Lindsay Clancy case: was it evil, or severe mental illness?

And despite what must have been intense pressure from the other jurors, the judge and the defence for LC one juror wasn't convinced and held out against them for something like 5 days? I think that shows considerable belief in his own opinion that she was guilty.

I keep seeing "she was failed". She did not mention to any of the doctors she saw or spoke to that she had had any thoughts of harming her children.

She was a nurse, she knew that she needed to take prescribed medication as prescribed for a length of time for there to be benefits - she did not. She was not taking any of the pills for any length of time, and the pill bottles were substantially full at the time of her children's horrific deaths.

She was in her right mind enough to plot the time it would take her husband to get to the location and looked that up on google.

She took those little children down to the basement where no-one would hear their screams and strangled them one by one - which does not take a few minutes, so they would have been aware of what mummy was doing before each of them died. She managed to have a conversation on the phone with her husband mid-murdering their three little kids.

She was a nurse and would know kinder ways to kill them, and also all the ways to actually kill herself, but here she is.

Are you saying that everyone who takes their own life is not of sound mind? If so, I disagree.

Also claiming that planning and acting normal are signs that someone is unwell, well … what can I say to that?

There is so much circular thinking going on on this thread, interpreting events based on an already decided explanation to support the explanation and so on.

How do you get a new jury for a retrial that are unbiased? Not many people live under rocks.

With the internet there is just too media coverage including SM to bias future juries.

Is there a non trial way forward?

Ok so why are some posters talking about LC not having committed the crime at all

Have they just misunderstood what the jury was deciding?

"even though he shared the view that the case had not been proved beyond reasonable doubt by the prosecution"

I don't know how you supposedly know this when the information on the jury notes only commented he/she had doubts. Even the judge commented that "reasonable doubt" does not mean "no doubts"

"What it shows is flagrant disregard for the law and his duties as a juror."

The trial judge and the supreme court of Massachusetts do not agree with you about this.

There was an option for the jury to find her not guilty, aquitting her completely.

For those who haven’t watched the trial there are many many inconsistencies to Patrick’s story.

Firstly she would have had a very short time period to kill all 3 children, take them all individually down to basement, come up again, find a knife, cut her wrists, cut her throat (which was done in the way of a left handed person btw which her husband is, Lindsay is right handed) put the knife neatly down on the table, then whilst heavily bleeding from those wounds move a very heavy bed and nightstand and jump headfirst out the window, then once on the ground hose herself down (she was soaking wet all over her body more than could be accounted for from the snow) then her body temperature dropped to 27degrees (it’s been shown that this 10 degree drop in temperature usually takes hours even with the spinal injuries) Her thyroid was crushed and her injuries so severe she couldn’t speak. This all happened in about 25 minutes or less.

Then when Patrick came home she ‘told him’ the kids were in the basement and she had tried to kill herself. This was impossible as she couldn’t speak as demonstrated by the 999 call and all testimony from medical professionals. He waited 10 minutes to go and look for the kids.

When Lindsay woke up she was told by everyone that she had killed the kids.

Googke searches on ways to commit suicide and where is the carotid artery were done when Lindsay was at a GP appointment with one of the kids.

There were high levels of quetiapine in her system which she had stopped a month before and Patrick was keeping in her truck, the cocktail of other medication would have highly likely rendered her extremely sleepy. Her Apple Watch recorded her heart rate tailing from 117 to 57 throughout the day and 57 just before the children were killed.

The baby was able to be resuscitated, this means if she strangled him before jumping out the window he would have been in the basement for at least 30-40 minutes. Unusual to get a heart beat back after this time (he didn’t have one initially)

There are lots more than this too, all the ‘evidence’ came from what Patrick told everyone. There was no investigation.

She was profoundly failed by a lot of people, it’s very sad. Did she actually do it? I don’t know but there should have been far more investigation rather than just taking the word of the only person who wasn’t injured….

"even though he shared the view that the case had not been proved beyond reasonable doubt by the prosecution"

I don't know how you supposedly know this when the information on the jury notes only commented he/she had doubts. Even the judge commented that "reasonable doubt" does not mean "no doubts"

"What it shows is flagrant disregard for the law and his duties as a juror."

The trial judge and the supreme court of Massachusetts do not agree with you about this.

There was an option for the jury to find her not guilty, aquitting her completely.

For those who haven’t watched the trial there are many many inconsistencies to Patrick’s story.

Firstly she would have had a very short time period to kill all 3 children, take them all individually down to basement, come up again, find a knife, cut her wrists, cut her throat (which was done in the way of a left handed person btw which her husband is, Lindsay is right handed) put the knife neatly down on the table, then whilst heavily bleeding from those wounds move a very heavy bed and nightstand and jump headfirst out the window, then once on the ground hose herself down (she was soaking wet all over her body more than could be accounted for from the snow) then her body temperature dropped to 27degrees (it’s been shown that this 10 degree drop in temperature usually takes hours even with the spinal injuries) Her thyroid was crushed and her injuries so severe she couldn’t speak. This all happened in about 25 minutes or less.

Then when Patrick came home she ‘told him’ the kids were in the basement and she had tried to kill herself. This was impossible as she couldn’t speak as demonstrated by the 999 call and all testimony from medical professionals. He waited 10 minutes to go and look for the kids.

When Lindsay woke up she was told by everyone that she had killed the kids.

Googke searches on ways to commit suicide and where is the carotid artery were done when Lindsay was at a GP appointment with one of the kids.

There were high levels of quetiapine in her system which she had stopped a month before and Patrick was keeping in her truck, the cocktail of other medication would have highly likely rendered her extremely sleepy. Her Apple Watch recorded her heart rate tailing from 117 to 57 throughout the day and 57 just before the children were killed.

The baby was able to be resuscitated, this means if she strangled him before jumping out the window he would have been in the basement for at least 30-40 minutes. Unusual to get a heart beat back after this time (he didn’t have one initially)

There are lots more than this too, all the ‘evidence’ came from what Patrick told everyone. There was no investigation.

She was profoundly failed by a lot of people, it’s very sad. Did she actually do it? I don’t know but there should have been far more investigation rather than just taking the word of the only person who wasn’t injured….

Because there was no proper investigation at the time by the police. Patrick said Lindsay had confessed (she could not speak) and the police believed him. He was not excluded from the scene. None of the proper forensic or toxicology investigations were done. The children of this Catholic family were quickly cremated and their ashes mingled. And that's just for starters. The conduct of the police prevented the possibility of establishing the truth and holding a fair trial. It's a travesty.

"It was in the note from the foreperson of the jury. and further information about it emerged in the court discussion about next steps. You can watch it on YouTube. But sure, it didn't happen"

I repeat "The trial judge and the supreme court of Massachusetts do not agree with you about this" but hell you watched it on YouTube so know best!

Yes but do you think the jurors thought she didn’t do it at all or that they wanted the verdict of not guilty by reason of insanity?

I wasn’t aware of all of this….does she still have no recollection?

I am suspicious of the family because, as ive said, it sounds like they all acknowledged she was unwell but carried on leaving her to care for three young children alone.

I was also really surprised to read that Patrick had remarried. I just don’t understand how that could even be on his radar with all his children gone and a court case hanging over everyone. They also met only a year after the killings took place.

"I was also really surprised to read that Patrick had remarried. I just don’t understand how that could even be on his radar with all his children gone and a court case hanging over everyone. They also met only a year after the killings took place"

Perhaps surveying the desolate wreckage of his life and loss of his entire family at the hands of the person he had chosen to share his life with he decided to get busy living than get busy dying so to speak and try to build a new life for himself

Very few people alive can relate to what he's gone through but show a complete lack of empathy and feel entitled to judge and attack him despite his trauma.

That's not the question. They had the option to say that the prosecution had not proved guilt beyond reasonable doubt and that's what 11 jurors wanted to do. The 12 juror also believed the prosecution had not done so, but was unwilling to vote for that finding or discuss further.

I am suspicious of the family because, as ive said, it sounds like they all acknowledged she was unwell but carried on leaving her to care for three young children alone.

This is not true. Her mother-in-law came and stayed for several days to help her with the children. (She also had a nanny three days a week.)

It was her mother-in-law, also a nurse, who sought out help from a psychiatric nurse practictioner she knew, and who Lyndsay got several prescriptions from.

At times, her mother slept beside her, she was so concerned for Lyndsay.