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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Oxford students going after Jenni Murray (again)

113 replies

Candidpeel · 07/11/2018 13:20

The History Society’s has invited her to talk on the topic of “Powerful British Women in History and Society”

The Student Union LGBTQ+ and the Womens Campaign (Sad) are calling for her to be no platformed for wrong-think and wrong-speak. She does not believe that transwomen are ‘real women'...and has "uncritically encouraged her readers to question whether trans women and girls should be allowed to use single-sex spaces such as changing rooms and bathrooms, whether trans girls should be allowed to join Girlguiding."

As we know from the Women Ask Questions survey 60% of the UK public agree with Murray, another 25% don't know and only 15% are on board the TWAW bus.

This presumably extends to most lecturers and guest speakers at Oxford . But they keep going after Jenni Murray Hmm.

www.facebook.com/lgbtqoxford/posts/2172563253018911?tn=C-R

OP posts:
merrymouse · 07/11/2018 16:14

How dare she encourage people to question? Confused

Can’t help wondering how they cope with course work.

CoolCarrie · 07/11/2018 16:16

merrymouse 😀

Sarahconnor1 · 07/11/2018 18:07

Jenni Murray pulls out of Oxford talk after students try to 'no platform' her over 'transphobic' comments
www.telegraph.co.uk/education/2018/11/07/jenni-murray-pulls-oxford-talk-students-try-no-platform-transphobic/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

R0wantrees · 07/11/2018 18:08

Times today has a short but significant article by Rosemary Bennett, Education Editor

Safe spaces on campus have ‘gone too far’
"Campus safe spaces have gone too far and students are not encountering unpopular views and rigorous debate, the head of the Office for Students has said.

Sir Michael Barber accepted that quiet places had a part to play but said the idea that a whole university should be a safe space was wrong. Inviting controversial speakers was important, he said, as was a “diversity of perspective” in lectures and seminars.

“Being proactive about free speech means exposing students to argument,” he said. “Sometimes education makes you feel uncomfortable.”

Asked at a higher education festival run by the think tank Wonkhe about the safe space movement, he added: “It has certainly been taken too far.”

“Safe spaces” were imported from the US and were originally rooms set aside for marginalised or vulnerable students to debate issues arising from their own experiences. Their scope expanded as many students argued that universities themselves should be environments in which they could debate without being offended or feeling uncomfortable. As students have become paying customers, tutors have grown concerned that they should avoid challenging views or discussing unpopular opinions."

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/31f0138a-e20f-11e8-9838-efa7e96cbe2b

R0wantrees · 07/11/2018 18:10

Why don't we teach philosophy at school?

What is very clear is the need for more focus on developing critical thinking skills.

RiverTam · 07/11/2018 18:15

Stupid little brats.

LikeDust · 07/11/2018 18:16

I am getting so fed up with all the spoilt little shits. They are an embarrassment.

FactCheque · 07/11/2018 18:25

Ah! That's so disappointing. Am sure she didn't want to put herself through the inevitable undignified walking through a baying mob. No one needs that shit or to have to spend the week dreading it.

If you happen to read this Jenny. Solidarity with you. You are an inspiration and a legend and I have spent many mind stretching mornings listening to you.

BiologyIsReal · 07/11/2018 18:29

I seriously think it has been a retrograde step to encourage such high attendance at university. When I left school only 10 per cent of the population were at university and they valued the experience and realised how privileged they were.

Now a generation of entitled spoilt brats think they are the bees' knees whose every prejudice and utterance must be pandered to. Their skins are as thin as rice paper and they seem to have trouble cobbling two brain cells together.

Of course there are many clever and intellectually vigorous students still at universities but they are probably far too busy getting on with their studies to bother putting the world to rights from all the experience of their 20 years.

As for some of the lecturers....it's no wonder the universities are churning out entitled snowflakes.

R0wantrees · 07/11/2018 18:39

There is a suggestion that the NUS is facing serious financial issues.

Rose of Dawn shared a Guido Fawkes article suggesting it was 'on verge of bankruptsy order'

FloralBunting · 07/11/2018 18:42

I await the righteous tweets from the brave little warriors who stopped a woman from speaking because she 'uncritically encouraged people to question'.

Perhaps they'll be eagerly moving to China or North Korea where those skills will be truly celebrated.

R0wantrees · 07/11/2018 18:42

Telegraph article link above:
(extract)
"But on Wednesday Murray told the History Society that she is no longer able to attend the event due to “personal reasons”.

Earlier this week, three student groups wrote a joint letter urging their peers to “publicly condemn” Murray’s views and “if possible, cancel the event”.

The LGBTQ+ campaign and Women’s Campaign, both of which are run by Oxford University’s student union, as well as the LGBTQ Society have all signed the letter.

They say that “inviting publically transphobic speakers to the university, without challenge, further marginalises and unnecessarily compromises the welfare of trans students and staff”.

Students claimed that Murray “explicitly transphobic comments” in a newspaper article last year, in which she argued that trans women who have lived as men “with all the privilege that entails” do not have the experience of growing up female.

The students’ letter contains “trigger warnings” for “Terfs”, which stands for Trans-Exclusionary Radical Feminists, and is generally used as a derogatory term to describe those who believe that “identifying” as a woman is not the same as being born a woman.

It can also be used to refer to people who are deemed to hold transphobic views. The letter also carries a warning for “transmisogyny”, a term used to describe those who are both transphobic as well as a misogynist .

Murray has previously said that she “made very clear” in her article that she “fully support the right of trans women to be accorded the respect and protection I would demand for any human being, regardless of sex or gender”.

BrickByBrick · 07/11/2018 18:52

Whilst the rights and wrongs are best not debated here I do think that the introduction of fees has had a negative effect on expectations.

I have contact with university students in my job, one said that there is very much an attitude of 'I pay your wages, so serve me' and another said that they were now having to sign in for both halves of a lecture as so many would go for the break and not come back.

Rather than thinking 'this is costing thousands I need to get this right' it is more often 'I'm paying for this so they have to do what I say.'

Ereshkigal · 07/11/2018 19:23

The letter also carries a warning for “transmisogyny”, a term used to describe those who are both transphobic as well as a misogynist .

No Telegraph. Those fuckers are the misogynists.

whatsthecomingoverthehill · 07/11/2018 19:32

I see lots of TRAs claiming that press negativity is causing mental health issues etc. Don't They realise that it is precisely this sort of shit that leads to the negative coverage? If Murray had just gone along and done her talk it wouldn't have drawn any attention. But now it's in the national press. Again.

R0wantrees · 07/11/2018 19:36

Twitter response to the letter:

twitter.com/OxfordSU_LGBTQ/status/1059772587482533888

Biologifemini · 07/11/2018 19:37

Well this is good news. It is exceptionally bad form and awful press for Oxford here.

Doesn’t look good for critical thinking so maybe the university will do something now.

KatVonGulag · 07/11/2018 20:13

Well that's me buying Jennis book for Christmas.

Hateful little shits

hipsterfun · 07/11/2018 20:21

Uncritical questioning is a thing now? Hmm

these people are getting the best education money can buy

At present, one rather suspects not.

WarmWishes · 07/11/2018 20:22

Wow! That twitter feed was something else. Lots of non anonymous accounts, incredulous! Perhaps LGBTQ Oxford has done us all a favour and people with normal, moderate views will be able to speak out now.

Floisme · 07/11/2018 20:23

Some great lines on that Twitter thread. I think this is my favourite: ’You're in Oxford University and you think humans can change sex? Fuck me - and yous'll all be fast-tracked to the top as well.’

Or as Julie Bindel once put it: You’re afraid of Jenni Murray? You don’t know you’re born.’

WarmWishes · 07/11/2018 20:24

I liked the one that said...

You are afraid of Jenny Murray? That's like being afraid of hot chocolate and baked goods.

BertrandRussell · 07/11/2018 20:29

Julie Bindel's giving a talk st the Universiry of Kent on Tuesday-I wonder how that's going to go?

Carriemac · 07/11/2018 20:55

Just ordered her book . Thanks for bringing it to my attention oxford lgbt it looks great

GCAcademic · 07/11/2018 20:59

Julie Bindel was at Reading University last week, speaking with Rosa Freedman. From what I gather, there weren’t any protests, though they had a speaker pull out at the last minute.