Elon Musk makes bombshell claim about his transgender child

I'd like to add the research to the Puberty Blockers thread if you can post it. Thanks.

These decades of experience, is this available to look at? Can you post say, the top 3 studies that show children who have taken puberty blockers and then stopped at 16 and have grown to fully continue their puberty and go on to have healthy children?

It's depressing to see posters dismissing the harm done to children by puberty blockers and cross sex hormones - I thought we were done with that years ago once the tactics of the trans lobby to stop all research into this were exposed.

Still - as an antidote to fake news - here's an excellent discussion that was posted on another thread and centres on the health and wellbeing of girls and young women. The type of informed responsible discussion that most of us are used to involving the compassionate Elaine Miller. Really worth listening to - especially if you're not up to date with the emerging scandal of this abuse of children and young people:

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5128255-elaine-miller-talking-about-women-on-testosterone

B

Edited to include the thread as link not working

Who are these children who are prescribed puberty blockers in their early teens or younger and stop taking them at 16? Why are they doing this, do you think, assuming it's happening?

But it makes perfect sense to the rest of us, @PlanetJanette , so maybe you're the one with the comprehension issues.

So you don't have any evidence that "it is common for a parent who is hostile to a particular minority to find that their child who is part of that minority goes no contact while a child who is not does not go no contact". You have your gut feeling, as I have mine.

My post assumes nothing. I have explained, with evidence, why I believe Mr Musk does have a relationship with his other children - which was the only intention of my initial post that you chose to respond to. I have further engaged you by speculating that I don't think it's terribly likely that Mr Musk's rampant 'transphobia' was the reason for the relationship breakdown. I have also provided my reasoning for that belief, and acknowledged that it is impossible to know for sure without knowing either party. I have very definitely not assumed "that because of what Musk posts on social media, we can deduce what his relationship with his children is like". On the contrary, I have repeatedly agreed that we are obviously only seeing a carefully curated image of what Musk wants us to see and that "it's impossible to really know what goes on and probably not terribly helpful to speculate". I have however pointed out that the many photos and videos of him and his children seemingly sharing a close relationship are unlikely to be faked. Or are you suggesting that he has kidnapped his older children and forced them to pose for smiling family photos with him, and also somehow forced his toddlers to pretend they're extremely comfortable and affectionate with him when they're really not?

You have answered none of the points I raised, you have offered no evidence whatsoever and keep talking about your own personal feelings - which are totally irrelevant to anyone other than you, and totally irrelevant to any situation other than your own. You can't even seem to keep track of your own argument and just keep repeating the same things which have little to no relevance to what I or anyone else is talking about. They are no more true than they were the first time you said them. With respect, I think there is therefore very little point in continuing this conversation.

This is just word salad that makes no sense.

If you believe that a child of a bigoted parent who is the subject of their bigotry is going to feel exactly the same way about their parent as a child who is not the subject of their bigotry, I would suggest you have never been part of a group that is routinely the subject of bigotry and marginalisation.

As a gay person with a lot of gay friends - let me tell you that the person most directly affected by a parents bigotry feels it most acutely and is more likely to choose to go no contact than a sibling, even one who does not share in their parents' bigotry.

Your post assumes a lot. It assumes close sibling relationships. It assumes a particular standard in terms of standing up for a sibling and what that entails. It assumes that because of what Musk posts on social media, we can deduce what his relationship with his children is like.

We're not talking about someone stopping them at 20, and in practice it is not advised for anyone to be on puberty blockers for eight years anyway.

But you just need to look at the decades of usage of puberty blockers to understand how the body reacts when they stop being used (spoiler - it returns to producing the body's natural sex hormones).

Puberty blockers cause 'lack of sexual maturity' like the contraceptive pill causes 'inability to get pregnant', i.e. true in the technical sense, but only on a temporary basis while those drugs are being taken.

In reality, no one is on puberty blockers long past the age of 16 or, at a push, 18.

We have decades of experience of the effects when children come off puberty blockers and the body's return to hormone production resulting in resumption of a natural puberty.

A poster said this:
Elon musk's son has clearly followed the medical pathway. They won't have sexual function.
It's speculation as posters have no idea what "pathway" anyone has followed. And it's completely inappropriate and irrelevant to be speculating about an adults "sexual function".

These are human beings you know. Whatever you think about gender ideology, talking about actual humans as if they are some sort of lab rat is not OK.

Where’s the evidence that a person who starts taking puberty blockers at 12 and stops taking them at 20 will resume a normal puberty?

We're not speculating. Some posters are adamant that taking puberty blockers into adulthood does not cause lack of sexual maturity, other posters are telling them they're wrong.

Yes because those are terms for children that believe sexist stereotypes are what make you male or female. Plenty of people who believe in gender but aren't trans such as you agree with this and think that anyone not playing along with the delusion is transphobic.

If you didn't use terms for believers to describe everyone it would be much clearer but in the cult of gender, non compliance is not allowed. You can't bring yourself to admit that it's not appropriate to call people cis if they don't specifically identify as such. If you did then you would be admitting genderism is a belief system rather than reality.

Sexuality is reality, people are either gay, straight or bisexual. It's got nothing to do with gender and that's partly why genderism is so homophonic.

I don't know why we are speculating about someone's "sexual function" on Mumsnet just because that person's father happens to be famous and decided to bring their child up in an interview. 🤢

I was responding to your comment at 10.40 when you accused me of using "a weird amount of supposition about family relationships none of us can really know about". I explained why I had come the conclusion I had (that Musk has a good relationship with his other children). My original comment that you were responding to was a reply to someone else who asked how we could know he had a good relationship with his other children. If you click "show quote history" you can see the whole conversation.

I think it's very obvious that Elon Musk currently holds what you would call transphobic views. I think the fact that he took his child to a doctor and signed consent for him to receive puberty blockers strongly suggests that he did not always have these views, and therefore the reason for the estrangement is probably not his 'transphobia'. Although it is of course possible that after he saw what the medication was doing, he changed his views and that is what caused the divide. Who knows. This is not however what the boy has claimed, he has bitterly complained his father was absent and then stated he was mocked for being 'queer'. This also doesn't seem particularly likely from a man who took the boy to a gender clinic and signed off on puberty blockers - but again, who knows. You seem very willing to believe the boy and disbelieve Musk but even so, you're not agreeing with what the boy himself is saying! Why do you keep saying that he is not ND? In the posted reply he does not deny being slightly autistic? I don't have Threads so don't know if he refuted that claim elsewhere.

Do you have any evidence that "it is common for a parent who is hostile to a particular minority to find that their child who is part of that minority goes no contact while a child who is not does not go no contact"? I would suspect that children growing up together (especially when so close in age as these children) would side with each other against anyone attacking them. For example, my brother is gay. If my father decided to become a homophobe and my brother no longer felt he wanted a relationship with him, I would side with my brother. I wouldn't keep playing happy families with my bigoted father and pretend my brother doesn't exist! I would think that was a more usual reaction, though I confess it's pure conjecture. But the fact the siblings stay close to the 'bigoted' father despite his 'transphobic' views would suggest that either they do not care about his these views, or that they agree with them. Do you not think it at all odd that growing up closely with a transperson hasn't made them very pro-trans rights, and extremely defensive of anyone who would attack their brother? I'm struggling to make sense of your version of events, I'm afraid.

You know even the Cass Review does not support the claims on here that puberty blockers cause permanent sterilisation, right?

I have no idea why you are listening to a 4 year study done by a highly respected professional in the field with a team of highly qualified researchers rather than a random TRA on Mumsnet.

Well no, my view is not supposition.

My view, broken down, is:

(a) Elon Musk has views about trans people and their rights that I, and most others who support trans rights, would regard as transphobic;

(b) Elon Musk's child is transgender.

(c) It is common for a parent who is hostile to a particular minority to find that their child who is part of that minority goes no contact while a child who is not does not go no contact.

Therefore, it should not be noteworthy that Musk's transgender daughter has a different view of their relationship than his son who is not transgender.

That's not supposition.

I also haven't 'declared' that he was a terrible father. I've no idea what sort of father he was. I do know, because it's public now, that he has posted some things that imply some problematic views about gay stereotypes, and publicly shared sensitive (and seemingly incorrect) information about his child's neurodivergence. And I do know what he says in public about trans people.

All of those facts suggest to me that it seems very reasonable that his transgender daughter would want nothing to do with him.

You really think that a child who is trans, and a child who is not trans, would both 'feel the same' about their transphobic parent?

Do you think straight children and gay children feel the same about homophobic parents?

See my reply to CassieMaddox. You keep using the word supposition but you don't seem* *to understand what it means? Declaring that he was a terrible father who drove his child away by being 'transphobic', and that his siblings have sided with the father as they're 'cisgender' is supposition. You have not even tried to point to any evidence, you've just decided it makes sense to you and so therefore must be true. I have pointed out many actual examples that show the contrary, and explained how they support my position.

Of course, I imagine he is only going to post things that suggest he has a positive relationship with his children - he's hardly likely to post videos of them screaming they hate him or crying as he misses their bedtime yet again, though I would suspect such things have happened at some point with at least one child. But the elder children are old enough that they could distance themselves from him if they so wished and they seem not to want to. The younger children that have appeared on film seem to absolutely adore him, and it seems unlikely that could be fake. I tend to think that his determination to have endless children is more to do with his relationship with his own father, trying to be the father that he wanted his dad to be. But that is very much armchair psychology, I of course have no idea. I know I am coming across like I really want to defend him, and I don't really mean to - I think it is very dodgy that he has so very many boys and has never been seen to show much interest in his daughters. Though again, behind closed doors they may be super close, it's impossible to really know what goes on and probably not terribly helpful to speculate. The facts however remain that his relationships with the direct siblings of the trans child and with at least a couple of his youngest do appear strong as it seems very unlikely he could be faking it.

I should imagine that a transgender child would feel the same as a cisgender child as those are terms used by people that believe in genderism. The vast majority of people aren't followers of that belief system and therefore shouldn't be referred to as trans or cis. You know this full well but keep insisting that everyone follows your religious tenets.

None of that addresses what I said. I didn't dispute what is posted on social media.

But it is ridiculous to say that the image someone presents on social media should be taken as gospel as to their real life. Social media images can give us no indication at all of what someone is like as a parent of what their children feel about them.

Similarly, the fact that siblings have different thresholds for not having contact with a parent also tells us very little. People are individuals, with different triggers, different tolerances for how people behave etc. A very obvious example here - it shouldn't be surprising to anyone that a transgender child will have a different view of their transphobic parent than a cisgender child.

Supposition about motivation based on social media is absolute nonsense.

Parents of gender confused children regularly get called abusers for not blindly affirming and even get their kids taken off them.

Musk's words will have struck a deep chord with thousands of such parents in the US and beyond. This is good. It will hopefully reassure these parents that they are not alone is disagreeing with the mind virus that is damaging their children.

Musk was brave and right to say the truth out loud. I mean, its' sad that things have come to such a pass that only people with 'fuck you money' like Musk and JKR are safe enough to speak the truth out loud. But where they speak, others will follow and the TRA edifice will continue to collapse.

I love to see it.