Lindsay Clancy case: was it evil, or severe mental illness?

She murdered three children. Think about that for a minute. Throw away the bloody key. Fucking evil to the core.

So irritating when posters type this. Someone is allowed to say that they dislike the premise of a thread without being told ‘off you pop, then’ or equivalent.

There is a point to be made, which I agree with, that such threads are reductionist & treating a horrific, tragic event as entertainment. ‘Pure evil’ 🙄

It’s ok for posters to say this if that’s what they think.

It's not an odd take, its a really sane take, and she is denying that she murdered them and is defending herself in court. Her choice of course, but she is not a victim in any way. I think she had depression but so do many people, probably angry that her husband didn't help enough and was resentful of her life with three children who were hard work. Maybe that's an inconvenient truth? Most people don't kill their own children in the most despicable violent horrible way, three times while sending out their partner for food, checking she would have enough time to kill them while researching how long the journey would take.

The whole case rests on her not being recognized to be psychotic so of course she was not diagnosed. And post partum psychosis is not an official diagnosis in the DSM but it is well known that depression can become psychotic if not treated. So post partum depression turning to post partum psychosis is not a stretch, and the whole way womens health after pregancy and birth is assessed is in desperate need of research, and update.

But if you look at the pattern of symptoms she was reporting during the numerous medical visits she made to ask for help, there is clear evidence of psychotic symptoms. No one seemed to take an overview, but when you look at it all together, there is a clear through line.

She was diagnosed with bipolar disorder and post-partum psychosis after the deaths of her children.

That she was not appropriately diagnosed or medicated prior to their deaths is precisely the problem.

The term evil has no place in a court of law, it’s supernatural terminology and implies that horrific acts are part of that persons intrinsic nature and gets rid of their culpability.

we use the terminology to make us feel more comfortable that there was something so deeply ‘wrong’ with that person that they could never be us ‘normal’ people. Lindsay wasn’t ‘evil’ she’s a human.

I think I just can't imagine not understanding how psychosis works. I don't understand how so many people are unable to grasp the concept of psychosis. Of course someone in active psychosis can plan things/conceal things in accordance with their delusions, whilst completely detached from reality.

The defense lawyer wanted to bin the dissident so what do you think??

You only need to look at Perez Hilton to see what's possible while in the middle of a serious mental health crisis

No it is an odd take.

she’s not denying she killed them. She is saying that she is not guilty of first degree murder due to her altered mental state at that moment in time.

extreme sleep deprivation can alter perception of reality, it is documented in scientific research, and her husband not ‘helping’ as you put it likely contributed to the situation of a further declining mental state.

no most mothers with severe pnd, sleep deprivation or psychosis don’t kill but most ‘evil’ ‘calculated’ killers don’t reach out for help and vocally tell people they are having thoughts of harming their children either and try and check themselves into mental facilities nor do they have their ex husband and ex MIL testify how much of a loving parent they were

Why are people so desperate to liken themselves to her? All the "it could have been me" videos on social media, they're sick.

THIS!!!! How is she different to Chris Watts?!?

Of course anyone who kills their kids is also mentally ill, but that means ANY child killing can be excused through mental illness?!? Apart from being mentally ill, she's also FUCKING EVIL and a MURDERER!!!!

I find it quite terrifying how many people are defending her. What the actual fuck?!

Agree!! So many ignorant comments all over social media

well there are a fair few on this thread........

So ANY child murder can be excused because all perpetrators who kill kids are all mentally ill.

So then what does psychosis actually mean? Because Lindsay Clancy says its a male voice in her head telling her to kill her children, which just happened to come on for the duration of time she killed her children, 18 minutes, and her words are that it hasn't happened before or since. This is what the case essentially rests on. The expert psychologist in court said that this would be very very unusual pattern of pscychosis. In other words, he thinks she is lying. And so do I.

Because many women have experienced post partum depression and anxiety.
So yes they literally have been sick.

As has been said, speak to anyone who has been in/worked in a psych setting. People in psychosis usually seem very flat and calm and it's only once you get them talking that you realise they are completely and detatched from reality.

I have come across post Partum psychosis twice and it’s a mental health emergency, you code it when it presents in A&E as the nature of it is that the psychosis can cause the death of the baby. And the women as clear as we may look at the sky and know it’s blue, they believe they are doing the right thing. We are not meant to comprehend this state as it’s absolutely terrifying when you see it. It takes a very vigilant supportive family and a good health service that responds to emergencies to manage this. And it can be treated, ideally in a supported mother and baby unit.

I have also known a patient who did kill her own baby during an awful post partum psychosis and as she was in the UK and received a diagnosis and MH treatment she was never put on trial.

The reality is that this is very very rare and very scary for all involved as it’s exactly the welfare of the child/ children as well as the women that are at the heart of it.

Patients suffering from psychosis often conceal, mask, or fail to recognise command hallucinations and delusions until after a psychotic crisis occurs.

LC complained of "intrusive thoughts" prior to the event which were potentially early, unaddressed stages of psychosis.

This 💯

if You can’t relate to what the women are saying they see in her story then consider yourself very fortunate.

i sadly can.

to regale you with a few stories from my own life. I had severe ante natal anxiety with my first baby, im talking about not sleeping, spiralling etc, there were a few medical scares, i was being bullied at work and i come from an abusive home, it caused my child to be born small. I referred myself to the local therapies, they rejected me because I was too articulate. So background of worrying. Unbeknownst to me she has tongue tie and I was consumed with the need to breastfeed but because she was unable to, she didn’t sleep, so for close to 3 months I survived on 2 hours sleep a day. I manage to get referred to the peri natal mental health team, they came to visit and I explicitly told them I don’t feel safe, and I was having thoughts of ending my own life, and even when I lay down to sleep I couldn’t, the room what shake and I wasn’t sure what was real anymore (I was starting to have micro sleeps where the brain starts to basically shut off). My husband knew, but was working so needed his sleep too. I told my parents. I told the health visitors and the GP but everyone was so busy affirming me they didn’t listen to a word I said.

in my most recent pregnancy knowing how low I felt post partum after my first and keen to get support I got referred again, was told no, reach out to us again if you’re at crisis point, and there are plenty of online resources. So basically either google it or you’re ready to take a life.

whilst I never became dangerous, I fundamentally believed I was a risk, and tbh rightly so, because I was so sleep deprived I was hallucinating.

I am really sorry to hear this. 💐

I also cannot imagine being unable to tell the difference between family annihilators and women with post-natal psychosis. Genuinely.