I'm shocked at the entitlement, others think it's normal..?

[Bigstyle]

I work for a small charity. There are three very important, very well paid executives and a small team of "workers".

The executives like their coffee and mostly make it themselves, using the office pod machine. But at the end of the day they bring their cups into the main office for the most junior staff member to wash.

Now, I get that our job is basically to support them, but I can't imagine doing this to my staff. The "junior" doesn't have hot drinks so it's not even like she's going to wash her own cup.

I think it's outrageous, the general attitude it demonstrates rather than the task, but they clearly think it's perfectly normal.

Is it?

Ones stuck in the 1970s?

We left this sort of crap behind in 2005 - didn’t we??

I haven’t seen this attitude for absolutely years!! It’s really demeaning

I think it's very inappropriate. I can't see how anyone can argue it isn't.

I agree come unacceptable. They should wash their own mugs.
I had to do this in the early 80s and it was old fashioned then. I can't believe it is still happening in some workplaces

Having been a cleaner in this exact scenario, it's time that's the issue. Even if a dishwasher is how it's done. The time taken to collect all items , load it properly so everything gets clean, often empty it too, takes up time from actually cleaning.
One place I worked had one dishwasher but enough stuff to fill it three times over. I had 1.5 hours and had to run dishwasher and or do it by hand as well as cleaning, mopping, hoovering. You can imagine the time constraints.

Has anyone thought to just leave their cups there?

I’d just leave them. They can wash up, or drink from a dirty cup. But if you really don’t want to do this might I recommend being very thorough with the dish soap and very sparse with the rinse function. It won’t hurt them but the coffee will taste awful.

Does your workplace have generic mugs or does everyone have their own identifiable mug? I think adopting an "everybody washes their own mug" approach is needed here. If necessary get everyone a cheap, but distinctive, mug for Christmas or write names on the bottoms.

It shows poor attitude.

Its good practice to appreciate that this isn't the job role of more junior staff to clean up after you, and to take your turn as it has a benefit to better relationships between junior and senior roles as part of a team where everyone is equally respected on a social level.

Doing to the contrary is frankly, telling other members of staff to 'know their place'.

By the same token already be friendly and respectful to the cleaning staff and security staff as a matter of routine. It goes a long way.

Manners cost nothing. If you haven't got time to clean up after yourself after a tea break or during your lunch, you aren't doing your job properly.

I worked as a secretary in a small, very traditional sort of office between the ages of 17 and 21, so 17 years ago now. I joined fully expecting to be assigned tea making and cup washing duties, but I was never once asked. I was treated like a valued employee, not a skivvy.

I think it's even worse that it's a charity.

I'd be putting an anonymous sign up in the kitchen, please wash your own cups up, your mum doesn't work here or something similar.

Why is this job not done by the cleaners?

They wouldn’t ask the junior staff to clean the toilet.

Tell them that they must wash their cups.
Or ask the trustees to tell them.

Oh fuck off 🤣 you're not too important to spend 30 seconds washing your cup, you absolute quilt

Why would you assume they’re not using their time effectively. It’s more effective for their time at exec level to be spent on the charity work than it is to be washing up.

Unfortunately, it's not rare. The two years I spent working on a global level with charitable foundations were horrific, years on I still don't think I'll ever recover completely from the breakdown it caused (and the resulting lawsuit).

The majority of the people I encountered could be described as inflexible, defensive, jobsworthy, suspicious, parochial, judgemental, dishonest, and often actively destructive.

That was the nice ones

Now - of course there are truly brilliant souls out there working passionately on causes they truly believe in.

But it's not the norm in my experience, and it gets worse the higher you get up the scale both in terms of global relevance and job seniority.

Absolutely unacceptable I don't care how senior the manager is unless, they take their turn in washing up too.
I have been a junior and am now manager (nursing) and have always held this stance

A couple of situations stand out to me, I was a student nurse and my mentor of this particular clinic told me part of their job was to make the Drs their morning coffee 🤣🤣. I politely stated I wouldn't be making the Drs coffee but, I was more than happy to do any other patient focussed care.
Another time, we had an old school anaesthetist come to the ward, sit down and ask for the notes (I was qualified by now) and ask if someone could make him a coffee, our response, you will find the cups and coffee in the kitchen.

I have other stories like this but, I realise I have the confidence to decline doing something someone else thinks is beneath them. As a manager, I am the same and would never expect someone to do something I wouldn't do myself or, only carried out by the lower paid Staff.

It is the individuals to wash up their individual mugs that's not normally the job of the cleaner.
It doesn't take long or detract from their day job anymore than taking time out for lunch or to drunk coffee

Because it takes one minute to wash a cup. If they can't manage that then they're doing something wrong.

This needed a renegotiation of the time that they paid for you to work/the fee you charged, not a redistribution of cleaning duties to the office workers.

GreatNorthBun · Today 14:11

So, this is really interesting to me, because I could be this exec described! (I don't think I am because I hardly ever go into the office, but I COULD be this immoral monster.)
In my work I have some highly specialist technical skills. Nobody else can do these things - they haven't got those skills - and we really really need the work doing. Our beneficiaries really need that work.
Why is it bad if I do that work and someone else washes a cup, when they can't do the work we need that only I can do? We only have so many hours in the day - how do we want to spend them most effectively. I work a 60 hour week and at around 15% of my market rate for this charity, because I think it's worthwhile and important work. But it's immoral for someone without these skills, but with hands and a bit of vim, to bring me coffee? I don't think it is immoral to divide labour according to skills. I will shock you all by saying they also bring me lunch and sometimes pick up equipment and make phone calls, while I work on this stuff.
The thing I need from them is the facilitation of my work - the wifework if we're honest - that makes me able to do my work to the best of my ability. TBH if I've also got to do that, what do I need them for?

No1: ‘wifework’?!?!? Are you actually for real?!

No2: You don’t have time to make your own coffee and wash out a cup and dry it?

No3: Don’t hire staff if you feel you’re the only one capable of doing anything other than washing up.

it paints a vivid picture of what it might be like to spend time with these people 😂

If you hardly ever go into the office, who makes your coffee and washes your cups when you're working from home?

I do t really see the problem, if someone is an assistant then their role is to help etc
If the executive is busy and their time is more valuable (costa the business more money) then doesn't it make sense for the more junior role to assist (just pop it in job description) or add to the cleaners duties.

I just wash my own stuff up as I take it home etc but if the exec is busy and would have to stop their work to tidy and clean doesn't it cost the business more money

Similar to nurses and doctors - if they cleaned the hospital that is not an effective use of their time (hence cleaners)

Am I missing something?

I have told my staff that they shouldn't expect the cleaner to wash up their cups and dishes. It's disrespectful in my view, and people should wash up their own items. The same applies to senior staff.