Physically deformed man in cafe upset kids.

[hairylipsquid]

I met some other mums and their pre-schoolers in a cafe. After we'd sat down I noticed that a group from a local day care centre for special needs adults were sat at the adjacent table with their carers.

One of the men had a severely deformed head and face (I have to admit it did take me back somewhat). He seemed like he was trying to smile at the kids and made grunting noises like he was trying to say hello, bless him.

The 2 and 3 year-olds in the group (mainly the girls interestingly, the boys tended to just stare) started to scream and cry and say things like 'scary man mummy'. The mums pretty quickly whisked them out of the cafe.

I stayed put but had to answer some pretty loud questions from DS like 'what is the matter with that man?'. (Cue 'some people are born different', 'remember when you watch 'Something Special' conversation.)

It made me feel sad (not only for that poor man although I'm not sure he really understood what was happening) that the knee-jerk reaction had been to remove the children out of sight of the 'scary man'. Or did they do the right thing as their pfb's were being distressed by him?

What would you have done?

Gosh, I missed that one@Spero. What a horrible woman! To make someone feel bad about themselves for something about their physical appearance - something beyond their control - is just scumbag behaviour.

Thats awful Riven, if the other mother had a problem she should have been asked to leave not you.

To the OP I would have done exactly what you have done. Whisking them away does nothing except fuel the fear in the children when there is nothing to be afraid of.

My best friend growing up had CP and used to regulary get children staring and asking questions but thats normal and what children should do, it is how they learn to understand. Its when its adults acting that way it is wrong.

Reading this has reminded me though, its not that long ago that parents were complaining about Kerry from Cbeebies scaring children and making them ask awkward questions.

Awful that some parents are so intolerant.

Nanny - especially as the poor blokes had their arms and legs blown off fighting for their country!

I think I have already mentioned this on another thread, but my absolute heroine in this regard was the wife of an RAF pilot who was badly burned in WW2. They went to the Ritz for tea and a couple sitting nearby asked for them to be moved as her husband's face upset them!!

She went over and threw a glass of water over them and said words to the effect of 'how dare you'. What a woman.

Spero - exactly! Shocking. I mean that. I am truly shocked that anyone could be so rude, lacking in any class and so very cruel.

The CBeebies Kerry thing sickened me, too. Who are these people, who think that their children will be in any way harmed by seeing someone different? FFS. It's beyond precious. It's shameful.

Some really awful stories on here.
DS is still too young to notice difference / disability and I intend to educate him so he understands it once he does.
Those parents should all be thoroughly ashamed of themselves. They may not always have the option of running away. Do they think they and their families all have magic immunity to deformity or disease or disability?!?

DS (aged 3 at the time) was once frightened by a man with quite severe learning difficulties, who was in the children's library. It wasn't about the way he looked, it was that he suddenly started grunting very loudly and semi-shouting. Thankfully his carer took him out fairly quickly, but by then DS was already terrified and ran to me in floods of tears. I seem to recall that we had to leave not long afterwards because he was still so scared. How awful to have that effect on people and not be able to do much about it.

At the same time I couldn't understand why they had taken him into the children's library; it's a huge library with loads of seating areas plus a cafe. It was a weekday afternoon and not full by any means so I'm sure there would have been space for them to sit away from the children's section. While they were there (before the man started shouting) they were just sitting, not using any particular facilities, so there didn't appear to be any particular reason for choosing that part of the library.

I have to say that before he started shouting it was clear that the man had learning difficulties, so with that in mind I was glad that the children could see someone like him in their play area. It was such a shame, then, that his shouting became caused a disturbance. Poor DS was traumatised and for weeks afterwards would only step into that library after lots of reassurance that the man wouldn't be there any more. I used the opportunity to explain to him that the man had an illness which made him get upset like that sometimes, and that everyone is different.

It's such a tricky area, and I don't imagine there are any easy solutions, since there is such a wide range of types of disability and nobody can predict how a child will respond to what.

Are you sure the children were being whisked away purely because of their distress or do you think that the mothers might have been trying to salvage the situation and not further damage this mans feelings.

I know from experience with my nephew that despite my sisters best efforts when he was young he was always afraid of anyone who looked different including people who were a different colour to him. I don't know where he got it from because he was certainly not taught to be prejudiced I think it was just fear of the unknown.

When he got frightened he would get hysterical and no amount of careful explaining would have calmed him down and he would have caused a big embarrasing scene.

In this situation I would have apologised to the man for my nephews behaviour but then removed my nephew and explained to him away from the situation that people can look different and it isn't something he should be afraid of.

It took him until about the age of 6 to grow out of this but he is very highly strung and gets anxious over trivial things.

Erm, my son will always wish to use the childrens library , even when he us 30 I expect.

He has learning difficulties. The clue us in the title. And he found War and Peace depressing..

Had my dd been crying and creating about a man shouting I would gave gently encouraged her to get a fucking grip.

"At the same time I couldn't understand why they had taken him into the children's library; it's a huge library with loads of seating areas plus a cafe. It was a weekday afternoon and not full by any means so I'm sure there would have been space for them to sit away from the children's section. While they were there (before the man started shouting) they were just sitting, not using any particular facilities, so there didn't appear to be any particular reason for choosing that part of the library."

You are jocking right?

Agree pagwatch!

I find it surprising they even noticed...my children have seen various people with various physical differences and never said a peep!

I certainlynever thought they'd notice till' they were over 4 or 5.

Riven that's shocking.

I do think about this a lot, and I feel quite lucky (is that the right word?) that we've 'slipped through the net' with this kind of situation, ie the kids have seen a huge variety of people, and its never once shocked or scared them, and they've never said anything rude or hurtful. But yes oh yes, butterflyeffect, those 'look at the fat tummy' comments are a killer

I will never ever forget a lovely lady we met on the train home once. Ds was about 4 I think, and we got on next to the wheelchair space, followed by the lady and her family. She was paralysed from the neck down, communicating through voice thingy with a headstick. Ds asked me why she couldnt move/walk/was in a wheelchair etc, and she heard him and asked him to come and chat. They talked together for the whole length of the journey. She was such a lovely lovely person. Which is digressing slightly, but I'll always remember her for being so sweet to my ds.

Agree pagwatch, unfortunately some children do react badly when they see someone who is "different". However that doesn't mean it is ever acceptable make those with learning difficulties or physical deformities hide away from them.

If the child has the problem they should leave.

Jeez some of the stories are on here are awful. I can't understand how people an be so intolerant.

I would have been furiuos with the other mums for leaving.

I hope I can teach DD to be more tolerant. My mums best friend has cerbal palsy and lives in a house with 10 other people with physical disablilities. DD goes with mum regularly to see them and has never been afraid. She has asked why some peoples legs don't work and why do they have wheels instead (she means wheel chairs) and I have explained about how people are all different.

I am absolutly shocked by your story Riven. I makes me really angry.

it's the school of hard knocks, butterfly.

'Had my dd been crying and creating about a man shouting I would gave gently encouraged her to get a fucking grip.'
haha, yes exactly right.
Of course the mothers in question may have wanted to reduce their own embarrassment, or the distress of the children, or the rudeness towards the man, or any combination. it's hard to guess and probably they wouldn't have been able to identify the main reason.
my dds are very well used to being around people with learning and physical disabilities, and usually they are supremely unconcerned and oblivious. I only recall one instance in a cafe (with Mrs Badger/Pruni in fact) when a man on the same table (it was one of those communal type places) was horizontal and making loud and (seemingly) distressed noises. I basically followed pagwatch's advice, because that seemed to be the best option but it was in the balance, because I was conscious that my dd's distress was potentially hurtful for the man.
It isn't always easy to cope with those kind of situations especially if you didn't have much experience. our responsibility is to keep trying.

I was bending over tickling and playing with Dd I a shop, this woman smiled when she heard me, she couldn't see DD who was behind some clothes.

Then she came past the rack of clothes and actually saw DD, who has SN, her face froze and she looked away abruptly. People do the same when DD is singing or waving on the bus. Yet give them a child who doesn't have slurred speech and flap their hands and they will coo away for hours.

Incidentally I find it a bit shocking that you have actually asked us should you have whisked your child away from the poor man.

I just read wilhelminaAteHer's post and there are no words to describe your stunning ignorance.

"It isn't always easy to cope with those kind of situations especially if you didn't have much experience. our responsibility is to keep trying"

Exactly. If we don't even try, how can we expect our children to learn to have tolerance/compassion/kindness?

Fanjo and Riven I might be pregnant and hormonal but I can't believe these people

what a hideous post WilheminaAteHer!

Wilhelmina, it is your attitude that makes Riven and Pag et al's lives just that bit more difficult. Shame on you.