Oxford students going after Jenni Murray (again)

[Candidpeel]

The History Society’s has invited her to talk on the topic of “Powerful British Women in History and Society”

The Student Union LGBTQ+ and the Womens Campaign () are calling for her to be no platformed for wrong-think and wrong-speak. She does not believe that transwomen are ‘real women'...and has "uncritically encouraged her readers to question whether trans women and girls should be allowed to use single-sex spaces such as changing rooms and bathrooms, whether trans girls should be allowed to join Girlguiding."

As we know from the Women Ask Questions survey 60% of the UK public agree with Murray, another 25% don't know and only 15% are on board the TWAW bus.

This presumably extends to most lecturers and guest speakers at Oxford . But they keep going after Jenni Murray .

www.facebook.com/lgbtqoxford/posts/2172563253018911?tn=C-R

Anything we can do to help?

I expect it takes either a brave or foolish group to challenge La Murray.

Long may she peer over her specs in disdain.

cowardly, pathetic little weasels. No comments on their FB post, they know full well they'd be slated for this.

And these are supposed to be some of our brightest young people.

This is a badly written and confusing artcle but it seems to be reporting that the Universities Minister, an Oxford graduate himself, is calling for open debate on campuses including on transgender issues. I assume it is meant as a message to University administrations. I had a brief attempt at finding the original statement in the hope that was clearer, but no joy.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6360995/White-students-feel-unable-talk-race-stifling-debate.html

Pathetic.

The more public they make their silly tantrumming, the better. I doubt many people would buy into the idea of Jenni Murray as a terrifying figure of hate from whom young people need to be shielded.

for Jenni who I am sure will take it in her stride.
What does scare me is that these people are getting the best education money can buy and will probably be running the BBC in 10 or 20 years.

Their university and Jenni Murray have been informed via twitter.

I suggest askung the Department of Education for a copy of Gyimah's statement explaining the context and making sure key decision makers are aware. Gyimah appears keen to support free speech in Universities and has apparently leant on others who have condoned no platforming of feminist groups.

For context, this is the Times article which Jenni Murray wrote last year.
She was publically rebuked by the BBC following protests from TRAs:

'Be trans, be proud — but don’t call yourself a “real woman”
Can someone who has lived as a man, with all the privilege that entails, really lay claim to womanhood? It takes more than a sex change and make-up'
(extract)
"The fury that a male-to-female transsexual could be so ignorant of the politics that have preoccupied women for centuries hit me again last year — 16 years after I had met Carol. This time I was speaking to another trans woman, India Willoughby, who had hit the headlines after appearing on the ITV programme Loose Women.

India held firmly to her belief that she was a “real woman”, ignoring the fact that she had spent all of her life before her transition enjoying the privileged position in our society generally accorded to a man. In a discussion about the Dorchester hotel’s demands that its female staff should always wear make-up, have a manicure and wear stockings over shaved legs, she was perfectly happy to go along with such requirements. There wasn’t a hint of understanding that she was simply playing into the stereotype — a man’s idea of what a woman should be.

She described hairy legs on a woman as “dirty”. But hairy legs are not considered dirty in a man. Did she not know that the question of whether a woman should shave her legs or her a rmpits had been a topic of debate among women for an awfully long time? And that to describe a woman who chose not to shave as dirty was insulting and again suggested an ignorance of sexual politics?

Unsurprisingly, my polite and informed line of questioning exposed me to a barrage of criticism on social media. I was a Terf and didn’t understand what Simone de Beauvoir, the author of one of the great feminist tracts, The Second Sex, meant when she wrote: “One is not born, but rather becomes, a woman.”

As a matter of fact, I have understood perfectly what de Beauvoir meant ever since I read her as a teenage girl. Her subject was that “second sex”. She used the word sex advisedly.

Your sex, male or female, is what you’re born with and determines whether you’ll provide the sperm or the eggs in the reproductive process. What de Beauvoir was analysing was gendered socialisation." (continues)

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/be-trans-be-proud-but-dont-call-yourself-a-real-woman-frtld7q5c

Is it possible to "uncritically question" something? Seems an odd turn of phrase.

Flag it up to the media/reporters- would be good to see it reported on.

Worth following Professor Selina Todd (Lecturer in Modern British History and Vice Principal of St Hilda's College, Oxford)
www.history.ox.ac.uk/people/professor-selina-todd

Guardian,' UK universities struggle to deal with ‘toxic’ trans rights row
Abuse on campus, fear of speaking up – feminist academics say some universities aren’t protecting them'
extraxt
"Debbie Epstein, professor of cultural studies in education at Roehampton University, says many feminists are afraid to voice any view about the gender recognition proposals. “I grew up in South Africa under apartheid and was involved in politics from my teens, and not since I left there in the 1960s have I been as scared of speaking out as I am on this issue now. I have seen the toxicity of this debate and how other academics have been treated and that is frightening.”

Mary Leng, a senior lecturer in philosophy at the University of York, says many philosophers are strongly supportive of self-identification of gender. “That is, of course, fine. What is disappointing is that when they attack you they generally don’t respond to your arguments or address them, they simply say that it is dog-whistling that is indicative of an underlying bigotry.”

Selina Todd, professor of modern history at Oxford University, agrees. Recently one delegate cancelled their place at a humanities conference she was due to speak at when they saw her name on the agenda. “It was because the person was concerned that ‘transphobic’ views would be expressed. I assume that this referred to my gender-critical stance.” The conference had nothing on the agenda that was connected to the subject."

www.theguardian.com/education/2018/oct/30/uk-universities-struggle-to-deal-with-toxic-trans-rights-row

Oxford SU LGBTQ Campaign

RE Selina Todd, I heard her speak about her life and book, 'The People: The Rise and Fall of the Working Class, 1910-2010' , She was great, a really interesting woman and would recommend the book.

This year, Jenni Murray has been giving a number of lectures about her book:

Dame Jenni Murray - 'A History of Britain in 21 Women.'

"Dame Jenni's talk is a polite yet passionate fingers up to history’s attempts to silence women, on the very week Millicent Fawcett’s statue was unveiled on parliament square.

Jenni began writing her a book ‘A History of Britain in 21 Women’ in 2015 after learning that the women’s movement might be erased from the A level history curriculum.

Her lecture is a whirlwind tour of some of the books more colourful characters – from Boadicea to the Iron Lady, Elizabeth I to Ethel Smith, featuring personal anecdotes (interviewing Thatcher after her deposition) and offering fascinating insight into some of suffrage’s lesser known stories (suffragette cricket lessons for more accomplished brick throwing)."

WomaninBoots I think the phrase "word salad" applies here - throw together a bunch of phrases from "critical theory", mix up at random, and serve.

word vomit, more like.

Little weasels don't deserve to be at university. They should be in the real world - if suggest volunteering at a homeless charity where their right on nonsense won't be given the time of day.

Hurty feelings because someone sniggered at Bill in a frock? Try being homeless and hungry then come and tell me how hard done by you are.

a polite yet passionate fingers up to history’s attempts to silence women

It's hard to remain polite at the current era's attempts to silence women though.

Let's hope this particular attempt backfires spectacularly.

Fekko I am seriously beginning to think that some kind of community service needs to be a part of every university course, or pre-requisite for getting a place. Something like that. Because this does seem to be something that only the terminally indulged and cossetted (and I'll admit that that was me at uni) think that important.

Education is wasted on these eejits.

I’m a little worried about Oxford’s admissions policy if they find Jeni Murray threatening.

uncritically encouraged her readers to question

What does this mean? I am so tired of people who are purportedly 'educated' pushing the idea that something can only be discussed if everyone agrees with the transactivist position first.

FFS, you over-privileged yahoos, you're at fucking Oxford. Do you have the slightest clue how basic thinking works?

If someone in a debate has to agree with the premises put forward by their opponent before the conversation is allowed to happen, what do you think will be the result?

Good grief.

Why don't we teach philosophy at school?