Leave the NHS for more money but fewer benefits.

[Itsaplanejane]

I'm currently top band 7 so on 50k a year.
I have been offered a job in the charity sector on 70k a year

I have over 10 years service with the NHS so 33 days AL a year plus bank holidays. I don't work unsociable hours. My manager is incredibly supportive and I have a fantastic flexible working set up that means we have been able to reduce our childcare needs considerably as I can still pick up and drop off my little one from school. I do love my job but it does definitely get frustrating at times like any job in the private sector with all the politics and the chronic underfunding of the NHS to contend with.
My manager is lovely and supportive and so are the team I work with for the most part.
I can apply for a band 8a but I'm very reluctant too because the pay difference will be neglige for 5 years with how Agenda for Change works so all that extra responsibility for nothing.
I pay a fortune into my pension each month but the hope of course then that I will have a good pension when the time comes. DH is self employed and has a pension but will be peanuts compared to mine so this is important to me.

I had an interview for an equivalent job in the charity sector. They don't come up often at all and I sent in an application on a bit of a whim. I've been offered the job.
The job is based in London but I'd only need to be in the office 2 days a week, work from home the rest. The commute to the office would be 2 hours so I'd need to arrange getting my kid to and from school through other means. DH might be able to adjust his work so he can do this. They have said they're happy for me to do pick ups and drops off around work the days I work from home.
I would have 27 days annual leave plus bank holiday.
Sick pay is statutory rather than the 6 months full pay, 6 months half I currently have with the NHS.
I'd pay a lot less into my pension so my take home would be even higher but obviously my pension would not be as good so I'd need to ensure I set up a private pension as well.

I've also never not worked in the NHS and that worries me to be honest. The odds of redundancy are extremely slim in my current role but if it did happen I'd have a years salary pay out and could very easily get another job as my background is clinical nursing so getting another job would not be a problem. That is of course true if I took this job, if it doesn't work out I could easily return to the NHS but I'd have lost all the benefits of having over 10 years service and would need to start all over again.

Is it worth it for the extra money? It seems like so much money but once I pay for commuting costs, potentially some wrap around childcare, pension how much realistically will be left over. Plus I really do love my current job.

I'm really not sure. They've given me the weekend to decide. Please help!

You need to allow for the value of your lost holiday.

Currently you work 261 - 33 - 8 = 220 days a year. That is 18.33 days a month. Your lost holiday means that under the new job you will work 18.83 days a month.

Buying the extra holiday (which some firms allow you to do and some don’t but let’s assume that they do) will cost you:-

3800 * 0.5 / 18.83 = 100.90

It will actually be slightly less than that because the cost would reduce your pre tax earnings and so reduce the amount of higher rate tax you pay and so reduce your tax percentage. But £100 a month is a good ball park.

I would also look at the cost of getting an income protection policy to protect you against losing your sick pay. You don’t have to actually get it but if you compare the cost of one that kicks in after 6 months off work and one that kicks in after 4 weeks off work (with about £400 lower benefit to allow for your statutory sick pay) then you can put a monetary value on the loss of the sickness benefits. If you add unemployment as well then that would also give you a value for your redundancy too.

I’m not sure how you get £150 down as the commute cost as a season ticket from where I lived just under 2hours away from London is nearly £450 a month for 2 days a week.

That a lot of information to take in and compare - I would start by putting everything in a spreadsheet so you have it all in one place and can play around with the quantitative part of the comparison.

Definitely compare total renumeration rather than gross pay (I appreciate the pensions part of this is more complex but it is a good starting point) and then take home pay after work expenses/commuting/childcare costs.

If you love your current job I would stay.
But why did you apply for the new job. There must have been something that made you look for, apply for and go to interview for the new job.and how did you feel when you were offered it? What was your gut feeling?;
I would write down pros and cons of each job and try and imagine what life would be if you take the new job. What feels right.?
Practically could you cope with the 2 hour commute, would you end up staying over in the days you are in the office? Financially when you consider childcare, fares new pension etc I doubt there would be much difference.

I'm nowhere near that band and only started working in the NHS in Sept, but looking at it from a Mom's point of view.... I have been able to work from home if my kids have been ill, go to sessions at school and catch up with work later, pick them up early if needed. I know different roles wouldn't be able to do this though.

What would your plans be if one of your kids were ill in the night on a commuting day? Would you/your husband have enough time to sort childcare out before having to leave on an early train, etc...

I think I'd stay put tbh. Good luck with whatever you decide!

It would be a no for me, £250 a month isn’t worth it for the upheaval and faff of sorting childcare, and also I guess there would be some childcare required in the holidays too. A 2 hour commute is so draining. As others have said have a good look at their pension and make sure you know exactly how much the company are contributing. I don’t know about charities but some private companies are only 3%. You would want to contribute via salary sacrifice to save on Tax and NI. But £300 a month is only about £4k a year in, (plus the employee contribution) I would check how much the NHS one is, presumably a lot more than this. I would work out how much you could have over a 10 year period

I wouldn’t.
Go into myESR and look at your pension contributions (it shows how much they top it up for you). That’s where the money is. You put 13. something %, they add another 20.4%. No private company will top your pension to that extent.
Stay put, I would.

You would effectively spend an additional working day (8 hours) commuting. I think you would be nuts to take the job!

Op, not sure what age you are? I wouldn't suggest staying in a job long-term for the pension but given your circumstances it doesn't make sense. If your dh had a great pension and was flexible with working hours this might be a great opportunity for you. However it is risky because you are relying on your pension, flexible working and sick pay.

There maybe private companies that could match your package (except dB pension) but I don't think this charity role is it. I think you need 100k to mitigate risk but then a private company would expect you to work longer than any contracted hours.

Don't underestimate the NHS sick leave. I went to work with a company with the basic SSP and paying anything over is at management discretion. Check the SSP amounts payable. It's extremely low so can cause financial hardship if you are sick.

Must admit to being shocked at holiday allowance in NHS, it's extremely generous and I can't see private companies coming close. Legal minimum is 20 days plus bh.

I work for the nhs and the employer pension contribution is 12.65%. Everyone is on a different arrangement but I’ve looked through your posts and I can’t see where you compare the charity’s contribution (which could be as low as 3%) with your current nhs employer contribution.

i spent 20 years in private practise before moving to nhs (lawyer not medic) and cannot believe the incredible benefits on offer.

All that extra travel time and inconvenience for £62 a week?

You are losing a lot of time, and risking a lot of change, for £250 a month - £12.50 extra a day.

I wouldn't do it if I was in your position.

That sounds awful.

The list recently charity I worked for was run by a genuinely charitable CEO and the exec team were also genuine caring people. I took a pay cut to work there but they restored my faith. However I think that was a rare good one.

The National charity I worked for was absolutely awful. Including the Freedom to Speak up guardian they were forced to appoint, who collided with one of the directors, did nothing to address bullying and abuse and then left to start a consultancy!
I had sirens sounded at me in a meeting when I raised an issue, work I did was attributed male colleagues, one who was promoted. I could go on.

I have friends with similarly awful experiences in charities so I would be very very careful in future.

Rough rule of thumb is public sector pensions are worth about 20/25% on top of salary. I think these jobs are probably roughly equal financially but the NHS job has more benefits.

Think you’d be mad to give up your current role for an extra £250 a month. You’re being seduced by the big £70k number not the reality.

£250 a month is not life changing money but the pension, flexibility and decent manager/team in your current role are actually life changing.

NHS pay structures suck once you are the top of your band but pick up 2 shifts a month as bank and you’d make some extra cash without all the upheaval.

“Plus I really do love my current job.”

This jumps out for me. Not many people can say that. It would be a different decision if you were unhappy.

I’ve just moved in the other direction (Civil Service not NHS) after a decade in the charity sector. OP I wouldn’t move if I were you for these reasons which others have said:

• increase in salary will be wiped out by additional commuting and pension costs
• loss of flexibility
• poor sick pay - I wouldn’t work anywhere that only has SSP, it’s a pittance
• charities tend to be underresourced with overstretched, stressed staff
• charity pay is still very low compared to private sector, with out the benefit of unions to drive pay rises
• in my experience charities are constantly restructuring so jobs are often put at risk, again without the benefit of unionisation

Oh and if you don’t want politics and chronic underfunding then you’d be going out of the frying pan and into the fire 😆

This site here reckons that the employer contribution for an NHS pension is 14%, and the central top-up 6%, so that’s 20% employer contribution. So that’s not far off £10k out of the £20k payrise to cover that as I expect the charity contributes the bare minimum of 3%

https://www.nhsemployers.org/articles/nhs-pension-scheme-employer-contributions

So factor in that, fewer holidays and a longer commute and it’s not an opportunity I’d be jumping at.

It does underline how people under estimate / misunderstand how good the total package can be in many NHS / state employer roles by just focussing on the salary. And is why it’s often difficult for the unions (NHS, teachers, civil service) to gain much sympathy from much of the general public when it comes to pay.

It’s cheaper if you pre-book for specific trains. But then you can only get those trains.

OP I used to work in the charity sector. I think you should stay put.

So even with all that I'm still £250 a month up which is so much money!

I wouldn't leave a good manager for £250 a month extra, let alone all the other benefits. There's some research that your manager and work environment has more impact on your mental health than a therapist.

I guarantee £300 per month extra in a pension will be no where near enough to match an NHS pension. Even with the changes, nothing is comparable in the private sector/you can get yourself.

some of the aspects of your current role are priceless -
job flexibility
child and family friendly
good line manager

not even factoring in the pension / employer contributions and excellent annual leave scheme there is no way I would kiss those top three things goodbye for approximately £250 per month. Especially with four hours minimum commute time two days a week. Via the trains. In THIS country!

I went from NHS to charity and have just changed industry again (non-clinical).

It was the money that attracted me to the charity but the benefits were woeful and the ways of working unbelievable. I did have flexibility but covered the whole of England so there was lots of travel.

My 40% is in London and I live 200 miles away. I thought it would be easy being away 2-3 nights a week but the travel
always takes longer than it should and last week I got abandoned part way by the train company (along with 300 other travellers) late at night and it was absolute chaos. I spend 8 hours commuting a week, on average and it is unbelievably tiring. Luckily I am enjoying the job and the people and the perks are unbelievable.

It might be a good side step to then go back into the NHS at 8b but tread carefully, OP.

I moved from the NHS to a private company, but this involved losing a commute, not gaining a new significant one. I don't think I'd take the role you've been offered as it is, but you could always try to negotiate additional annual leave, and one less day per week in the office.