I'm a Freemason AMA

[FreemasonAMA]

I will not go into some details, but I will try to answer as many questions as I can.

But you don't need a club to be a good person, which you agreed with a few posts after that one ^ so why the freemasons? Why not just strive for those things alone?

As above

The only thing that stops me joining is the fact that A) I find it pointless. My partner is a very high up mason, head of county and says the women’s is just for show. You don’t get told or get to do half the things then men’s lodges do.

As I explained upthread, there are different branches ("obediences") of Freemasonry including those that accept women in mixed lodges as well as women-only ones. Google the ones I mentioned upthread and contact one of them. See for yourself.

Your DP might tell you that those obediences are not 'real Masons' but he is wrong

2) it’s SO sexist. I have a huge issue with this! My partner persistently tells them to let women join but they never do.

That sounds like Grand Lodge. He would be better suited to the Grand Orient.

When people are saying what do you do there, they read scripts that already have the words done for you, it’s like a play. They act out with props.

Yes, those are the rituals and ceremonies. That is not all we do, though.

The initial ceremony involves a noose around your neck so you can’t step backward and a dagger over your heart so you can’t rush forwards.

That is not the meaning of those "props"

The “secrets” are metaphors so you can develop yourself as a person, nothing actually secret at all. Just phrases etc.

Yes.

Here’s a link, sorry don’t know how to do fancy ones. You can copy and paste and this tells you basically what is said/what the “script” is. The different people are all different roles to “play” as you get higher up.

www.bilderberg.org/First_Degree.htm

Also, another sexist thing. In the “first degree” aka the initiation, the man is asked to bear his left breast to make sure he isn’t female! It’s so sexist it really grieves me.

However, I can’t deny the charity work they do. My DP’s lodge has just raised something crazy like 1/2 a million in the past 5 years. Really good.

I think I have come to the end of the questions for tonight. I'll check back tomorrow.

Well the point of going to a concert is to hear a band live, which sounds different to listening to a recording. There's also a bit of chat in between so a totally different experience.

Going to school isn't about just reading a book so that comparison falls short, doesn't it?

It sounds like you don't actually know what the point is, because there isn't really one.

Glad 31weeks has posted, I have a feeling her version is much closer to reality. I'd never be in a relationship with one, mind. For the very reasons posted...

Yes, you are in the women’s/mixed lodge and he is in the grand lodge. I’ve no purpose op than just to tell you, senior masons we’re friends with tell me time and time again, don’t waste your time becoming a female mason. You don’t get the same “degree’s”.

And yeah I know about the noose and dagger things but I was just giving an easy summary. Hope this has helped anyone a bit more than being vague about what goes on.

Madmags it does cause some arguments mainly that we have a two year old daughter that I have to explain to that daddy goes to a sexist organisation that set up a women’s lodge to let women have a turn and not complain about being left out. But aren’t actually allowed to play with the big boys themselves. it does stir some feelings in me, so apologies if I’ve derailed the thread OP but think it wasn’t particularly clear before what masons actually did.

Yes, you are in the women’s/mixed lodge and he is in the grand lodge... senior masons we’re friends with tell me time and time again, don’t waste your time becoming a female mason. You don’t get the same “degree’s”.

You misunderstood. Sorry I wasn't clear.

Grand Lodge is a major branch of Freemasonry that doesn't accept women as full members. That is where your DP is. He says trying to become a female mason is a waste of time, because his branch does not allow women to the same degrees as men.

For example, Grand Orient is another major branch of Freemasonry that accepts women as full members. It is not a waste of time to be a Freemason there. Women do the same thing as men, climb the same degrees.

Le Droit Humain is yet another branch, which was established back in 1800s. Again, it's not a waste of time to be a Freemason there. It is international and it's called British Federation in the UK.

If you are interested, look into the other branches of Freemasonry that treat women as equals. Your DP's branch is not the only one.

And now I really have to sleep but I'll come back tomorrow.

I can imagine that's a struggle, 31. Glad you're calling out the bullshit.

Sorry OP, I’m not being very clear

I understand very clearly that there are two branches with lodges, and the differences. I understand you still climb the degrees. I get it - I’ve looked into them many times over the years. But I’m just telling you, you really don’t in the same ways. I’m not up for joining a separate branch and lodge to my partner, because his doesn’t accept women. A consolation prize isn’t something I’m happy with. And that’s what it is, another lodge (group of, organisation, branch) that lets women join, to simmer down the sexist of the male grand lodges branch. I’m telling you, you don’t do the same, have the same teachings and it’ll never be “the same” which is a real shame. Of course, please do sleep or whatever you’re doing. You don’t need to reply, just wanted to let you know but cool thread!

Well the point of going to a concert is to hear a band live, which sounds different to listening to a recording. There's also a bit of chat in between so a totally different experience.

And you know that because you have been to a concert or two so know that the experience is much better than sitting at home with the CD on.

That was the point. It's hard to explain to people who have no knowledge or experience of it why you would prefer to be part of the organisation and join in the discussions there to just trying to be a better person with a better intellect on your own.

Going to school isn't about just reading a book so that comparison falls short, doesn't it?

Again, that is the point. You know that going to school isn't about reading a book because you have been to schools. You go there to learn but that learning is much more than what you would have if you just sat at home and read the school books.

It sounds like you don't actually know what the point is, because there isn't really one.

I hope you now see the point after reading this post.

Glad 31weeks has posted, I have a feeling her version is much closer to reality.

Yes, it's closer to the reality of her DP's branch of Freemasonry. It's not news to anyone here, especially after reading this thread, that there is a branch of Freemasonry that excludes women. There are others that include women.

Have you read the thread?

No need to be rude.

Of course I have, still don’t get it. This is AMA.

31, thank you for your posts

A consolation prize isn’t something I’m happy with. And that’s what it is, another lodge (group of, organisation, branch) that lets women join, to simmer down the sexist of the male grand lodges branch.

Sorry but you are wrong. Grand Orient is not a "consolation prize" and it did not separate from Grand Lodge back in 1800s over the question of whether women should be admitted. They separated over the question of God - whether candidates had to believe in God. For many years, they did not accept women, either.

I'm happy to talk more about this tomorrow. Good night.

*You’ve said a few times that people should RTFT but I have and I still don’t get what the purpose of it is?

Like; you join a tennis club to play tennis. That’s it’s purpose.

What’s the purpose of it? Not the wishy washy press release version. What is the point of being a Mason? What’s it for?*

Exactly what I meant.

*My partner is a free-mason and we’ve talked about it at great legnth over the years, so I consider myself to know nearly everything he does, been in his lodge, seen the trap door, the rough ashlar to the smooth cube. minus the secret words

The only thing that stops me joining is the fact that A) I find it pointless. My partner is a very high up mason, head of county and says the women’s is just for show. You don’t get told or get to do half the things then men’s lodges do.
2) it’s SO sexist. I have a huge issue with this! My partner persistently tells them to let women join but they never do.

When people are saying what do you do there, they read scripts that already have the words done for you, it’s like a play. They act out with props. The initial ceremony involves a noose around your neck so you can’t step backward and a dagger over your heart so you can’t rush forwards. The “secrets” are metaphors so you can develop yourself as a person, nothing actually secret at all. Just phrases etc. My partner pays £200 odd a month membership fee and that includes dinner twice a month 3 course, very expensive and old lodge (building) where they host it with the “temple” in. I genuinely think it’s just a break from nagging women. (The men’s)

Basically it’s a dining club with a bit of spiritual advancement thrown in. Nothing too secret at all. Everything can be found online if you are good at a google search. confused*

An actual answer. Thank you!

Waitrose pigeon, I put a link in a few posts ago. That’s a link to what the scripts are/what happens at the lodge gatherings. It’s the first degree/the initiation into masonry. 👍🏻

Am I right in thinking that by "Grand Orient" and "Grand Lodge" you are referring to en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continental_Freemasonry and en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regular_Masonic_jurisdiction

Which would mean that the branch of Masonry you're involved in is the minority in the UK. (Personally I wasn't aware of it before your thread.)

Thank you OP. DH was interested to hear.

have no question but you just totally owned that previous poster. grin Brilliant

It wasn’t brilliant.

I have never heard of this. You mean, like a piercing?

Ive no idea. I was 10 years old and had found a little book when making my parents bed one weekend. I had a quick look in the way you do when you know your doing something naughty and in my mind thats what I read.

Ive read the full thread now and to pick up on a few points made by other posters.

Regarding MP's - www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/feb/04/two-freemasons-lodges-operating-secretly-at-westminster

The Police - Brian Paddick and Steve White have both written about their experience of/views on Masons within the police force.

Sadiq Khan on the move towards making it compulsory for those in the police to say if they are masons -

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/masons-freemasons-freemasonry-in-the-police-corruption-cover-up-conspiracy-theories-united-grand-a7333116.html

Not really sure how OP can spell it out any clearer for people what the point of it is. People are being deliberately obtuse because, for some reason, they have a weird issue with the Freemasons.

I don’t have a weird issue. I have no opinion on it, just wanted clarity.

@HattieAndHerBoy Oh I thought it was. You're allowed to think otherwise of course