Tory’s manipulation of women

A photograph of someone, who may have or may have not been at the Conservative party conference, is apparently enough evidence that this political party hate women and wholeheartedly support trans rights.

Labour or Conservative in power, you still have the same civil service who have signed up to various Stonewall campaigns. The civil service hate women.

Oh come on now!

Jamie Wallis is political hasbeen who is stepping down at the next GE anyway. He’s hardly a mover and shaker in the Tory party.

plus, he’s been discussed plenty:

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4517300-mp-comes-out-as-transgender

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4522667-More-on-Jamie-Wallis-MP

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4526097-the-logic-of-trans-activism-leads-to-surreal-debate-but-the-grown-ups-are-fighting-back-times-article

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4587802-subtle-change-in-language

This thread is one you started! www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4517663-Britains-First-Trans-MP-TW-references-rape-and-car-crash

for the record, someone could rock up here and plop down a similar opening post for any one of our UK parties and I could find similar dodgy pro trans stuff in all of them.

Trans activists targeted New Labour because Labour were in power at the time. If the Tories had been in government in the late 90s/early 2000s no doubt Press for Change would’ve s’whittled them into doing some sort of GRA as well, one that could’ve well been identical, or even perhaps worse.

That doesn’t change the historical fact that the shitty bit of legislation we are all still wrestling with the fall out from now was Labour’s shitty bit of legislation.

And yes, clearly we need to be on guard for even more shitty, anti woman legislation in future, regardless of who is in charge.

look at the surrogacy stuff coming down the pipeline, loads of European countries are completely outlawing it, but the Tories will probably want to let the markets have at it.

Seriously? Honestly it's like discussing with toddlers. I suggest you go and educate yourself about the (very carefully expressed to stay within the mumsnet guidelines) views of women on here about that individual.

Clearly, the Tories have seen which way the wind is blowing now and are doing an about turn. Cynical, but realistic. The wrong reason but the right result (provided they go through with it) and the result is the most important thing.

Meanwhile, can someone explain how Labour is the party to care about women when they don't know what a woman is? Either it's true that they don't know, in which case they are stupid. Or they do know but daren't say so, in which case they are cowards. Either way, they are not fit to govern.

I think they need watching closely, especially Ministers in positions such as Education, Health and Justice.

I would also be watching Jamie Wallis. But his blue rosette seems to render him harmless/invisible here.

If the point is that self ID is only part of the threat to women's rights then I think that's a fair one. The Conservatives say they no longer plan to reform the GRA but a lot of damage has already been done plus I am sure they're still subject to immense lobbying. I think they need watching closely, especially ministers in positions such as Education, Health and Justice.

However, regardless of what's happened in the past, there remains clear daylight between the positions of the two parties: i.e. Labour have indicated that still intend to implement self ID while the Tories have said they do not. If someone has evidence that this is not the case then I will listen, but otherwise I cannot take seriously anyone who tries to persuade me that this is not a significant and very concerning difference.

There's a lot of new posters on here, trying to convince us that is the Tories who are the enemy.
Let's just pretend that Labour knows what women are, without a shedload of humming and haaing, or straightforward denial.
And let's not worry our pretty little heads about Labour's support for reforming the GRA, when at least the Tories had the common sense to read the room and leave it alone.
Let's forget that Labour left Rosie Duffield out to dry when she was attacked by TRA's. Or that they ignored it when a meeting of Gender Critical women, held next to Party Conference was attacked (involving a member of Angela Raynor's staff).
Let's just continually rake up the past, and not look at the future.
And no, I won't be voting Tory, but I definitely won't be voting Labour.

Apologies, I Am Leo is from 2014, here is Transgender Trend’s take on it:

www.transgendertrend.com/uk-cbbc-childrens-tv-i-am-leo/

The earlier show I was thinking of (another tinder box) was Channel 4s My Transsexual Summer which aired at the end of 2011 and then again in 2012, where it became a frequently advertised, high profile feature of Channel 4’s streaming service.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Transsexual_Summer

My Transsexual Summer was a Trans Media Watch project and involved various names familiar to FWR behind the scenes such as Helen Belcher (Lib Dem candidate) & Paris Lees (of ‘trans person on Question Time fame) and starred Fox Fisher (who went on to write a ‘how to trans’ guide book for teenagers)

theguardian.com/world/2011/nov/07/my-transsexual-summer-channel-4

here’s a selection of Mumsnet threads about Stephen Whittle OBE

Whittle has been a very, very busy little bunny, trying to eradicate sex based rights from UK law.

we even coined a word to acknowledge Whittle’s contributions to this area,

to s’whittle/ s’whittling

it works much like the word ‘whittling’ only instead of shaving tiny slivers from wood until it resembles something completely different, s’whittling refers to shaving away Women’s legal protections tiny bit by tiny bit until they are no longer fit for purpose.

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/3436955-Stephen-Whittle

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/3375587-Press-for-Change

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/3397127-Stephen-Whittle-Press-for-Change-irresponsible-use-of-likely-suicides-follows-Helen-Belchers-Trans-Media-Watch

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/3398127-Stephen-Whittle-influential-TRA-asserts-We-know-we-have-Labour-behind-this-one-so-will-simply-do-our-best-to-get-them-elected-Corbyn-seems-to-confirm-this-at-Pink-News

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/3463920-Lets-go-back-to-2007

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/3212371-Where-are-all-the-trans-men-An-Answer

Whittle was the first non medical chair of WPATH, if I recall correctly.

AND Whittle makes an appearance in the horrifically misguided 2012 Children’s BBC programme ‘I Am Leo’ one of the suspected tinder boxes in the subsequent ROGD conflagration.

It's been said often enough that the GRA was originally intended to accommodate a tiny number of transsexuals.

There has never been anything in place to limit the number of GRC issued, or for the recipients to have any surgery- the only thing necessary is a diagnosis of gender dysphoria. There is no evidence that it was ever intended to accommodate a small number of people.

In addition to allowing men to be given a female birth certificate, the GRA allows the concept of 'transitioning', and gives men without the diagnosis of GD, or any medical or surgical treatment the protection of Gender Reassignment.

It is this protected characteristic that allows men into female prisons and hospital wards, and even gives men a degree of 'privacy' in dbs checks.

Self id for a GRC was a bonkers idea by the Conservative party, but it wouldn't have made a jot of difference to how men are allowed into women's spaces.

Oops, forgot the link for the screenshot:
herriotts.wordpress.com/2020/05/16/the-usual-suspects-steven-whittle/

Whittle has been discussed at length on Mumsnet (and even paid us strange, finger wagging visit, where Whittle suggested that girlguides-with-vulvas could be safeguarded from girlguides-with-penises via the protective mechanism of ‘sturdy pyjamas’)

This did not start with the Gender Recognition Act; it started long before then with the group called Press For Change that was founded in the early 90s. One of their founder members was the Conservative transwoman Christine Burns. I'm quite sure the other founder members were from other parties and other political persuasions, but let's not kid ourselves that this all started on the Left because it didn't

Transactivism didn’t start on the left, no, but it was Blair’s Labour who took on Press for Change’s demands and wrote them into our law with absolutely no regard for women.

The other PFC founder was Stephen Whittle, aka the architect of the GRA, according to Pink News.

I totally agree that both trans rights activists and those willing to stand up against them exist in all our political parties though!

This.

CaronPoivre is only repeating what many have said over the past few years.

This did not start with the Gender Recognition Act; it started long before then with the group called Press For Change that was founded in the early 90s. One of their founder members was the Conservative transwoman Christine Burns. I'm quite sure the other founder members were from other parties and other political persuasions, but let's not kid ourselves that this all started on the Left because it didn't.

Under the Conservatives, Self-ID was proposed by a Conservative MP Maria Caulfield, after the Gender Recognition Act had been passed by Labour. It's been said often enough that the GRA was originally intended to accommodate a tiny number of transsexuals. So it was, until Maria and Stonewall decided to stir things up.

It was the Conservative PM Theresa May who appeared at the Pink News awards. It was under her Government that hate speech and transphobia were used as excuses to silence GC women.
David Davies MP was under considerable pressure from his own party for arranging a Women's Place meeting in the House of Commons. He was called a transphobe and out of kilter with the Conservative Party and, at that time, he most certainly was:
news.sky.com/story/tory-lgbt-group-brands-mp-david-tc-davies-transphobe-11226481

This is not a Left vs Right battle. It never was. There are LibDems, Greens and Labour members who are GC, just as there are LGBT+ groups in all the main parties, including Conservative, who support the self-id line. Conservatives still trying to make political capital out of it really need to understand that Boris Johnson wrecked that particular time bomb ages ago when he was trying to save himself and launched it prematurely at Keir Starmer. Thrown too early, it fizzled like a damp squib.

I'm never voting Tory again. Have never voted Labour and will never start. I'll either spoil my ballot or vote for a third party. Modern politics is vile.

Thanks for posting that twitter feed oldcrone. It's grown a lot since I last saw it, and it's a salutary read.

Because the Tories are out in the next election.

yes, urgency is definitely necessary.

And considering Labour are unlikely to retake Scotland, whatever happens in England at the next GE, we’ll still have the SNP throwing women’s rights away north of the border (and Labour in Wales have been as much of a part of the current gender explosion as Theresa May’s Tories)

You're really coming on these threads with your fingers in your ears saying 'can't hear you' toobig.

If everyone is so scared of what other parties will do once in power, they need to hold the Conservative's feet to the fire and get our rights to single sex spaces put into law now. Because the Tories are out in the next election.

Except it's not One Tory MP. There are loads of them. Unsurprising since they are the party responsible for this shitshow.🤷‍♀️
Yes, maybe there are, maybe there aren't. Maybe some Labour MP's support gender-critical women, apart from Rosie Duddield. But you wouldn't know it, would you.
The bottom line is that Labour's stated policy, which they still believe in, is Self-id.

It’s a pleasant treat to have been downgraded from Fascist to socially-conservative-might’ve-voted-for-brexit!

RIGHT 👏 WING 👏PEOPLE 👏ARE 👏PEOPLE

i’ve been called a Nazi so often, simply being accused of being manipulated into being right wing feels like a compliment

oh yes, and welcome to Mumsnet OP

top tip for more successful future attempts at —manipulating— directing the weak willed women of FWR: read a bit and post a bit first

we’re still unlikely to blindly follow your orders, but you might learn something in the process

This nonsense comes from the Left. The leader of the Labour Party cannot define a woman. Nuf said!

Labour put men in Women’s prisons while the Tories were in the electoral wilderness.

And in hospital wards. When he was health Secretary, Alan Johnson wrote policies saying that transpeople should be accommodated "according to their presentation: the way they dress, and the name and pronouns that they currently use". No need for surgery or a GRC.

Adding gender identity isn't a problem

Unless you claim it replaces or trumps sex

In fact it actually gives an opportunity to make the differences clear