MIL dilemma on holiday

Why do healthy babies need to learn to fall back asleep independently? For most of human history babies have slept close to their mothers.

It would be rinse and repeat at home in a familiar setting but on holiday in an unfamiliar place, a level of unsettledness is to be expected and since the child is likely to be out of routine anyway and even potentially adjusting to a new time zone then sleep training on holiday is unlikely going to be successful anyway.

1. Most 11 month olds understand object permanence.
2. Babies naturally wake between sleep cycles just as adults do (and most adults don’t remember waking between sleep cycles just as babies and small children don’t remember).
3. Healthy babies learn how to fall back asleep independently. Parents should know the difference between their child having a need that needs to be met/the child being sick and needing attention vs. Normal nighttime wakes between cycles.

Really? I didn't know that - so if I did ferber 6 months ago and then when on holiday my child isn't dropping off to sleep /staying asleep what do I do while we're away? I thought the guidance was rinse + repeat

Waking between sleep cycles is a normal part of sleep, we all do it. I don’t need my mother or husband to come comfort me every night when I wake up

No. That is because you are not 11 months old and haven't got object permanence yet.

Waking between sleep cycles is a normal part of sleep, we all do it. I don’t need my mother or husband to come comfort me every night when I wake up between cycles.

Pausing for five minutes before going to baby to see if the crying escalates or if baby drifts back to sleep isn’t going to make baby feel any less safe or comforted.

The method wouldn't encourage sleep training in an unfamiliar place. It would advise holding off any sleep training until after the holiday.

Comfort and feeling safe are needs.

Yes, your AI contribution is very valuable. 🙄

I doubt I would work very well on hols but for the benefit of doubt on the subject writ large which weirdly women seem hell bent on ignoring and foresaking their wellbeing:

The idea that sleep training is cruel or damaging is largely a myth, and extensive peer-reviewed scientific research does not support the claim that standard behavioral sleep interventions cause long-term emotional, psychological, or developmental harm.

Major medical and psychological organizations—including the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) and the American Academy of Sleep Medicine (AASM)—recognize evidence-based sleep training methods (such as graduated extinction or "cry it out," and bedtime fading) as safe and effective.
What the Scientific Evidence Actually Shows
No Long-Term Harm or Attachment Issues: Long-term follow-up studies (tracking children anywhere from 1 to 5 years later) have repeatedly found no differences between sleep-trained children and non-sleep-trained children in terms of emotional health, behavioral problems, or the security of the parent-child attachment bond.

Cortisol and Stress Levels: A landmark study published in Pediatrics compared babies undergoing sleep training (graduated extinction and bedtime fading) to a control group and measured stress hormone levels via saliva. Surprisingly, the researchers found that babies in the sleep training groups showed lower cortisol levels by the end of the intervention, pointing to reduced overall stress once predictable sleep routines were established.

ps I sleep trained one kid cos they were crazy and wouldn’t sleep and I didn’t sleep train the others cos they didn’t need to be trained and just “got It” I always wonder whether those who are so obsessed with shaming sleep trainers never had terrible sleepers themselves so can’t see why you’d have to do it. It’s such a weird quirk of MN that despite the evidence so many people here can’t let go of the idea that it’s awful.

Comfort is just as much a need.

If I left my daughter to cry she would be so distraught she would throw up after about 5 mins. And I’m cruel for NOT letting that happen? Ok

If you have been sleep training (let's say Ferber or similar given OP talks about leaving a baby to cry) and then go on holiday and the child cries, presumably the method says you should leave them to it?
Im sure parents who have sleep trained talk about needing to re-train in a new place, for example.

Not on holiday. Not the time or place

It is. I don’t agree with sleep training at all- but it certainly doesn’t involve a baby crying for 20 solid minutes. Controlled Crying does.

controlled crying: how horrible. It just makes it sound like some barbaric torture method.

Love the people suddenly thinking controlled crying (this isn’t sleep training-it’s controlled crying!) is the best thing ever because a MiL thinks it’s a bad idea.

For the vast majority of human evolution and history, sleeping in close physical contact with babies was the absolute norm. It still is in many non western cultures.

I expect she made an excuse. You invented storming off.

Would you not notice if a member of your party whilst on holiday up and left? Or if you did, would you not be able to guess why?

I don't think it's idiotic to care about the welfare of babies.

She didn’t say she stormed out, she said she left. She didn’t say she’d said anything to the parents either. You just made all that up.

My MIL wanted me to sleep train mine because she's a hard woman and did it with hers. Absolutely couldn't do it. Don't know how anyone can it's perfectly normal to want to comfort your baby.

Just to be clear, was a parent in with the child or was the child alone? I sleep trained both mine using gentle methods where you stay with the child and gradually ‘do less’ until you’re by the door. In an early stage, they might cry next to me in the cot with my arms on them for a period of time because they expect to be picked up/rocked. That’s part of the process but it’s not cruel, it’s just teaching them a new way to sleep with support.

If she’s leaving the baby to cry alone, that’s not something I could do for that length of time.

Having said that, I wouldn’t be doing sleep training on holiday.

So we agree.
Again, I think parents have forgotten just how important sleep is for a baby's/child's development.
If your child doesnt sleep, it should be an absolute priority to fix that.
That's before we even get into a parents mental wellbeing. We seem to ignore on this site, how important that is too. Instead, the desperate need some posters have to demonise a fellow Mother takes over.
Sad really.

I have no idea of the many different methods of sleep training, I had great sleepers. I can see posters haven't mentioned the different methods though, just rushed forward to say they would never sleep train despite their children not sleeping. They should be trying something, for their childs sake.