Massive gap in employment - how to work around this?

[Toastandmarmite999]

Hi,

this is following on from a post I wrote previously about finding it hard to get an interview at 53 (thanks for all your support and suggestions!)

My question is this - how on earth do I get back on track?
Let me elaborate:

I became a lone parent when my DD was 13 months old.
Once she started primary, I set myself up as a freelance PA but found it difficult to get clients, so when we moved to a new town (she was now 5) I decided to look for work in admin (before she was born I'd been an Office Manager in London).
However, I found it impossible to find anything (maybe because of a lack of recent experience in an office?) so with the Job Centre breathing very heavily down my neck, I was offered a job in garden maintenance and grabbed it - It paid well and I could fit it perfectly around school hours - I actually really enjoyed this.

But 3 years later, I began to suffer with backpain (gardening's quite physical) and decided to retrain in an industry which I was told was undersubscribed.
It is, and I found a job straight away, but it soon became clear that it wasn't the right choice for me, and having just been made 'redundant' before Christmas I'm now looking at 4 wasted years pursuing a wrong path with a now even wider gulf in my relevant employment history with regards to admin/secretarial work - Stay at home mum(3 years); Freelance PA (2 years); Gardener Maintenance (3 years); The other job that simply wasn't suitable (4 years).

I'm aware that it's not advisable to include Employment History that goes back years, so in my case what do I do? 2010 was the last time I was in an office.

I'm also aware that now having a Masters, I'm overqualified for most of the jobs I'm applying for - do I not mention this? I've deleted my Linkedin account which mentions this, but it's still online.

It's all such a mess.

I could lie, but I'm an honest person and this really doesn't sit well with me.

I could temp, but I've been told that there's no guarantee of regular work and as a lone parent with a mortgage - this is a worry.

There are so many jobs I see advertised that I could do standing on my head, but I can see why my CV doesn't portray me as someone who's followed a steady career and as well as my age, isn't getting that foot in the door.

I'd be really interested in hearing your thoughts.

Thanks.

I would be stunned if your secret unsuitable job did not have elements of admin in it you could accentuate. What is it? As PP has said, you could get much better advice and, unless it was Home Secretary it is unlikely to be identifying!

either way - the employer is unwilling to provide a reference or the OP isn’t confident it will be a positive one!

As a recruiter, let me "reinterpret" the CV how many recruiters will read it....

20XX to 2010 - Office manager (no valid reference, no confirmation of fact, could have got just any old person to write the reference, way too long ago... useless to me)
2010 to 2013 - Possibly in prison or doing something else that I really do not want to know about and don't want on my team
2013 to 2015 - Oh the infamous I was working for myself, which translates as unverifiable; and possibly in prison or doing something else that I really do not want to know about and don't want on my team
2015 to 2018 - Probably unverifiable, wouldn't trust the reference; B&E??? Scouting??? At best utterly irrelevant to me.
2018 - 2021 - Secret unsuitable job; at best sacked for something, no reference so my assumption is definitely sacked; or possibly in prison....
2021 - Masters degree - I know several people who did their Masters degree in prison. It's amazing what you can qualify for now with a long enough sentence...

And, er, it's 2024... what happened to 2022 and 2023?

There is NOTHING in that CV which would make me even slightly willing to even interview. If I were being charitable I would assume this is another of those "I don't really want a job but the jobcentre make me apply for 12 a week" things. But that is at best, and honestly I would be raising red flags around the room at this description.

And to be clear, I do consider and have employed more than one person with a dodgy background or even prison time. I have absolutely no problem with that. But they approach with full and frank disclosure, still come with the relevant skills and experience, and can show me why I should employ them. Right now we have an anonymous OP, on an anonymous website, looking for a bog standard admin job and they can't even manage full and frank disclosure here. So I think I have something of an inkling about why their applications don't make the sift...

Exactly.
@Turkeyhen it's up to you to prove how your, erm, 'diverse' experiences suit the role. Many SAHM for example have spent so much time on PTA/committees/volunteer work, that require the same skills as lots of paid work.

Admin roles these days aren't really entry level as a PP said so many mundane, routine tasks have been automated. There's nothing wrong in taking a less competitive role, maybe working in a local shop. Around here many are desperate for staff. And you get do a lot more than just serving food. Stock control, dealing with suppliers, planning, reporting to ensure compliance with guidelines , budgeting etc you can demonstrate your transferable skills pretty quickly!

When I graduated having worked as casual event staff but also summer FT stints at event venues I'd done all of the above and then some. More importantly, I knew how to handle and diffuse difficult situations involving many stakeholders with conflicting agendas, which employers really valued. Just 'planning' for your own household really isn't the same.

If you can demonstrate the relevant skills you'll be fine. Not OP. Who cannot even be honest in an anonymous online forum. Not sure what her previous 'unsuitable' job was, professional assassin?

@Neriah Thank you for taking the time to clarify your previous post, and for the useful additional information.

@Neriah you do realise my post was supporting your view don’t you?

I do a lot of recruitment in my role as an in-house HR generalist.

I work for quite a small business that is ambitious but not necessarily attractive for many recruits in the sense that it's not a 'blue-chip'.

That said, the pay is ok, the culture is good, the expectations are clear and the management is decent.

We REALLY struggle to find/interview good people.

Some of those reasons are:

• Generic CVs: am I sick of generic CVs! If you're serious about a job, take a hour to tweak your CV, research a bit about the company and write a decent three-paragraph covering letter about why you're a good fit for the role and the company.

• long CVs: find a way too keep it to 2 pages in 12pt font. Don't ramble.

• CVs that just regurgitate bits of former job descriptions - I want to know how you added value in your previous role, not just what your daily tasks were. Tell me about the quality and quantity of your work.

• CVs that are full of jargon. Don't tell me that you're 'highly motivated and able to work well on both a team and individual basis' in line 1 of your CV. Literally 95% of CVs start like that. Use words like 'spearheaded' and 'stakeholders' accurately and very sparingly. Find simple alternatives in plain English that are easy to read.

• read the job description and person specification and make sure you show the employer how you can already meet most of this, or have the potential to within a very short period of time

Look... most employers just want someone who can hit the ground running with about 75% of the job from day 1, and who can get to grips with 100% of the role by the end of the probationary period.

They want steady people who get along with others and buy into whatever their organisation does.

They also get overwhelmed with rubbish information at the recruitment stage.

So think carefully about what it is that you want for a role, and what you can give to an employer from day 1 (clue... they'll be reluctant to 'give you a chance', they just want someone who can do the job).

Also... when career changing you inevitably have to take a step back in salary. The trick is to accept this, plan for it, and leverage every opportunity to accelerate your development and progression in your new field, and make the pain of this as short-term as possible.

If it was easy (it's not) then everyone would do it.

Yes. I wasn't disagreeing with you. What you wrote would be somethinmg along the lines of the feedback, if we gave any. What I wrote was what we were actually thinking!

Keep freelance PA on there from start date to current and do a couple of freelance jobs (potentially FOC) to get some up to date references and testimonials? Especially if you can get them shared on your LinkedIn.

so an outright lie

oh and the only two references from the PA role… from a decade ago

No not a lie, a lie would be if she didn't get updated testimonials through doing work.

@withthischoice how is doing more freelance work a lie?

Keep freelance PA on there from start date to current

The OP hasn’t been a freelance PA since 2015

you are advising she manipulates the figure so that it’s still ongoing!

OP, in your shoes I’d just be fully up front with everything, including your secret unsuitable job (at this point I’m thinking you’re a fluffer in the porn industry). Look at the job description and person spec and look where you can match your skills and experience. E.g. the gardening job - budgeting, project management, client liaison, self motivation - you don’t have to mention begonias at all. When you went freelance mention your clients -were they SMEs, charities, corporates? Even if it is just a few it gives the employer a hook to hang onto. For example, Freelance PA - clients included a range of SME’s in York and Durham - then you can talk about client management, project based work, using spreadsheets, etc. Think about the relevant transferable skills in your unsuitable job - stamina, open minded, see the job through to the end - you can draw out the relevant attributes- but no, I wouldn’t hide or obscure anything. If anything it’s a chance to demonstrate what you’ve learned from each one. Also, a public sector job might be hard to come by now but may not be in a year or two, so apply to small businesses, to charities, to any orgs you can think of that may be looking for admin suppprt. The more relevant experience you can get under your belt the better.

You are missing out the half of my post which said to DO SOME FREELANCE WORK which would MAKE it ongoing!

@Toastandmarmite999 Please ignore all the fishing for details by all the PPs going on about your "secret" "mysterious" unsuitable job. I can think of several reasons why you might not want to be specific about it on a very public open forum used by thousands of people and searchable on Google.

I wouldn't advise leaving out jobs from your CV or lying in any way. At some point you'll be asked exactly what you were doing during that time. Some employers do security checks which means they verify all your previous employment. Much better to state accurate facts about the job and glean some positives from it. I do quite a bit of interviewing and it's fine when you ask people why they left and they say "I wasn't enjoying it because xyz and decided to return to the type of work I know best".

I've hired people who are older with career gaps recently; in each case it was for interim jobs. You could try applying to more of those - they tend to get fewer young high flyers applying.

but still would be a lie to put from 2013 to current day. would have to be 2013-2015

and then 2024 - present day

Please ignore all the fishing for details by all the PPs going on about your "secret" "mysterious" unsuitable job.

precisely what a potential employer would do . plus require a reference from most recent employment

The point people are driving at is that the advice is different if someone was sacked for gross misconduct with no reference, or if they resigned on good terms having decided it wasn't for them.

Similarly, knowing the industry is also pretty critical to working out how to present it on a CV and what search strategy to use. Context is relevant if you're going to give good advice.

I don't care about the details, but giving a high level "I quit my job as an investment banker because the culture wasn't for me" or "I failed out of my training contract as a solicitor" would enable people to give meaningful advice without being identifying.

At the moment people are trying to advise about getting admin jobs without even knowing if the most recent job was in an office or on an oil rig.

it certainly discounts the public sector immediately as they will ask for that reference and without contact details for the last employer - they won’t progress with the op.

A local authority hired me after a career gap of 8 years without asking my old employer for a reference. They did however know who my previous employers were, they just wanted a more current reference (I used voluntary work).

I'm assuming that the masters is linked to the job, so something like social work. If it is as simple as being made redundant and not wanting to carry on in that field, I wouldn't miss it off an application because hiding it raises more questions. I'm absolutely overqualified for what I currently do, it wasn't a negative at all.

finding some of these replies really negative and unhelpful to the OP

I would structure CV with a career summary/ profile para at the top which highlights your skills and admin/ office experience, clarifies you are looking not to return to an admin/ office environment role and add a very brief sentence which summarises the bit that's not admin related and link to being carer - eg whilst caring for my children between 200x and 200x i undertook various roles and also completed my masters degree in x

the list the whole history but keep the jon relevant roles to no more than a sentence - make the admin and self employed PA roles bigger by adding more detail about your role and skill set

if you could get some voluntary admin it would help because in the career summary you can say - in order to support a return to X and I am doing Y on a voluntary basis

You may have to look at entry level roles to get back in - have a look at charities, housing associations, social care providers as they all have admin roles and are abit more open than other types of employer

Good luck OP

Agreed. It's incredibly vague.

Most if not all employers will know that freelance PS work really is very rarely anything of note sadly and often a filler for periods of unemployment.

Hi I was just on the thread looking for some advice my daughter is in a similar position . She got made redundant from her office job during Covid 19 and has been out of work since due to personal/ health reasons & a few years caring for her grandmother .So about 5 years now . During that time she was not claiming benefits as she had savings ( over the threashold for making a claim ) and was also living with me & my husband & we supported her financially .So now she has been out of work and not on benefits for this whole time . So no references basically for the last 5 years .Recently, she’s started looking for entry level admin jobs but is really struggling to find anything due to the gap in her employment history. If any one has any advice please let me know .