To think everything will be unrecognisable in 50 years

No problem at all but would like the indiginous culture to be preserved and recognised, and it seems some a very uncomfortable with that and want to rewrite history "there is no indiginous British, there is no traditional British culture."

Yes - sometimes I hear people look back to their youth and describe it as a more innocent age (in the past I have even said it myself!)
But I've come to think that what they mean is that they were innocent then, so the horrors of the world were not apparent to them in quite the way they are now.

In "The Tempest" Prospero's daughter Miranda, who has lived on an island knowing only her father, finally meets a group of people and says "Oh brave new world that has such people in it!" Prospero replies "Tis new to thee" as he knows more of the world and of these particular people...
But it is a generational division - youth & hope versus age & cynicism

What is that indigenous culture?

I'd like to think that the normalisation of more diverse looking people everywhere will put an end to racism, although it probably won't.

Because it isn't something anyone gets to interpret, not to any serious degree. It just is. The same as every other traditional culture. You can give us your interpretation of any traditional culture be it English or Syrian, but your interpretation has no value, because the culture is already defined by the long years of history that has solidified it. You don't get to define culture, other than your own family sub culture within your household. It's much bigger than you, an individual speck in an extraordinarily long and vast heritage. The sense of authority you place on your own opinions and definitions is absolutely fascinating.

👏 👏 👏

I think I've already answered this question. Out of interest, do you recognise indiginous culture anywhere in the world? Or is it just in Britain you don't acknowledge it?

Other immigrants also moved into the gorbals and then moved out to other areas e.g. giffnock etc. (or at least that’s always what my granny told me so if there are any Scottish historians to correct me feel free!)

No, you are right.

50,000 desperate Irish people arrived in Glasgow in 1847 alone - and if you look at newspapers of the time you will find lots of stories about these immigrants coming in taking our jobs, bringing disease, taking houses and causing a crime wave.

https://www.rte.ie/history/post-famine/2020/1106/1176413-the-irish-invasion-how-the-irish-famine-changed-scotland/

In the 1890s, there was another influx of Jewish immigrants from what is now Poland, Russia and the Baltic States. The Jewish population of the city grew from about 700 in the 1870s to 6500 by the turn of the century. Many moved on to North America. Most settled in the Gorbals, and as they established firmer roots moved further south out of the city towards Cathcart, Giffnock.

Glasgow is a city built on immigration.

The youth were also angry in the 70s. And the 60s. And the 50s and the 80s and the 90s.

The youth are angry because politicians ignore them, older generations berate them, opportunities are not made for them. They are told they should vote but who for? Few parties court their vote by having policies which will actually help them..

If it's about culture and behaviour, then why are people talking about skin colour?

This is EXACTLY my point. It is NOT about skin colour. But that's an easy win for the Lefties when people say they want to halt illegal immigration - "RACIST" they shout. If we were allowing thousands of white men to enter illegally, who came from backward cultures, I would also want that stopped too. Their colour is of no threat, their culture is. They could be bright blue, and the risk would be the same.

If you are concerned about men who think it's ok to rape women, then what does that have to do with the proportion of British people who don't happen to have white skin?

Nothing. Black british people and white british people share the same culture.

Are you making assumptions that all non-white men - including British men of non-white ethnicities - are automatically a threat to women? Because that is the very essence of racism

No. I am saying that men from backward cultures, where women have very few rights, and where sometimes rape isn't a crime, and who enter the UK with no papers, pose a significant threat to British women. I consider British men, whether black, brown or white to be less of a threat, because they were raised here with Western values, and largely we know who they are, in so much as if they had committed rape or murder they wouldn't be walking the streets (unlike the undocumented immigrants who are walking the streets, even though we have no idea whether they have a criminal history.

What exactly do you mean by talking about the "indigenous" population of the UK? Celts?

Anyone born here.

And when you say that it will never be possible to overcome "the gulf between the two cultures", which specific cultures are you talking about? Presumably you are aware that immigrants to the UK come from a wide array of different cultures?

Western Culture -Versus - Non Western Culture.
Men from Afghanistan, Yemen, Iran, Somalia, Iraq, for example, pose (imo) a threat to women, given their views on women being sub-human. Men from Italy, France, Germany, Japan, Canada, USA (to name but a few) do not pose the same level of threat, as our values mostly align.
With that said, NO men should be coming here without background checks.

And when Labour try to soothe us by saying that migrant hotels are being closed down, all that means is that these men are now been scatter gunned across the Country - which is no fucking solution!

What indigenous culture would you say is dying out ? I know quite a few folk dancers if that helps

Building that have been there centuries will continue to be there - but there will be change.

Where I grew up was a rural village soon it will have one field between in and nearest town - all happened since I left over 30 years. City I live in 20 years ago looks very different when dropped child of for uni - quieter some route changes and many changes of shops - bit also stuff that was still there.

In nearby town to us where I went to secondary I was at school with second and third genration asians ie british as me born and grown and with British passport- huge population that kept it's own culture and traditions as well as picked up some british ones - so it's really not like immirgation is a new thing either. The huge local Diwali festival has existed for over 25 years and has always been popular.

Culture always change - many british people are hard presses to say what british culture actually is - many outsiders who move here see it much more clearly but it exists and will adapt over time as all cultures do. Many of our national dishes show how we've taken in different cultures and made them part of our own.

She clearly means that whole areas are occupied by people who are not Scottish and do not wish to respect or assimilate with Scottish culture. This is simultaneously happening in every European country, and it's disingenuous to pretend that it isn't.

It is deeply ironic that you refer to the sense of authority that I allegedly place on my own opinions and definitions while simultaneously asserting that your version of British culture isn't open to interpretation because it "just is". That's actually quite funny.

The fact that you see any culture as a fixed, immutable thing that isn't subject to different interpretations rather suggests that you haven't spent much time learning about cultures.

And of course, British culture is much bigger than me. But it is also much bigger than you, and you have no more right to define it than I do.

ETA: The quoted post has been missed off. This is in reply to a PP who says the melting pot won't happen, just sectarianism and Sharia law.

The melting pot already is happening. I see it every day.

What will create the dystopia you fear is headlines and protests and laws that tell people "We don't like you, we don't trust you, we don't accept how you live, you have to choose between your community and participating in our wider evolving British culture"

That creates a bunker mentality. The people you fear won't say "ok, fair enough, we are an awful culture and we'll stop doing all the things you say", they will say "This isn't us. They are lying about us because they hate us. Our most extreme voices were right. We need to look after ourselves in our own ways".

If you worry for the freedom of a woman in a veil, don't rip off her veil, give her opportunities, whatever she feels safe to accept for her or for her children. People who feel safe will be part of change organically.

Local housing allowance replacing housing benefit, which meant that if you had one child, or children under 10, all of the many HA three bed houses couldn't be allocated and were sold off/rented out as shared properties. Universal Credit causing hardship that it was supposed to solve. Two child benefit cap. Even if on UC, you had to be unemployed to get many things, free school meals included. General austerity. Immigration into areas that traditionally had bigger families, so resources, including jobs were too far stretched. A not fit for purpose child maintenance system.

It is utter nonsense to say Glasgow isn’t a Scottish city. As I noted on a previous thread, it is also bullshit to pretend Glasgow was ever the friendliest city or that Scotland doesn’t have a problem with racism.

I keep hearing the stat that it’s the most ethnically diverse city in Scotland and yet the stats for Edinburgh show a higher percentage of people identifying with an ethnic minority group. I think the problem is, too many people don’t consider anyone who isn’t white as being Scottish which is nonsense.

God this is so true. Ask any of your plastic patriots what British culture means and they'll probably say things like the Royal Family (German/Greek), fish and chips (invented by Jewish immigrants less than 200 years ago), the Beatles (didn't exist 65 years ago), the Blitz spirit (obviously didn't exist pre-Blitz).

If you asked someone in 1926 they'd have said different things. 1826 different things again. 2126 will be different things again I'm sure. Culture moves on all the time.

What people miss is the familiarity of their childhoods and the recent past. But it all moves on, always has always will.

What the plastic patriots really mean is brown people, of course.

If you've answered it I'm afraid I haven't been able to see where. As for your question, any country can be multicultural and be open to a range of influences, I would have thought, but I've only lived in the UK and experienced other countries on holiday.

So if it is genuinely not about skin colour, why are we being given a breakdown of the percentages of city populations which are white British, and why are some posters suggesting that it would be a problem if white people cease to be a majority in those areas?

Also, could you clarify why you are lumping "non-Western culture" into one homogeneous group?

Do you think all "Western cultures" are identical? And are you including Japanese culture as "western" now? On what grounds?

What the plastic patriots really mean is brown people, of course

Yes. But they don't have the guts to say so.

But that's just the thing, it isn't my interpretation. It's British culture as according to historians, sociologists, British cultural scholars etc. It has been defined at great length time and again, some people have made it their life's work.
And I very clearly started that no culture is fixed and immutable. I said in an earlier post that is always growing.

Willfully misunderstanding someone is a poor way to try and win a debate, everyone here can see you doing it. My words are right above for all to see. Obviously you have some deep need to believe that there is no traditional British culture in any clear or definable way, and only you can know why it is so important to you to hold on to that fallacy.

Because it’s more likely a person will be part of ‘British culture’ if they’re white, because British people have been majority white since forever.

That absolutely doesn’t mean every white individual is more invested in British culture than every non white person. The most culturally English man I know is of Indian descent - plays cricket, lives in a thatched cottage, loves classic English literature, etc. But it’s not rocket science that somebody with a dual, or different, cultural background will identify with that culture possibly more than their English/British identity.

There we go. You heard it here. Much like the Labrador and the pint in an English country boozer. That never existed, so stop acting like it did. Maybe we can be provided with little pills that wipe out long-term memory for convenience .

I agree, this faux ‘what is British culture?’ while in the next breath happily acknowledging another country’s culture is laughable.