I'm a Sleep Scientist

[Goodnightythen]

I specialised in neurodevelopmental conditions and the importance of sleep in our children's brain development. I worked a lot with children with Autism as well as other frontal lobe related conditions such as ADHD, FASD, ED, ODD, PD, etc.
I don't do much work in sleep labs anymore but AMA!

Oh!

My 19 year old has had insomnia for about a decade. How could I get him a proper sleep study where is actually somewhere we're people can watch him sleep? He is borderline ADOS but definitely ASD imo.

How do you proceed when deliberate, planned approaches like this just result in you going to work on zero sleep/awake for 34 hours/a brief absence of total awareness for 20 minutes on the bus home on day 2 followed by another sleepless night/a early night of 5.48am/back to 4.40am being lucky/etc? But when you do actually fall asleep by some miracle because you've managed to sit in the dark since 4pm and no bugger has switched a single light on because that'll instantly snap you wide awake for another 6-8 hours, you sleep like the Dead for no more than 1-3 sleep cycles with an initial light sleep phase of about 90 seconds?

I could write a book on sleep hygiene. None of it bloody works. And neither have sleeping tablets, tranquilisers or sodding antidepressants, which incidentally kept me awake for five nights in a row - the GP said 'Oh that's not supposed to happen' and that was it.

Is melatonin ok to take with other meds like thyroxine or blood pressure tabs?

i need better quality sleep and thought it might help.

Sleep is part of the development of the brain. When we sleep we consolidate the information learnt in the day. In children with ND the development is compromised and so therefore is the sleep. This is why there is a strong correlation between neurodevelopmental conditions and poor sleep. If DH's sleep improves, his daytime functioning will improve.

What are your thoughts on sleep training babies/young children? In terms of a) ethics b) effectiveness c) long term outcomes?

Thank you

Thank you, your explanation has definitely helped. Some nights he wakes due to seizure activity but always goes straight back to sleep when it is a seizure related waking. Other nights he wakes and is hyper, those are the nights he can go from 11.30pm until 9am. I keep things dark and quiet if possible but some nights he is so loud I feel I have no option but to move him to another room as he literally wakes the neighbours. Those are the nights I struggle with the most, even if I have to move him to another room I try to keep things dark and quiet but would I be better putting on some sleep sounds? His tonsils are enlarged but we are awaiting a sleep study and an ENT appointment to see if adenoids are involved too. He's also dependent on a sleep system to keep him in a safe position but this means at some point in the night he usually needs repositioning plus he has overnight medications and a feed running which all means there are disturbances for him which can't be avoided.

Best to check with whoever prescribed you the meds - also you can find naturally occurring melatonin in cherries, oatmeal, milk, and other things if you are worried about contraindication.

Interesting, Thanks!
I haven't had a full nights sleep for over a year, since my 13 month old was born. I'm up feeding her throughout the night multiple times. So, although I am getting bouts of sleep, it's broken sleep.
How detrimental is this to my health?
I know it's bad for us but we're expected to just put up with it & do it.

Thanks for this, so fascinating!

I would like to know if there are any supplements that are beneficial for sleep, and if you take any yourself?

I have been taking magnesium bisglycinate and feel it has drastically improved my ability to fall back asleep during night time wake ups, but I'm not sure if it's placebo.

I’m a natural night owl but would prefer to go to bed at 9 and be up at 5. I keep trying but I lie awake for hours. Any tips?

Thank you. Thats quite interesting as I have been told previously that either its not possible, or really easy! I think I'll just stick with what I prefer 😁

That’s interesting re milk / melatonin. I crave milk. And always have a glass before bed.

I’ve always shouted out in my sleep and used to sleep walk until my 20’s

what’s behind it?

I didn't 'cry it out' sleep train my daughter, much to the horror of my colleagues at the sleep lab. This is because I decided to keep a close eye on her circadian development and moved my life around her developing sleep patterns. But I was exhausted by this, because our modern lives mean that we have to be awake all night for our babies and awake all day for our jobs.

It's each to their own I guess, I just did what came naturally to me as I was breastfeeding and enjoying it, but also very knowledgeable about sleep so able to pick up on things.

Will probably be a different story for the second!

I'm 50. Peri menopausal with hrt. Adhd taking Elvanse. Magnesium before bed.

Am I destined to walk around telling myself and anyone who will listen to me that "I'm tired" from now until I die?!! Catch me at any point from about midday and I'll moan how tired I am! I bore myself!!

I've recently quit drinking. And I've stopped waking in that 2-3am window. Great news.

But I'm still absolutely fecked!

Bed anywhere 9-1030 pm. Probably asleep by 11. I do feel better dropping off while reading on my phone or with tv noise in the background. An adhd thing I think. The reading or the white noise helps me shut off.

I'm up by 730 at the latest. (Sleep a bit disturbed 5.10/5.30/6am as DH gets up and leaves the house)

Do you think it could work the other way around? That poor sleep could actually cause some of the symptoms of ADHD and ASD?

I’m just thinking about a current thread on here wondering why cases have risen and we already know that none of us get as much sleep now as we used to.

Sleep walking and talking is a common parasomnia. Most kids grow out of it. When we sleep there is a part of the brain that 'switches off' our bodily actions so that we don't play out our dreams. Sleep walkers/ talkers are asleep but that part of the brain isn't switching. They are getting sleep, but whether they are not getting enough would depend on the individual - maybe the parasomnia is stopping the individual from getting to all the different stages of sleep, stopping them from getting to REM sleep for example, which means they aren't getting enough quality sleep rather than quantity.

Is there anything that can stop nightmares? Some are not even nightmares just wierd. It's every night and multiple times. I sometimes get sleep paralyses no dreams while I'm having an episode though I just wake up not being able to move. No bad thing happening just not moving.

I'd just love to sleep without any dreams at all really.

Personally I won't do an assessment for e.g. Autism until the child is at least 4/5. There are toddler modules on the ADOS but these aren't always reliable. So in answer to the question - an infant/ toddler might have very poor sleep and later on it might turn out they are neurodiverse. Or, they might have very poor sleep and it later turns out they are just poor sleepers with no neurodivergence. If an infant/ toddler is getting significantly less than the recommended amount, (12-15 hours every 24 hours), maybe, but you can't tell until they are older.

I have ME/CFS. One way that affects me is that I find it very hard to fall asleep and stay asleep, and my sleep is very poor quality. What mechanisms are going on there? I had no sleep problems before. (Fortunately I’ve found a medication that helps.)

Do you sleep well?

marking, thank you for starting this thread.

My son is autistic and sleeps like a dream, well now he’s 12 but was a nightmare when he was younger, me on the other hand it’s bad, I toss and turn multiple times I wake myself up and if I dream it usually triggers me awake in the early hours and I can’t get back to sleep before the alarm goes off.
I think it’s because I did nights for 5 years and got used to surviving on 4/5 hours but I stopped in 2020 and it’s not right.
I track my sleep on my Fitbit and I wake 20-30 in a 5/6 hour sleep

After 50, it seems I get up to the toilet most night, around 3. Is this it forever more?

Hi. I can’t sleep at normal times without pills. If I let my sleep cycle be its natural rhythm I would fall asleep later every night. So say 2 am one night then 3 or 4 the next and etcetera. But for the most part my brain wants to stay awake at night and sleep when it’s light or nearly light outside. It isn’t linked to anxiety or depression. I try to be normal but doing so means I only sleep every two days and at at least 2 am.

I’ve tried melatonin. It helps here and there but it’s not very good. What would be the treatment plan from a specialist? As I’m hoping to be referred to one by my psychiatrist, who doesn’t believe in prescribing benzodiazepines long term. For context my mum, sister and son suffer the same delayed type of cycle. Just night people really. I’ve been like this all my adult life