Anti Semitism to increase after the government sides with Islamists

Increasingly everyone else is in agreement on genocide, yes.
We visited Nurnberg last year and there is a very clear definition.
Genocide is the intentional and systematic destruction, in whole or in part, of a national, ethnic, racial, or religious group. 1]
According to the United Nations Genocide Convention of 1948, the crime of genocide involves specific acts committed with the explicit intent to destroy these protected group

76k people counts.

I just want to go back to the title of this thread. The implication that the only people who would oppose the grotesque state- backed violence of the Settlers are 'Islamists'. And yes it's very clearly state backed, I didn't hear this from a social media post or from Hamas, or from a 'left wing' newspaper or broadcaster. I heard this from an Israeli rabbi who works with Palestinians in the West Bank. At an event at my rabbi's house.

The title also suggests every Palestinian is an 'Islamist' (and aside from ordinary, non extremist Muslims, there are many Christian Palestinians in the West Bank who are not spared the violence either)

So yeah, not a fan of that attitude.

Thank you for this. I do wonder if these threads are rage bait by groups effectively trying to turn people against Jews - there are so many of them and they always fail to actually listen or admit any fault, ignore the fact Israel is conflating their religion and the genocide itself and just attempt to belittle anyone who doesn't see them as the saviours. It is like they are trying to wind people up. I won't continue as I am not convinced it isn't designed that way in poor faith.

I would like to think these threads are not started by genuine people as their views are so offensive. I'm deeply disappointed that Mumsnet is consistently willing to let these threads stand while deleting posts like "I find your attitude appalling" on the basis that it breaks talk guidelines.

Which specific threads are you referring to?

I would like to think these threads are not started by genuine people as their views are so offensive. I'm deeply disappointed that Mumsnet is consistently willing to let these threads stand while deleting posts like "I find your attitude appalling" on the basis that it breaks talk guidelines.

Probably referring to threads where posters are challenging the anti-Israel rhetoric that has pretty much ruled on MN for the last 3 years, and been more open about not seeing Palestinians as the victims in all this with Israelis/Jews supposed to feel sorry for them despite Palestinians taking part in and celebrating Oct 7th, and vowing to repeat it again and again.

That will make people 'turn against Jews' apparently because of course people supporting Israel/Jews makes pro-Palestinians angry and therefore puts Jews at risk!

I can smell the stench of @SmallDFartyCarNRGfrom here.

It's fascinating how some people seem to find any deviation from the 'Israel = evil / Palestine = innocent and oppressed' binary so unfathomable.
They seem to assume that anyone expressing such views can't be a genuine poster, or that they have to be reined in by MN
The CITME board has been predominantly pro-Palestine for years, so if anyone voices a different view some people seem genuinely astounded.

@OpenScroller and @inamarina ,

But I find both of you equally pro Israel biased. Have you ever posted or even accepted an anti Israel argument?

It’s been a brutal rivalry/hatred for over half a century and, for the most part, I have ‘supported’ Israel but have been able to see both sides. There is no question that Hamas would have genocided Israel had they been able and deserve whatever Israel does to them (within reason, I don’t approve of torture whatever anyone has done).

In Gaza, they haven’t had elections since 2006, and the average age of the population is 19. Even when they were elected in 2006, it was a bought election by Iran in many ways. Hamas were voted for on a domestic agenda, and then it turned out that they cared more about hurting Israel and Jews than helping their own population.

However, your average Palestinian just wants to live their life, have an opportunity for an education and a career, same as everyone else. And, Israel. supposedly a liberal democracy and our ally, has prevented this from happening,

You have to pay attention to Smotrich (finance minister) and Ben G’vir (Security Minister) here. Netanyahu chose to form a coalition including their two parties which are basically racist by charter. They both advocate for ‘greater Israel’ and expelling the Arab population.

In a way, you could see 7/10 as a victory for extremists on both sides. For Hamas, they get to pursue their nihilistic agenda and maybe will meet some nice virgins some time soon, as well as getting the world on their side. For the extremist zionists, this is a perfect excuse to expand into ‘Greater Israel’. Meanwhile it radicalises both populations and sets any meaningful and rational solution back years.

But who can the western world influence and change? Well it won’t be Iran and her many proxies, as we are seeing in real time. But Israel? Does it want to become a pariah nation and can it choose a more merciful and decent path? Definitely. Ultimately, I suspect, for most of the Jewish world the victory Israel is now winning is a pyrrhic one. They are selling out decent Jewish values for victory on an unequal battlefield.

Which is why, as a Jew, I will continue to call out the behaviour of Netanyahu and his cronies, as every decent person will, notwithstanding that their choices have been difficult. Regardless of who started the killings, ethnic cleansing is never OK. And for me, the Gazans compressed into 40% of Gaza, with no return date, the continued settler harassment and the ‘buffer zone’ in Lebanon which some are already calling for settle, can’t really be thought of as anything else. We need to make Israel here us and take us seriously and sanctions are a good way of doing it (possibly the only way).

@OpenScroller and @inamarina ,

But I find both of you equally pro Israel biased. Have you ever posted or even accepted an anti Israel argument?

It’s been a brutal rivalry/hatred for over half a century and, for the most part, I have ‘supported’ Israel but have been able to see both sides. There is no question that Hamas would have genocided Israel had they been able and deserve whatever Israel does to them (within reason, I don’t approve of torture whatever anyone has done).

In Gaza, they haven’t had elections since 2006, and the average age of the population is 19. Even when they were elected in 2006, it was a bought election by Iran in many ways. Hamas were voted for on a domestic agenda, and then it turned out that they cared more about hurting Israel and Jews than helping their own population.

However, your average Palestinian just wants to live their life, have an opportunity for an education and a career, same as everyone else. And, Israel. supposedly a liberal democracy and our ally, has prevented this from happening,

You have to pay attention to Smotrich (finance minister) and Ben G’vir (Security Minister) here. Netanyahu chose to form a coalition including their two parties which are basically racist by charter. They both advocate for ‘greater Israel’ and expelling the Arab population.

In a way, you could see 7/10 as a victory for extremists on both sides. For Hamas, they get to pursue their nihilistic agenda and maybe will meet some nice virgins some time soon, as well as getting the world on their side. For the extremist zionists, this is a perfect excuse to expand into ‘Greater Israel’. Meanwhile it radicalises both populations and sets any meaningful and rational solution back years.

But who can the western world influence and change? Well it won’t be Iran and her many proxies, as we are seeing in real time. But Israel? Does it want to become a pariah nation and can it choose a more merciful and decent path? Definitely. Ultimately, I suspect, for most of the Jewish world the victory Israel is now winning is a pyrrhic one. They are selling out decent Jewish values for victory on an unequal battlefield.

Which is why, as a Jew, I will continue to call out the behaviour of Netanyahu and his cronies, as every decent person will, notwithstanding that their choices have been difficult. Regardless of who started the killings, ethnic cleansing is never OK. And for me, the Gazans compressed into 40% of Gaza, with no return date, the continued settler harassment and the ‘buffer zone’ in Lebanon which some are already calling for settle, can’t really be thought of as anything else. We need to make Israel here us and take us seriously and sanctions are a good way of doing it (possibly the only way).

People posting who are 'pro-Israel' regularly condemn Netanyahu and his extremist government, and the settler movement etc.

But what do you mean by being pro and anti Israel then? I am pro Israel as a country and right to exist and defend itself, but anti -Netanyahu and his current politics.

So you don't want to see the destruction of Israel but are against its current government, similar, presumably to lots of other countries.

Sorry but I like Netanyahu. Bibi has balls unlike most Western leaders.

Bigger balls than Trump by a long shot, although he has been massively restricted by both Trump's and Biden's administrations, as I think the war would have been over quicker if he hadn't been constrained by that.

I researched his background a while back because of all the hate and I think he's the leader Israel needed during this period.

I get the impression there's a strong and very loud contingent of the Israeli left who are desperate for him to be gone and have been for a long time.

I sincerely hope for the sake of Israeli people that he remains in position next month.

Doesn’t bother you that he’s under criminal investigation? Ok then.

Which one?

The internal politically motivated one or the international politically motivated one?

I might be pro-Israel biased, but I don’t assume that people on the other side of the argument aren’t genuine posters. I’m also not calling for MN to rein them in just because I might disagree with them.

I understand that the conflict is very complex, but I see more “default” support for the Palestinian side. Palestinian flags displayed in windows, people claiming they’re against “Zionism”, people chanting “From the river to the sea”.

I believe that many people in Gaza simply want to live their lives, but I also can’t ignore the celebrations that took place on October 7th.
How can people rejoice seeing mutilated bodies of innocent people? How can they have a street party around the coffins of a mother and her two young children?

Could you tell us about the "Wedding of Hate" and the guy stabbing the photograph of Ali Dawabsheh.

I will.
Some Palestinians were killed, guests at a Jewish wedding celebrated it.
Israeli officials prosecuted the cheering guests.

It is hardly comparable to the mass cheering, jeering, spitting on corpses, no Palestinan giving up info on the hostages etc.

There's some terrible things done on both sides. I remember seeing a certain high spot in Israel where people would gather to watch and cheer on the bombing in Gaza.