In trouble at work - what to do?

[neveragooddeed]

NC for this.

I'm in trouble at work. For context, I'm a high achiever who goes above and beyond, has glowing appraisals, blah blah.

My colleague, let's call her Brenda, told me that she was being bullied by Roger. I was a shoulder to cry on until Brenda went to HR, who recommended she lodge a grievance against Roger.

Brenda then went on sick leave with stress and, while off, asked me to contact another colleague, Samantha, to say that, if she witnessed anything, Samantha could speak to HR in confidence. I did so, discreetly, without naming Roger. I am now facing formal disciplinary action from HR because I should not have spoken to Samantha.

Apart from stepping on HR's toes, which I have already apologised for, I don't really know what the offence is. I have no idea how to defend myself against this. What should I be doing?

I may as well also mention that I'm interviewing for a role at another company. If they ask for a reference and I have a disciplinary on my record, what will they be told? I will be well and truly fucked off if I lose this opportunity because I tried to help a vulnerable colleague. Never a good deed goes unpunished and all that.

Thanks for any advice or insights.

I've managed to get hold of my elusive union rep so I'll have that conversation later today. Thanks everyone.

you were asked to pass on a message to another person, from the person too poorly to be at work
The issue might be that it wasn't just passing a message, but behaviour that HR might consider a campaign of harassing other staff to act as a witness.

I expect the other staff made a co.pkaint that they felt harrassed or bullied to pass on information against Roger.

I can imagine that something like this could have happened, but assuming OP wasn't dropping heavy hints, the fact that she didn't mention Roger's name will be useful mitigation. Brenda almost certainly shouldn't have initiated this.

Sounds as bit bizarre, unless you've left something out of your version of events perhaps?

The must give you a full written description of what exactly they are claiming you have done that is in breach of HR Policy, and precisely what said policy says and means.

Unless you, personally, had been told specifically and directly not to do "X Y Z..." because an open HR complaint involving "A and B" was currently under investigation, then I fail to see how you can be held liable for the actions which you have described here.......

This is possible, but I hope it's not the case. I'm not an intimidating character, I already knew Samantha fairly well, and approached it very gently... but then that's my perception - Samantha might have perceived it differently.

Have you been told ‘you’ are under investigation or the investigator is investigating Brenda’s claims against Roger and you’ll be a witness?
I fail to see what you have breached.
it’s not ideal- she put you in a difficult position and should ah e raised a grievance herself rather than try to rally up people before. But there was no formal investigation going on at the time so you haven’t breached anything

Are you on the same level as B, R & S or are you a manager, do any of you hold seniority over the other 3 individuals?

Thanks everyone for your help. I think maybe the situation sounds bizarre because my OP says I'm facing a disciplinary. I realise now that that's not right - that's the next bit and it hasn't got that far yet. I would be entitled to more info if it did come to a disciplinary.

The union rep was helpful. He said that technically I should have given my concerns to HR rather than talking to Samantha, but (paraphrasing) it wasn't a huge deal and he couldn't see it would be in HR's best interests to pursue it. He said I'd be entitled to union/legal support if it went to a disciplinary. In the meantime, it was possible it would just fizzle out.

Keeping my fingers crossed!

The union bloke was half right. Sticking your oar into someone else's formal grievance procedure again a colleague is lunacy.

We don't have clear banding here but I'm probably a little more senior than Roger. Separate department though, separate reporting lines.

Key bits to keep repeating.
Best intent.
Signposted to HR.
Didnt ask anything yourself.
Wasnt aware of any policy that said shouldn’t.
Keen to understand where issue lies so can avoid repeat as thought supporting colleague and signposting to HR was appropriate.

I’d hazard a guess there’s some he said she said going on, they’ve had to tell you that looking into something. Itll come to nothing.

My advice below given nothing is formal yet, so you have the opportunity to be proactive before anything is formalised.

First thing to do is get hold of and thoroughly read your company disciplinary policy/process - this should clearly articulate the process the business needs to follow at each stage of a disciplinary and what to expect should the process unfold.

If this becomes a formal process, you should receive something which sets out the basis for the disciplinary - what you are alleged to have done/not done, what law / internal policy / procedure or rule you are considered to have broken/failed to comply with and setting out the process they will follow.

You are likely to be invited to attend a meeting where they will formally put the ‘infractions’ to you and allow you the opportunity to respond and you have a right to be accompanied by a companion (union rep or colleague) and I’d advise you should exercise that right.

Hopefully, it won’t come to that and you’ll just get a slap on the wrist and a reminder not to get too involved in HR matters involving other colleagues, even when your intentions are pure!

Re your reference, unless the disciplinary was likely to result in an outcome of being dismissed, I don’t believe any other disciplinary outcomes are ever cited in a reference - so even a final written warning would not be disclosed. Most workplace references now are handled by HR departments and are limited to confirming job title and dates of employment. In fact, most companies now actively discourage employees from providing references, unless it is strictly in a personal capacity.

Is Roger a favourite? It sounds like they are trying to safeguard him but throwing everyone else under the company bus

What policy have you broken?

had you been instructed not to speak to Samantha?

I am still not clear on what policy has been broken ???? Also has Brenda actually started a formal process ?? Had everyone been told it’s confidential and not to discuss ? I think they are deluded if they think people don’t discuss this sort of thing in the workplace.

Who on earth do you work for M15?

Seems like a plot from Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy.

Tell your Union Rep to get his/her arse out of gear. And that your want a meeting asap.

Your HR Deptndon't sound too competent either.

Used to have a couple of friends who worked in HR back in the day and became very disillusioned about their jobs and left.

They thought HR stood for Human Remains

Hope you get things sorted.

Yeah. All you did was pass on a message from Brenda to Samantha. You didn't even name this Roger guy. What the hell is the problem?

Check your works disciplinary policy to see if your alleged misdementor aligns with the criteria for formal disciplinary or should it be more like an informal issue? Unless you have had a letter / email / meeting about this with HR or a manager then I would say that its hot air. But just prepare yourself. Acknowledge you shouldn't have got involved but you were trying to support a colleague which you now understand you shouldnt have done. Do a statement to yourself via email recording what you said and colleagues response (using just initials or colleague 1 / colleague 2 etc) so there is a record of the event you can rely on if needed.
Here is some AI advice which seems sensible - What HR are disciplining you for is almost certainly this: you became involved in an active grievance process between two other employees without authorisation. In HR terms, that is framed as “interfering with a formal process”, “breach of confidentiality”, or “acting outside role and authority”. It is not about your intent, it is about procedure and control of risk.
That distinction matters for your defence.
What you should do now:

1. Get everything in writing.
2. Ask HR for the exact allegation, the policy you are said to have breached, and what potential outcomes are being considered. You cannot defend yourself properly without knowing the precise charge.
3. Bring representation.
4. If you are in a union, involve them immediately. If not, take a trusted colleague as your companion to any formal meeting. Do not attend disciplinary meetings alone.
5. Frame your actions correctly.
6. Your defence is not “I was helping a friend”. Your defence is:
7. You acted in good faith.
8. You followed a request from a colleague who was distressed and off sick.
9. You did not name the alleged bully.
10. You did not investigate.
11. You did not gather evidence.
12. You did not spread allegations.
13. You believed you were signposting to HR, not bypassing HR.
14. As soon as HR raised concern, you apologised and did not repeat the action.

That positions this as an error of judgement at worst, not misconduct.

1. Ask what actual risk or harm was caused.
2. This is important. Calmly ask:
3. “What specific harm has the organisation suffered as a result of my action?”
4. If they cannot clearly articulate real harm, it weakens any sanction.
5. Push for proportionality.
6. Even if they find you technically breached a policy, this sits at the very lowest end of seriousness. The realistic outcome, if handled properly, is advice or informal management guidance, not a warning.

On the reference and your new job: This is the part people panic about unnecessarily. In most UK organisations:

• References are factual only.
• They usually confirm job title, dates of employment, sometimes sickness record.
• They do not normally disclose disciplinary matters unless:
• a) You were dismissed for misconduct.
• b) The role is regulated (safeguarding, finance, etc.).
• c) They are directly asked and it is materially relevant.

If you receive only an informal warning or even a first written warning and you are still employed, it is very unlikely to be mentioned in a reference. Also, many employers now provide automated HR references only, with no narrative at all. If you want absolute certainty, you can ask HR directly: “What does this organisation include in external references?” They should answer that. What not to do:

• Do not resign in panic.
• Do not send emotional emails.
• Do not continue discussing the grievance with anyone.
• Do not criticise HR’s handling in writing at this stage.

people who try to support others often get caught in organisational crossfire. But HR’s role is to protect the organisation legally, not to reward moral behaviour.

This is why I never had closer friendships at work.
Brenda was off work with stress, however, if she wanted Samantha to spy for her there is absolutely no reason why she couldn't talk to Samantha on the phone- so why didn't she do that?
My guess would Brenda has been in one of these situations before, and knew if she talked to Samantha it could reflect badly and get her in trouble with HR, therefore the solution is to get someone else to talk to Samantha and if it goes bad she will not be in trouble- the person she asked will.
Lesson learned.
I would have steered completely clear once HR were involved, they are the sharks in any company-apex predators hiding behind a screen of empathy.
There is not much you can do, saying sorry is not going to cut it.
You did what they are accusing you of, I doubt it will end in formal disciplinary action, because mostly you just pissed HR off- but it could easily affect your reference.

This. Ask HR for a copy of your disciplinary policy and the staff rules/code of conduct.

HR sound as though they are overstepping their role. I can appreciate, that if the grievance is being investigated they dont want other employees getting involved and 'muddying the waters' but unless they had specifically told you not to discuss this then I find it ridiculous.

Contact your union.

Has your employer raised this as a formal disciplinary matter?

If interviewed ask them to show you which written rule you have potentially breached?

Keep your own precise record of events.

Write down exactly what happened (what, when, where, who) and if they ask you what happened read to them a written statement - too easy to miss things out when under pressure.

If Brenda had already lodged a formal
grievance process she would have been told by HR not to contact anyone involved. She then tried to get around this by asking you to contact instead. She has breached the terms of the grievance process not you (or at least you had no idea and were just trying to help). Brenda should not have put you in that position and I’d stay clear of her from now on.

I have a frustrating update: this has now become a formal disciplinary.

Throughout the investigation, I had the impression they were fishing around to find something concrete I had done wrong. The formal letter gives the allegations: "breach of trust" and "unprofessional conduct". To me, these feel so woolly that they will be impossible to defend.

In the meantime, I've been offered the new job at another company and have accepted. I'm waiting for the contract and they haven't yet asked for references. I know that a reference might or might not include details of a disciplinary outcome. My biggest fear is that they will rescind the offer at a late stage, after I've handed in my notice, and I will be without a job entirely. Not panicking, just nervous.

I will speak to my union rep again and take a PP's advice to talk it through with Acas if possible.

For those of you who placed the blame on Brenda - she's a good egg, just quite naive. Unfortunately it turns out that I am too.

Fingers crossed for you OP. I'm also not sure that you have done anything wrong.

No good deed ever goes unpunished :(

I understand you were offered the new job BEFORE this became a formal investigation? Hence you haven’t declared it?

Worst case, gross misconduct overrides a resignation if you are dismissed BUT what on earth is in it for them I don’t know. I’d be proactive and contact HR and ask about references, saying they will be requested and asking for a copy of it. Also, their next steps in light of your upcoming planned resignation. You don’t want to have a process without the option to defend yourself going ahead. Surely they will be happy you’re off and agree a reference…

Is this a job where there are safeguarding factors, eg teaching, that may lead to an obligation for them to declare unprofessional conduct?

It all sounds a bit mad