Thread 3: A corpus-assisted discourse analysis of linguistic transphobia on Mumsnet

happy to print Scraped and Furious Viper on a t-shirt if anyone fancies it

It actually says that you need to apply for an online ticket. Which suggests to me that - in an application of foresight and intelligence which has until now been lacking - they anticipate an influx of scraped and furious vipers.

Here’s the Eventbrite index for events by the FL department: https://www.eventbrite.com/o/34137004949

Screenshots

https://www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/forensic-linguistics-and-artificial-intelligence-online-tickets-855861834787

Online tickets are supposedly sold out

This is next week’s event:

https://www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/forensic-linguistics-and-artificial-intelligence-in-person-tickets-855866318197

Speakers include the original 2 Super Automatic Dox Machine Scrapers and the Head Honcho at Aston Forensic Linguistics Dep.

The PhD student is yet to rearrange the talk they/them cancelled due to ‘illness’.

Someone up thread mentioned an Aston University event next week.

I thought that had been cancelled.

If not is it anything to do with this department and is it online?

I did try and search but couldn't find anything.

Thanks

Both people leading on that project for Aston have used the MN data (Kredens in the infamous ‘sandbox’ presentations, and Grant in at least one paper which used the adoption threads).
The project is about authorship attribution.

So a) they might not be trying to identify that Talulahalula is Mrs PissedOff from Large Town in the U.K., but they are trying to create a tool which identifies who wrote what and they used MN posts to train their LLM to do so. And b) Aston have gained to the tune of £11.3 m from work and reputations which that data scrape contributed to. And if that is not commercial gain, I am not sure what is. It was also contribute to the grant income section of the REF and again, reputation, which will contribute to PGT student fees. Etc.

[scratches head]

Remind me who in the women-vs-tra debate is allegedly funded by deep-pocketed americans?

Hmm, that's a tricky one.

Interesting that the money is given in dollars (US, presumably).

https://www.aston.ac.uk/latest-news/aston-university-forensic-linguistics-experts-partner-113-million-funding-authorship

Universities are extremely commercial enterprises now that students are essentially customers.

Thanks, Madder. Copyright seems quite a complicated area, but yes, certainly seems quite clear:

'Text and data mining for non-commercial research'

I don't know what research can actually be described as 'non-commercial', by a publically funded institution? Just because the funding comes from the government (or governments) doesn't mean it's without cost, value, or monetary impact. Seems a bit of a naive idea to suggest that higher ed is somehow outwith the normal pecuniary issues.

@ArabellaScott thanks for the update. The reliance upon exemptions mentioned: 'because of exemptions that exist for the purposes of research.)' will not hold as I understand it. (And I used to work in the academic sector in copyright'). The problems of saying its for non-commercial research is that this department uses work arising for this to bid for contracts (as I understand). They would need to have it as part of their commercial work.

The problem is bigger - I would suggest - for the second lot of data. There was intent (from what I can see in the phrasing of the research question) to at least indirectly damage the reputation of mumsnetters and thus mumsnet. This could lead to commercial damage in limiting the advertising attracted to Mumsnet should that PhD have shown that transphobia was rife. Shame on Aston.

Glad to hear that MNHQ are continuing to chase this up. Thanks @JustineMumsnet.

Interesting post @MaggieCalvert - it's a good insight into the culture of the university.

I do hope at some point that MNHQ will communicate all this to the site at large.

Many sites are using "fingerprinting" as a way to identify PBPs so VPNs can't always get you round a ban. It depends on how tech savvy the site admin are as to what still works.

Thing is, it's not just the FWR posters/board, but MNetters who have posted on the fertility and dieting boards, if I understood that Aston video correctly.

You really don't need a new device or a VPN in order to get back on the site after being banned. 😏

I can't believe that Aston are claiming that the more recent scrape hasn't breached any copyright! They're arrogant and outrageous.

A VPN and a new device will probably get you back on any site, but you won’t be able to get back into a banned user name to sign a letter.

In Lang’s case she decided she couldn’t be arsed to try and stay somewhere she wasn’t wanted.

Can people really be 'banned', in this day and age? Surely they only need to re-register, even if it needs a different IP address? I know bugger all about IT.

How about writing to the ethics committee and the data controller at Aston and outline these concerns?

surely the lack of consent from posters in combination with the limited possibility of giving consent from some posters will be an ethics/gdpr issue?

whilst we are considering our options, shouldn’t they be considering the ethical / gdpr protection as well from their end?

They can’t log in to post on a thread.

If anyone is in touch IRL they could be authorised to sign on their behalf?