Childcare vouchers and maternity leave - we've gotta fight for our rights!!

[ceebee74]

This is a spin off from an ante-natal thread but feel free to join in if you are in this situation - there are currently 3 of us trying to get to the bottom of the new legislation that has just come in.

Vbab&Sparkle - what I meant by 'paying twice' may not affect you if you just receive statutory maternity pay whilst on mat leave - but my employer has quite a generous scheme so I get 8 weeks at full pay, 18 weeks at half pay plus SMP and the final 13 weeks at SMP only - so they can still deduct the vouchers for the first 26 weeks of my mat leave as I am receiving something other than SMP.

However the amount of my maternity pay is calculated on the average I earned during 17-25th weeks of pg so, if I had still taken the vouchers during those weeks, my salary would have been lower (as it would have been on an amount with the vouchers deducted) therefore my mat pay would be based on the lower amount and then during my mat leave, as I receive Occupational Maternity Pay, they would also have deducted the £243 vouchers aswell - so technically I would have paid twice for them - does that make sense?

It doesn't really affect you if you only receive SMP apart from the first 6 weeks.

Anyway, going to work out the figures now as I do think, if it is right that you can't have it both ways, I have picked the best option for me.

But, when I cancelled my vouchers in July, the woman at our voucher provider knew it was so my pay would not be affected and she confirmed I could restart them in September so I am a bit confused about this stopping and restarting business. Will try and find out more.

CeebsI have another question, in the Daycare Trust leaflet it states OML is up to 26 weeks. Is this not out of date as OML was increased to 39 weeks from April 07?

My maternity letter from work even states OML lasts for 9 months. Do you know anything about this??

Sparks - just had a look at it. It seems to be classing OML as weeks 1-26 and AML as weeks 27-52 (even though you are entitled to SMP up to week 39).

It is definitely correct that you will receive SMP for 39 weeks - I think it is just the way they are categorising the mat leave (if that makes sense).

i have just returned from work after a years mat leave. I received 6 months full pay and then 3 months statutory. Knowing nothing about this and still sending my sone to nursery 2 days a week throughout I just left things as they were with the childcare vouchers. Therefore I got them (the full £243) for the 9 months mat pay, then they stopped for 3 months and then they automatically restarted when I went back to work. Have I been ripped off then?

Yeah Ceebs that is what it looks like, SMP is for 39 weeks but OML is only 26 weeks. Have looked on other websites and they all refer to OML being for 26 weeks too.

Don't geddit tho as OML is your entitlement to all benefits etc apart from your normal salary and as far as I can make out you do get holiday entitlement etc for 39 weeks.

I guess if your baby is due after 5.10.08 it doesn't really matter as you are automatically entitled to vouchers for up to 52 weeks (in theory!). But anyone due before this date may have a struggle to get vouchers over the 26 week mark?

Vbab sorry forgot to say have a good last day at work!

of you, it is my last day of annual leave today but I will be back on Mon until end of October. WIll be counting the days!!

I hope your email does the trick, fingers crossed...

MatBackFack, from reading your post I would say no, you got 6 months full pay so vouchers are deductible from you for this period. The new legislation (vouchers for up to 52 weeks) only applies to babies born after 5.10.08. However I am not an expert on this and can only refer you to the links previously posted if you want to look into this more...

I have been wondering about this.

I get vouchers at the moment - if I get pregnant again my maternity pay will be calculated on my salary - the vouchers and then the voucher value will be taken off as well?

What do people tend to do? Stop the vouchers while they're pregnant? Restart them again once they've gone back to work?

I was told back my voucher scheme (Accor), to cancel the vouchers when you get to a certain number of weeks pregnant so it doesn't affect maternity pay.
They will let you cancel them at sort notice in certain circumstances and being pregnant is one of them.

And you can restart them? And is it more cost effective than just carrying on with them given you're effectively paying for them twice?

I'm not sure stealth. I assume you can restart them.
I'm not sure how cost effective it is to do that either.
My DH claims them too, so if I need to stop mine then DH can just up the amount of vouchers he claims.

Stealth - yes, if you don't stop your vouchers for your qualifying weeks for mat pay, then you are effectively paying twice for the vouchers (I think someone described it earlier as 'double-dipped'). But, depending on your circumstances and your company's particular maternity pay scheme, this still may be more beneficial to you.

Everyone's circumstances are different - in my case, it would appear that I would have been better off not stopping my vouchers for my qualifying weeks.

Although we don't seem to be able to get to the bottom of whether you can restart them to get your 'free' ones once you have stopped them for reason of pregnancy/ensuring your mat pay is not affected - am still working on that one.

Sparks - not really sure of difference between OML and AML (and I really should in my job ) but will see if I can find out.

thanks
still confused! so complicated!

Got an update today about my organisation's position on childcare vouchers and maternity leave (it is an NHS Trust).

Basically, they are saying the trust is liable to pay the cost of childcare vouchers once the employee no longer has any pay to deduct the vouchers from - however, there is one exception to this which is:

1. If an employee chooses to leave the scheme prior to taking maternity leave in order to ensure her SMP is not affected (i.e. between 17-25th week of pg) - which basically means I have shot myself in the foot [grrr]

Am really p**d off as I did what I thought was best (with no advice at the time) but now appears I will lose about £200 through the decision I made. I don't know who to talk to about it at work tbh - any ideas?

Ceebee,
I'm really sorry, don't have any advice - I was actually hoping I could pick your brain.
I also work for an NHS Trust, am 21 weeks pg and knew nothing about all of this til I stumbled onto this thread today.
Do you think it's too late for me to do anything? If not, any tips on what information I need, and what I should do with it to work out which choice will leave me best off would be fab.
ARGHHHHHHHH
money.

Hi Spink

Don't worry about not having any advice - the usual advice for people is to go to your HR department but when you are the HR department like I am (with unsupportive bosses who don't agree with the new legislation), where do you go???

Anyway, do you currently receive childcare vouchers? How long are you thinking of taking off? I assume your mat pay scheme is the Agenda for Change one? If you can answer these questions, I can provide some more information for you

I contacted my HR dept about my childcare vouchers when I got PG with No2 as I remembered I;d heard someithng about SMP bieng affected if you took couchers while PG and this was their reply:

^If a company pays the statutory minimum the first 6 weeks this would be paid at 90% of average earnings. The amount used to calculate this is any earnings that attract National Insurance Contributions in the 2 months prior to the 15th weeks before the baby?s due date. This includes salary, car supplement, overtime, bonus etc.

As the childcare vouchers are exempt from National Insurance (up to the £243 per month limit) this reduces the earnings that are NI?able in the period. Therefore this would make a difference to the Higher SMP weekly amount of £50.47.

My company pay the first 10 weeks at 100% of average weekly earnings and as detailed above the individuals average weekly earnings would be reduced by £56.08 (due to taking the £243.00 childcare vouchers per month).

Whilst the individual is in receipt of the childcare vouchers they are saving the PAYE and N.I. (the saving for a 20% taxpayer is £75.33 per month (£17.38 per week) and for a higher rate taxpayer is £99.53 per month (£22.97 per week)).

The remaining weeks are paid at the lower rate of SMP (which is currently £117.18). This is totally unaffected.^

So for me the decision was to save £17.38 a week now or cancel the vouchers for 2 months and get an extra £56.08 a week whilst on mat leave.

Interesting to read about the compnay having to pay for the vouchers once SMP kicks in, will have to remember that

Ceebee, thanks it all seems a bit of a minefield

Yep, I'm on the A4C scheme, as far as I know!
We're already using vouchers, only £104 per month at the mo but we've just increased our childcare so need to go up to the full £243 per month.
I plan to take 9 months off.

Ceebs so are your employers not going to re-start your vouchers at all then or are they just refusing to continue to pay them once SMP kicks in? It all seems a bit sneaky to add in that caveat now to me.

I have no idea how my SMP will be calculated, I asked HR if I would be effectively be paying twice for vouchers and they said (in writing) that no it wouldn't.

However my company only ever offers the state minimum in mat pay so whatever they work the 90% on for the first 6 weeks I guess they will need to pay my vouchers from the start...

Sparks - my colleague has just come back from a regional meeting where this was discussed. I sent her off with some 'hypothetical' questions from me Basically the woman who runs all our childcare stuff for the region has said to rejoin the scheme in September as there is still no official guidance and I made my decision in good faith so it sounds like they won't be asking any questions although only time will tell. However, I am going to delay sending my MatB1 in to payroll until I know September's payroll has definitely been closed down with my vouchers deducted just to be on the safe side (so no-one in payroll puts 2 and 2 together and decides to not let me rejoin) - that is a bit naughty isn't it?? So still work in progress really!

Spinks - unfortunately it is too late for you to make any decisions as the vouchers have to be stopped for the weeks between your 17th and 25th week of pregnancy in order to ensure your maternity pay is not affected. However, I would recommend upping them to the maximum amount though sooner rather than later. But, what will happen with yourself is that during your first 26 weeks, when you are receiving Occupational Pay, it will be based on your average salary during your 17th and 25th week of pg (which will be the amount you receive after your vouchers have been deducted). You can still have the vouchers deducted aswell - so effectively you are paying twice for the vouchers!

However, it is not all bad news - for the last 3 months of your 9 months, you will be on SMP only and your vouchers cannot be deducted from this so your employers will have to give you the £243 vouchers - so for 3 months, this is worth £750-ish.

Does this make sense? Let me know if it doesn't and if you have any further questions.

Ceebs I personally don't think you are being naughty at all. Seems to me like it is everyone for themselves in this situation and employers have accountants/lawyers to discuss this with whereas employees only have themselves to rely on (unless you are/know an accountant/lawyer that is!).

What makes me laugh is it is written in my company's extensive 'list of policies' under mat leave that they will give full and correct advice to all employees going on maternity. If they just try and test me on this one I will be flinging that back at them (naughty or not)...!!

Hi I am currently pregnant - 18 weeks at the mo and due 1st feb 09. I am really confused, can somebody please explain to me what to do.

I have a child already and currently receive the full 243.00 deduction voucher from my wages every month.

I am hoping to receive the 90 % wages for the 1ss six weeks then the remaining stat maternity pay for the remaining. Is the voucher scheme going to effect this.

Please explain what I need to do.

jackieglyn as far as I can see you are in similar position to me. 90% wages for six weeks then SMP for remainder. This is state minimum so your employer should (according to the new law) fit the bill for your vouchers whilst on maternity... Do you receive the vouchers via salary sacrifice - that seems to be important in all this.

I am not sure about the whole vouchers affecting your 6 weeks of mat pay. My own employers have assured me they won't but as the 90% salary is worked out on my wages for last 3 months before I go off don't see how this can be case. However as only get this %age for 6 weeks don't feel it is worth bothering about really in my case... Cancelling vouchers and risking them not being reinstated would cost far more to me.

Should also add... don't be surprised if your employer doesn't seem to know anything about this new law... I also wait to hear whether or not my employers are going to honour this obligation or find some way out of it.

Jackie - what Sparks says is the case - basically you will be entitled to have your vouchers (but without any deductions from your pay) for as long as you choose to stay on maternity leave (upto 12 months).

My colleague who went to the meeting spoke to my big boss today about it (who doesn't agree with it) but it is clear he has accepted that this is the way it is and was talking about how they can put the money aside to fund it

But she nearly dropped me in it by telling him about this 'stopping before you are 17 weeks' business - I was sat there thinking 'don't say it don't say it' - fortunately she didn't because I couldn't lie to him and say that I hadn't stopped them could I?

Ooh that was a close one Ceebs!

No don't think you could actually lie to him as he could quite easily find out the truth and that would look real bad on you... Even tho you know my own feelings on this!