, Squirrels? Really? I'm swithering, I really am. Pinup, it's naughty to goad.

OP posts:
Zarqoun · 24/08/2013 20:24

I'd be interested to hear about what sort of behaviour (other than freeloading) they have displayed that has led to this level of detachment. I ask this as the mother of a child who has behaved in such a way as to lead me to detach from her in a way that many people would find alarming.

ShipwreckedAndComatose · 24/08/2013 20:25

Did you not pick up on the fact that op could not go to the hospital because of the cold and that this is why she mentioned it??

paperlantern · 24/08/2013 20:26

they didn't freeload. dil was a guest.

Mintyy · 24/08/2013 20:27

I believe it is possible to love someone if they are fat?

Helpmehelpmydgs · 24/08/2013 20:28

I commented on her weight here, because that and her eds point to an unhealthy relationship with food. This is also displayed in the size of her ds, being that big that young, and having gained so much, so fast does not bode well for the future. She could be knocking decades off his life. If she was smoking 20 a day over him, would you be defending her choice?

OP posts:
TheFalconsmistress · 24/08/2013 20:28

What about PHONE CALLS!!!!! I know she could not visited in person at that point but what about the months after if she wanted a relationship with her Grandson she would have went to see him as soon as she was better Angry forget it i'm obviously the minority, glad of it too!!

Mintyy · 24/08/2013 20:29

That was to pinup girl, who is being extremely goady and silly.

waltermittymissus · 24/08/2013 20:30

and I don't want to end up giving or receiving "duty visits" just so I can hand over another toy

I can understand this. And I can understand why you feel that way. It's a very sad situation and I hope you all find peace with it, however it turns out.

I think, as others have said, if you do reply it should reiterate that you would love a relationship with your dgs and your door is always open to him.

I might even go so far as to ask if they'd prefer an arrangement where dgs was brought to yours for set visits.

Then if they refuse, you've done all you can.

I wouldn't mention or offer toys etc.

NoSquirrels · 24/08/2013 20:33

Yes, of course you could make a difference. Is that an honest, genuine question? I will presume it is.

In the future, the more people you have around you who love you, who can offer different points of view, who can be a source of fun and good times, who can gently offer suggestions/experiences/opinions that are different to what you get at home can only be beneficial. Your DGS will benefit from having a set of grandparents in his life, especially as it sounds as if he might not have any other GPs/loving extended family on his mother's side (I am extrapolating from the background of your DIL, who lived with an elderly relative, so this may not be the case.) You could in the future have a great relationship with your DGS. But you will need to suck it up in the short-term to get there.

You don't like your DIL. You are not fond of your DS either at the moment. You don't know your baby DGS. But it does seem cold-hearted and cutting off your nose to spite your face to refuse to have anything to do with them at all.

Don't forget that if you cut contact now, it may not be just one DGS you lose out on but subsequent DGC. I suspect it will also put a strain on your DHs relationships too as it goes on. For all these reasons I would try to be the bigger person about all this and change my own behaviour and reactions, accepting meanwhile that I cannot change other people's reactions and behaviour.

Pinupgirl · 24/08/2013 20:34

Wow.Op is being absolutely vile about her grandchild and I am getting a telling off for being "goady"-really?

Viviennemary · 24/08/2013 20:37

You are never going to see it from their point of view and they are never going to see it from yours. And you have to accept that. I think you should try and maintain a contact with your DGS even though you don't get on with either of his parents now.

Even if you are 100% in the right it doesn't make any difference whatsoever. If I were you I'd do my best to try and have a good relationship with your DGS and do whatever it takes to achieve that if it's important to you.

Charlottehere · 24/08/2013 20:37

My m thinks dd1 will want a relationship with her one day. deluded

Helpmehelpmydgs · 24/08/2013 20:37

Zarquon, in the grand scheme of things nothing that bad, just years of low level disrepect, refusal to engage in anything other than an argument. Dil2b would never sit down and have a chat about her day, she'd just say,"Fine" when asked and carry on upstairs to their room. Then every now and again ds1 would say dp not happy about the way I greeted her... Well, talk to me then! Just lots and lots of very low-level stuff. Years of being ignored in my own home just wore me down and then, I suppose, we drifted apart for the past couple of years. Now they have reappeared, angry and demanding (whether that's "stuff" or time or whatever) and I'm not responding very well to them.

OP posts:
paperlantern · 24/08/2013 20:38

help me - you stated in your op that you wanted to build a relationship with your ds to tell him he's raising his son wrong. wrong on so many levels.

yes Daily to find out how my grandchild ill in hospital was actually I would probably be at the hospital just not at the intensive care. or offering practical help such as meals shopping and house cleaning

on the walrus front I was nagged about ds weight as a baby by stupid HVs. at six he is slim and weight wise very healthy

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