Reform lost 6 by elections this week 🎉

Its racist to only accuse people who are talking in English of racisim? Surely? People who speak other languages are perfectly able to insult people in other languages. I know this having a foreign parent. Its not only British people that can be racist. My point was that this type of speech is rife throughout the UK.

I thought that was obvious? Why "wtf"?

Edit..oh I see. You misunderstood and thought I was suggesting the Pp couldnt understand English?? 🤣🤣🤣

Humour me.

I only call people racist that I have heard saying racist things.

I can’t speak French. So if someone is racist in French, I am unable to call them out on that because I don’t know what they said.

I can’t assume that all French speakers are racist, that’s obviously not reasonable, and I can’t hold people to account for things I don’t know was said.

Of course people are racist. It's unfortunately nature. Or are you arguing only white British people speaking English are racist. Plenty of people in this country won't like how women in the UK dress for example. Or won't like black people (that view is certainly not confined to white racists only. There are racists of all nationalities.)

No, I’m saying that the only people I can know to be racist are people I have heard being racist in a language I speak.

Thats not really much of an argument is it. And maybe you don't speak the language to know what someone is saying.

The problem with suppressing people's real views and using the police unevenly for bad language is that they will express their opinions in other ways. Reform need to improve their recruitment policy obviously to keep out bad eggs. But they are a new party and will perhaps get this better. Its important to have Reform. Reform's policies aren't racist and Farage isn't a racist. They have sacked those people. Otherwise what is the alternative? The National Front? The views don't go away.

maybe you don't speak the language to know what someone is saying.

Are you saying that poster doesn't understand English?

The problem with suppressing people's real views and using the police unevenly for bad language is that they will express their opinions in other ways.

Their views are not being suppressed. On the contrary, they have been amplified so voters outside their rarified circles could hear them and make up their own minds.

Reform's policies aren't racist and Farage isn't a racist. They have sacked those people. Otherwise what is the alternative? The National Front? The views don't go away.

Reform's misogynist, racist views, lies and strategies have been exposed by their elected representatives. The National Front is no alternative🤯 unless you're willing to sacrifice the wellbeing of the UK to forward the right wing ideology.

Reform's open use of racism and sexism has cost them votes in by-elections and voting intentions.

Some people will certainly be put off. But some people won't, as they talk like that anyway.

I think the questions about funding and money will put more people off.

Locker room banter, according to Farage.

Not a party that protects women.

Reform members would presumably argue by clamping down on illegal immigration they will protect women by reducing the number of immigrants from countries where they have different views regarding women to us.

Unless you speak every language spoken in the UK you have no idea whether someone speaking in a language other than those you do speak is being racist. So again you are presenting opinion as fact.

Are you saying that poster doesn't understand English?

🤣🤣🤣 no of course not. Im suggesting she may not understand the language of someone being racist to know they are being racist (she said she didnt hear people being racist).

May I refer you to my previous answer above at 15.48 to explain why I think Reform are important to counter the effects of racism.

Its how people throughout the country speak. We aren't all Jacob Rees Mogg and live in rarified circles where people only believe and say what polite society allows them to say. And if you go in any pub in the country away from the swanky parts its what you will hear. And it wont all be white people being racist. Sorry to break reality to you.

I don't approve of the language myself but that is because I am in polite society. But I do have ears.

she said she didnt hear people being racist

No she didn't. You were talking about people being racist in (non-swanky) pubs. I said I heard the odd racist comment in pubs.

I do also hear people being racist in non-pub settings. I don't live in some sort of bubble.

None of that means Reform is not a racist party that attracts racists. Neither does people being racist in languages other than English mean Reform is not a racist party that attracts racists. Which seems to be your argument.

My arguments are

That there are a lot of people who talk like the Reform members in this country.

There will be a lot of non white non English speaking racists too.

We need Reform to counter racism. Because on the basis there are racists they need a party to vote for. That is not the BNP or Restore. And Reform is main stream.

And yes..splitting the vote is a great concern.

Don't be concerned@Pineneedlesincarpet. You're doing a great job.

My arguments are

That there are a lot of people who talk like the Reform members in this country.

There will be a lot of non white non English speaking racists too.

We need Reform to counter racism. Because on the basis there are racists they need a party to vote for. That is not the BNP or Restore. And Reform is main stream.

Make it make sense. 🤯

How?

I just don't like sweeping generalisations. Unfortunately for me I can always see the other side of an argument. We could just spend the thread slagging Reform off but wheres the interest in that? Reform are high in the polls and Id like to discuss why. To dismiss them as "racists" means you dismiss the views of millions of people in this country. They've already affected policy of the main two parties. They can't be written off.

Racism was being countered long before Reform came along. It has increased since Reform surged in popularity.

Not true. Nigel Farage neutered the BNP and National Front. Look at the history. Those parties were actually far right. Reform are not.