How do we come back from this argument?

[Sunrise888]

DH and I have had bad colds all weekend so neither of us are feeling great. DH was getting a headache so I told him to go to bed and I would settle down DS who is 1yo.

Before he did, I started to talk about a photographer who is visiting our baby class and whether we should bother getting photos. DH initially said he trusted me to use my own judgement, but when I persisted for his opinion, he snapped that photographers were overpriced and insulted the expensive wedding photographer we used and the pictures we got out of it. (The photographer had been my choice and I had talked DH into it, paying the excess of what we'd planned to pay out of my own pocket. We've said since that we should have got someone else, but the photos are mostly fine/lovely.) I felt really hurt that he was throwing this in my face and retorted that we'd paid far more for all the friends he'd invited and I was pressured to invite when I'd only wanted a very small family wedding. (Again we've talked about this before. DH had a great day, but when I told him much later I hadn't enjoyed it as much because of all the people, he felt terrible that he had pressured me into a wedding I didn't enjoy.)

Anyway, he saw how upset I was so he took DS off me and said he'd put him to bed, so I went to bed on my own. Later he needed help setting DS which I did. He apologised and asked we don't argue in front of DS, but I was still too upset to say anything.

We've not been getting on so well - the stress of the wedding and having a baby have not brought out the best in us. DH was really, really great in the face of it all, looked after me and excused a lot because I'd had a baby. But in the last few months his patience had worn thin a bit, and he's started to snipe back, which he recognised and is trying to contain. Since we've had the baby, I've been less kind to him. He half jokes about me being mean to him and I do apologise, but recently he's started to snipe back. I feel like because I've been so difficult this last year, I've turned my lovely DH into someone a little less lovely. 😪

I do feel bad about last night in that he was probably just feeling ill and I was talking to him when he just wanted to go to bed. And this is the first time I have said anything to purposefully hurt DH - I didn't just blurt it out, I thought about what I was going to say, and said it knowing it would hurt him. I hate myself but I'm still angry.

I need talking down. We are supposed to make some big decisions with houses and moving today and I am feeling petty wanting to postpone the decisions because I'm so mad. I think sometimes we should get counseling, but I also think I haven't slept a full night in a year and this is just how things are with a baby,, and it will get better.

I'd love some advice please. I hate apologising without talking things through - I don't feel very genuine about my apology otherwise. But I don't think the wedding photographer/wedding pressure talk is one I want to have again as we can't change the past.

[Sunrise888]

And sorry about the length!

[Bufferingkisses]

Essentially you seem to be saying that your dh used to let you get away with poor behaviour because you'd just had a baby and now is getting less willing to do that.

That's not you turning him into a less lovely person that is you continuing poor behaviour and pushing him beyond his limits.

Look at what behaviour he "let's you get away with" and stop it! Everyone has a right to say enough is enough. Sounds like your dh is saying it loud and clear.

[bubbles108]

Why do you feel it's ok to be mean to him?

[Sunrise888]

@Bufferingkisses yes you are right, my behaviour has been poor. I can be really unreasonable, but I think it's mostly tiredness and I don't know how to mitigate.

On this occasion I should just apologise shouldn't I, and stop myself from hitting DH on purpose.

[Sunrise888]

@bubbles108, until last night I was never purposefully mean. My sense of humour had become sharper and DH finds my teasing him both funny and a bit too close to the bone, so a tiny bit hurtful in the context of my poorer behaviour. I don't mean to be mean - my relatives are like this and I hate it so I can't believe I've picked it up so late - I said I'd try to stop, but DH finds me funny enough to tell me not to. 🤔

[Bumpitybumper]

I think this kind of thing is incredibly common when you have recently had a baby as it's such a massive adjustment, hormones are all over the place and the sleep deprivation kicks in. It is an incredibly testing time for lots of couples and can really push a relationship to its limits. Don't feel bad for struggling!

Having said all that it seems that the main issue is that you have been treating your husband in a manner that you recognise to be unfair and unkind. It can be really hard to be the best versions of ourselves when we are tired and exhausted but maybe trying to count to 10 before reacting could help? Emotions can run high in the moment and magnify everything, before you know it you've reacted and said something you regret and the whole situation has escalated. You need to try and diffuse things before they get to this point otherwise it just leaves everyone with regrets and feeling bad.

[Sunrise888]

*hurting, not hitting!

[Sunrise888]

@Bumpitybumper thanks for your understanding and advice, it's really helpful to read it through. Counting to 10 is a good idea.

I don't want to escalate things and I don't want to say things I'll regret. Usually if I am upset with something DH has said, I'll take myself into another room or go for a walk and think it through, and then come back and talk it over. DH hates this - even though he understands why I do it, he says he feels frozen out and very far away from me. I think it may also come across as having a sulk - well it feels that way! But I need time to feel mad and calm myself down before I say more stuff I will regret. I think this is the first time I've not done that.

[Aus84]

The stress of having a baby, lack of sleep and also being sick is getting to the both of you and thats completely normal. If you otherwise love each other and generally treat each other well then you'll be fine. DH and I have had heaps of meaningless arguments over the years coinciding with my childrens early years. Sometimes little things that bothered you (the photographer in your DH's case) blow up into big things due to lack of sleep. Parenting is bloody hard. Every day is a blur of the exact same thing and you feel like you have lost a significant part of who you were. IT GETS BETTER.

When you have calmed down it might be worthwhile to tell your DH how much you appreciate him.

[Sunrise888]

I'll go all quiet too because I'm thinking through what I want to say, but from DH's perspective it feels like I'm giving him the silent treatment even when I've told him what I'm doing.

[Sunrise888]

@Aus84 thanks, reading these replies is helping me feel a lot calmer.

[flippyfloppyflower]

Tis time for you to grow up. You still have a lovely husband but he is not prepared to put up with your childish behaviour anymore. Think before you speak and ask why you want to hurt the man you love. Your husband is now only standing for himself and you cannot blame him for that.

[Sunrise888]

@Bufferingkisses

That's not you turning him into a less lovely person that is you continuing poor behaviour and pushing him beyond his limits.

I agree when I'm pushing him. But he has a lot less patience for me too when I'm not, like when I'm being genuinely forgetful. I guess I'm just trying to say that he used to have endless patience for me and for 8 years found my dopeyness endearing, but because I've been more difficult this last year, he now finds it annoying 😥.

[Aus84]

No probs OP. Most of us have been there at some point.

I guess I'm just trying to say that he used to have endless patience for me and for 8 years found my dopeyness endearing, but because I've been more difficult this last year, he now finds it annoying

You just need to remember that he is going through the same stresses as you at the moment. It may just be that he is at mental capacity with everything else going on so he is becoming more abrupt with you - it's just easier.

[Loopytiles]

Suggest focusing on things to mitigate the sleep deprivation. Are you sharing the night parenting, for example?

How long ago was the wedding?! Many of us had weddings where some things - or everything - didn’t go well, or found it difficult. DH agreed to the photographer. You agreed to DH’s guests and seem to have “milked” your disappointment over it IMO. I had a similar issue with wanting a small wedding and feeling very uncomfortable on the day.

Compromise very often isn’t possible. Things get messy if we “give in” and then get angry about it. Best to not give in in the first place if it’s truly a “red line” for you.

It’s unfair to bring things up from past issues: first your DH with his barbed comments, and then you. Also unfair to be sharp in “teasing” your H.

DH and I try to abide by the “rule” that if we disagree over a decision (frequently!) (eg your choices of a wedding photographer and what size wedding to have) we have the debate/argument before the decision is taken, which sometimes delays decisions! Eg We took 2 years to decide to leave London after DC2: I really didn’t want to. But then, once made, it’s a joint decision - even if one person wasn’t fully “on board” - and however it turns out it’s not on to hold onto resentment and bring it up.

Did you always have a competitive edge in the relationship?

[CircleofWillis]

What examples of ‘meanness’ or ‘dopeyness’ do you have? In the example you gave in your OP it sounds as if you misjudged the time for the discussion but he was the first person to become mean by bringing up the wedding photographer as an example of your previous misjudgement. When you initially asked about the baby photos, He could have started off by saying this kind of photographer is too expensive for what you get and left it at that.

[Loopytiles]

How long are these “time outs” when you feel angry? 10 minutes is one thing, and probably sensible, hours or days, if it happens regularly - is unreasonable. stonewalling. One should ideally be able to feel angry or upset and still communicate assertively, ie not aggressively or stonewalling.

[Masterbuilders]

Actually on the grand scheme of things, this is a minor argument. Yet already you’ve said dramatically you don’t know if you can come back from it.

It sounds like actually he’s a good man. You admit he’s been putting up with a lot, you’ve not been very nice to him. If this were a reversal the phrase potentially emotionally abusive would’ve been said. Tired or not.

He said clearly he didn’t want to argue in front of the child. He doesn’t sound like a bad man to me.

It sounds like you’re pushing him away and determined to do so.

[Sunrise888]

@Aus84

It may just be that he is at mental capacity with everything else going on so he is becoming more abrupt with you - it's just easier.

Yes you're right. It does hurt, but I should recognise that he's going through a lot too.

[Bluetrews25]

You are both overtired and not well.Stop fighting to be 'right', it doesn't matter.
Your DC is old enough to learn to sleep now (I know many will disagree and think me inhumane) Lack of sleep is having a bad effect on your marriage and on your health, so it is time you did something about it. Or you could just wait passively until DC is about 10 and decides to sleep through naturally! Look into some kind of sleep training for the sake of your health, whatever else you decide to do regarding your relationship. DCs need to be taught this, just like riding a bike or swimming or reading. IHMO, I know many disagree. Just putting the idea out there for your consideration.

[Sunrise888]

@Loopytiles I comfort feed the baby, he won't take a bottle overnight. The only option I guess is sleep training but I'm not ready for that yet.

That's a good strategy regarding compromise. The wedding was 2 years ago and I know I compromised too much, trying to make everyone happy. We debated over decisions, got stressed, and I'd cave to smooth things over, which is another issue I'm working on. But you are right, ultimately we both agreed and it's not fair or helpful to debate it in hindsight.

Did you always have a competitive edge in the relationship?

Yes, though I think DH is worse for this. From the beginning, if I was upset over something he said, I'd tell him and he'd apologise, but then go into a big self examination of why he did it, and turn it into whatever past issues or stresses he was feeling that caused it. When I would just want a quick apology and to move on. He'd do the same if I was upset about anything really, turn it into a discussion about him. I haven't really ever talked to him about this, I felt bad at whatever he was going through and wanted to let him talk it out, but I felt a bit frustrated that I couldn't talk about what I wanted to talk about without it becoming about him.

[Iggi999]

WHY haven't you hadn't you hadn't a full nights sleep in a year, when you have a partner? He hasn't managed to take the baby for even one night to let you catch up on sleep? Or decent lie ins?
It's easier for him to moan about you not being the woman you once were I suppose than recreate the conditions in which you were that woman!

[Iggi999]

Get yourself off to a hotel for a night and the baby will either take a bottle or cope without. It's just a night.

[RainySeptember]

It sounds like a trivial argument that escalated.

You asked his opinion about whether to get photographs done but didn't actually want his reply - that photographers are overpriced and can produce work of dubious standard, such as the one you used for your wedding (and had both previously agreed wasn't as good as you expected).

I don't read that as him being mean really, given that your recent wedding experience was salient to the discussion.

You then unnecessarily escalated it by reminding him that you didn't enjoy your own wedding because he had the audacity to invite his friends, which also pushed the cost up.

I don't think it's the same thing at all. 'Remember we didn't rate our wedding photographer' is much less contentious than 'I didn't enjoy my wedding because you invited your friends'.

Having said that, being tired and ill, and having a new baby, does make for short tempers so I don't think a single argument is very much to worry about.

[AnElderlyLadyOfMediumHeight]

'Actually on the grand scheme of things, this is a minor argument. Yet already you’ve said dramatically you don’t know if you can come back from it.'

This. I was expecting something much, much worse from your thread title. Why make such a huge deal out of something so trivial in the scheme of things? Is/are one of both of you afraid of conflict? To me, this reads as if you'd had a brief, mild tit-for-tat exchange and you were still sulking/refusing to talk to him long after the anger should have subsided. Has your dh been used to keeping you happy in the past?

And honestly, why didn't you leave him alone when he said he was happy to leave the decision about photos to you? I could understand persisting if this was about something important - which house to move to, or which school to send the dc to - but over family photos? Again, it seems you have a tendency to make trivial things into a big deal.

FWIW, he has a point about photographers being overpriced, particularly if they have to tout for business by going round baby classes rather than being good enough for people to go to them on their own strength.