To ask how you came to support Welsh independence?

[TrufflyPig]

Since there was some call for an Annibyniaeth thread on another discussion I thought I would start one. I’d be interested to hear your stories of how you came to support the cause.

Were you always for independence? If not what changed your mind?

I’ll start:

I am actually English, I came to Wales for university nearly 20 years ago and have been here ever since. I have lived in various places throughout Wales over the years. I am married to a Welsh man and have two children.

Like many others I used to laugh at the thought of Wales ever becoming an independent country, the idea seemed so far fetched and ludicrous. I believed a lot of what was said: Wales can’t afford it, it doesn’t have the infrastructure, only the Plaid lot want it etc etc. I even voted no to more devolved powers, I believed in a United Kingdom.

When Scotland had their referendum my husband started to support the idea that Wales could do it too, I still didn’t think so one bit.

Then Brexit happened, I voted remain and I was honestly shocked and upset by the result. I watched the Scottish reaction thinking I would be so angry if I were them, they were warned they wouldn’t get the same EU benefits that they already had if they chose independence but now they have to leave anyway.

So I started looking into it, Scotland seemed to have a lifeline for getting back into EU and
I wanted that too. I also liked Leanne Wood the newly appointed Plaid Cymru leader at the time, I thought her appointment was a bold choice and it might change the image of the party.

I also started to research how smaller nations were using renewable energy as a major income source and Wales was mentioned as a country with potential for this. I started a new job and worked alongside someone who has stood for Plaid Cymru in the assembly elections who sent me links to articles about independence and I would say I become ‘Indy curious’.

What tipped me over the edge was the election last year. I felt helpless. It doesn’t matter how Wales votes one bit. Even if every seat in Wales and Scotland had gone for Labour it would not have been enough to overturn the English Conservative majority.

I put off fully joining Yes Cymru until about a month ago though. The constant anti-devolution rhetoric over Covid restrictions in the media has made me want to be more pro-active in supporting independence. I’m not the only one. Support for Annibyniaeth is at an all time high.

[Allthestarsarecloser]

I’ll join! I’m welsh, living in England with all my family in Wales. I always thought that Wales was too poor and too small until my sister started becoming Indy curious & then I started to read articles etc.

The election happened, then the pandemic & the combination of how the Welsh government dealt with it plus the general rhetoric around wales started to make me thinks - the way it’s language, culture is represented etc. And people like UKIP deciding to make the welsh assembly their next target & loads of wealthy English MP’s thinking they have the right to interfere in welsh democracy. And I had a revelation, though fuck this and joined Yes Cymru! I have never looked back.

Yanbu to ask about this- it’s really interesting to hear people’s stories & it’s a fast growing movement.

Annibyniaeth 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿

[MootingMirror]

I would assume that most people come to support Welsh independence through developing a complete lack of common sense and no understanding of economics.

[pinkearedcow]

I am Welsh in Wales. I have always been a bit on the fence. But I tell you, oh I tell you. The scorn that has been heaped on Wales as it has gone through this pandemic making its own decisions (the accusations of point scoring, trying to be difficult etc. etc.) and the insane frenzy about the non-essentials thing (which I think was a daft decision but hardly the crime of the century) has tipped me to the Yes side.

[TrufflyPig]

Oh yeah, I forgot about those ‘abolish the Welsh assembly’ lot on Facebook.

[TrufflyPig]

@MootingMirror I wasn’t asking for assumptions I was asking for personal stories. If you have one regarding your own experiences and why you don’t support independence for Wales then you are more than welcome to share it.

But I suspect you are just trolling.

[Shamoo]

Genuine question, didn’t Wales vote in favour of Brexit? I know certainly large parts of it did, but not sure overall.

[pinkearedcow]

@Shamoo

Genuine question, didn’t Wales vote in favour of Brexit? I know certainly large parts of it did, but not sure overall.

Yes it did.

[FlyingFlamingo]

I could have written your post @Allthestarsarecloser! I too grew up in England (only just over the border though, we even had Eisteddfods!) and moved to Wales for university 20 years ago, after living by the sea for 3 years I decided I could never go back to where I grew up.

I always thought the Assembly as it was then was just another layer of bureaucracy, a waste of money really. Then I started working in public health and started seeing how things are done differently here, once Labour were voted out in England and the differences really became clear I had a bit of a wake up call. My own profession has been heavily invested in here whilst in England services have been cut to the bone and I can really see how demoralising that must be.
Then the referendum happened and the absolute shitshow the U.K. government has been since then. It’s opened my eyes to how London centric they all are, they really don’t give any kind of crap about Wales, Scotland, NI, or even parts of their own country. The pandemic has clearly highlighted that. Whilst our FM considers evidence, answers questions and shows compassion Boris hides in fridges and runs away from scrutiny.
When Yes Cymru started sharing articles pointing out that we pay more tax per capita than NZ it was a bit of a revelation for me. I really believe we can prosper without Westminster. Whether we’ll ever be given the opportunity to find out is another matter, I can’t see Westminster allowing a referendum

[TrufflyPig]

@Shamoo Yes. I think en large because it doesn’t have an independent media like Scotland does, so logic suggests that it follows English choices more. I’m not necessarily saying rejoining would be tied to independence (that’s just something I would personally like).

Also this (but it wasn’t me 😂):

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/sep/22/english-people-wales-brexit-research

[Shamoo]

To be fair, I do think that Wales gets treated really poorly by the English element of the U.K. I’m not surprised there is an increasing swell towards independence, although I’m not sure that Wales are as well placed to manage it as the Scots.

I am an English person raised on the border of Wales, and it makes me so sad to see how the Union is going. But I’m not surprised.

[tttigress]

Wales did vote in favour of Brexit

[Allthestarsarecloser]

To all those commenting on the Welsh Brexit vote, please read this article:

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/sep/22/english-people-wales-brexit-research

[TrufflyPig]

@Shamoo I think it’s a valid point that Wales is not as well placed as Scotland to do it. Maybe in part down to a slight lack of ambition in the use of devolved power compared to them? It’s possible to get there though I think.

[Allthestarsarecloser]

While I don’t agree with this view, some welsh nationalists don’t agree with wales being part of the EU as it goes. That’s too extreme for me & I believe the answer lies somewhere in the middle. But the brexit vote was in 2016 and a lot has changed in wales since then hence the current surge in Indy Wales support.

[Allthestarsarecloser]

And here’s an article by a welsh economist who has written extensively about how wales could afford to be independent;

nation.cymru/opinion/forget-project-fear-why-an-independent-wales-would-have-no-problem-choosing-a-currency-and-managing-its-budget/

[noideaatallreally]

Born and bred in Wales. I have lived for the past 30 of those years in a Welsh speaking area. When the time came to vote I was very much on the fence. My Welsh speaking husband has family who live in England and who therefore clearly did not get to vote. It was when my husband's auntie said how proud she was that Wales would possibly, just possibly, have the chance to make decisions (at least some decisions!) for themselves, rather than being told what to do like an errant child that I realised just how much this vote meant to people. It really was a once in a lifetime opportunity to hold out head up high. I voted for.

Now, in the aftermath of the Brexit shitstorm, and the realisation that people who threw away the future of my children and grandchildren because they believed the lies they were being peddled, I realise more than ever that there one time only votes are so important. It's not like voting for a governemnt when you get to change your mind every 4 or 5 years - it is a vote that will change society for ever.

I am really pleased that I votes for independence. I don't agree with everything the Welsh Government does, but I do think they have handled covid better than Boris. I am proud to live in a country that allows all people free prescriptions and made the right call when it came to free school meals.

[Shamoo]

@TrufflyPig totally agree that it is doable and I think that’s where we will get to before too much longer. Does make me sad, although I absolutely understand why.

[SerendipityJane]

@MootingMirror

I would assume that most people come to support Welsh independence through developing a complete lack of common sense and no understanding of economics.

So where should they go for lessons ? England ?

[KrakowDawn]

I'm British, with a Welsh grandparent on each side. I honestly do not see how Wales could survive as an independent nation. What are its exports?
Are you expecting to rejoin the EU (even though Wales as a whole voted to leave as far as I'm aware) and then rely on subsidies? How much income has been lost this year due to the closedown of tourism?

[TrufflyPig]

@KrakowDawn Read the article above posted by Allthestars

[Allthestarsarecloser]

Here’s another of many articles about why Wales can be independent. nation.cymru/opinion/10-arguments-that-will-make-you-think-again-about-welsh-independence/

There are 100 other countries smaller than wales who are independent. The too small/ too poor argument has been debunked many times.

[Mydogmylife]

I'm Scottish, living in Scotland , support independence and wish you all the luck . We have had a large increase in support for indie here, so hopefully this will help your cause also! Saor Alba !!

[TheFishingTrip2019]

Trying not to out myself too much

I joined v recently after being indy curious for a few months, in fact maybe it was brexit that got me curious and covid tipped me over the edge!

I feel like its time for a positive movement for change and hopefully yes cymru is the way to get that done!

[SerendipityJane]

From an English point of view, Wales should be streets ahead of Scotland for independence, having it's own language for a start.

[nosswith]

I have been in favour of Welsh independence since I was a teenager. A grandfather was Welsh, his first language was Welsh, and my dad though born in England was very proud of being half-Welsh. It is as with my support for Scottish independence (which I came to probably in my thirties) a belief it is culturally a separate country, and not just the language.