Allison Bailey v Stonewall - Employment Tribunal hearing Thread 5

Ha! Finally got to the end of this thread so far. Some stunning contributions on here - thanks all for keeping those of us in the wrong time zones/too busy up to date with what's happening, and explaining the more esoteric points!

LOVE the Baileys shot allusion - excellent and so true, by all accounts.

I sincerely hope that BC wipes the floor with the opposition witnesses next week and that Allison wins her case.

Just to confirm @Emotionalsupportviper it is Alison Jaggar. Very active in scholarly publishing in philosophy in the 1990s, but I think there's stuff on open access now. Academia.edu may have some of her writing.

Off topic, but I don't think the Venn diagram should include the Isle of Man in GB? It something like that? I agree it's confusing.

Anyways, thank you for all of the posts and commentary.

That's wrong though.

In the article that Venn diagram's from, the statement

The British Isles is a collective term used for Great Britain, Ireland and over 6,000 smaller islands which surround them. This includes the likes of Skye, Isle of Man, Isles of Scilly and the Isle of Wight

is factually incorrect.

Won't somebody think of the chi-poos?!

swoons

Tonight I'll be drinking margaritas- made with the salty tears of TRA support dogs.

Thanks - I'll look that author up. (I've changed me name again 😁)

Must admit, I thought of Allison yesterday when I used one of my Baileys glasses (they have the logo on). Sadly it only had water in it, but I'll use one tonight for a Claimant or two while watching Eurovision. Cheers!

I find a Venn Diagram helps - like this one

In case anybody cares (I doubt it), that's not me being esv.

If you don't fancy anything that would be served with a support olive, a Stonewall umbrella or a twizzly shit-stirrer, I suggest a Claimant: a shot of Baileys, neat, cool and perfectly measured.

Thank you

😬

Ever heard a man described as “strident” no matter how forceful he is being?

Support olive - brilliant 🤩

Make mine a double

Government’s decision makers

I think it is easy to forget how far we have moved back from the brink. Each case, win or lose, makes people question the imposed orthodoxy. We have the Cass review, RRS has it on record that she was bullied and let down, everyone knows Sonia Appleby’s concerns. No debate doesn’t work for a cross examination under oath. Government’s have been held to account, the role of lobby groups exposed. Stealth attempts to change the meaning of women in the census, by the FCA, in sport have all been exposed and challenged.
Women have said no, Lesbians have said no, Gay men have said no. Hard won rights will not be spirited away in the fog of #Be Kind.

they are pounced upon and vilified because they are emotionally manipulative

Yes @Properlypaginatedbundle I've seen men get quite angry in committee meetings: slight thumping of tables, going red, tone of voice etc. Not overtly angry ranting, but enough to see there is emotion there.

But if a woman were to start to cry ... you know, the slight wobble in the voice, extreme blinking back of tears, a bit shay. Well, THAT is manipulation. Men being angry isn't emotion, it's reason & reasonable.

There's some interesting feminist scholarly work done by Alison Jaggar [sp?] on the sexual politics of emotion.

Buggerit!

I'm being a viper!

🐍 🐍 🐍

🍸... along with a support olive

🐍

There is one in safari too!

Because if we do:

a) we're demonstrating that we don't have the right 'qualities' to be promoted to the board (not bitter about this at all)

b) we're demonstrating, palpably, that we're weak and can't cope

... and then when the inevitable happens and we fall apart more publicly:

c) we're patronised for not being emotionally intelligent enough to recognise that we should have asked for help, and that asking for help demonstrates our own internal strengths.

d) we're demonstrating that we're not functioning properly as a member of the team, and that team members are always there to help others

Amongst other things.

If you are strong it is a price we have to pay really. It is the same on line. Some weak people who get upset easily complain to websites all the itme about posts and those posts are taken down. Those who never complain, put up with things or simply support freedom of speech are not really known about by the websites pulling posts because they don't complain. Hard issue to resolve in lots of contexts.

(Why is there no snake emoji?)

🐍 🐍 🐍 It is a striking MN omission (I got mine from Chrome).

(which I actually know is a load of rubbish as when I have declared my disability, I've been expected to just suck it up and get on with it like everyone else).

That is such a common experience. There is no valorisation for making accommodations for boring, everyday disabilities. Almost no large employer is willing to consider the flexibility that would allow people to stay in post and deliver a full working week.

There are no attractive decals for meeting the needs of people with disabilities. No lanyards, badges, awards for allyship, bling to put on the CV that can be parlayed into attractive job opportunities. Just the relentless grind of meeting our needs and integrating that into team management while embedding it into the organisation.