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Original poster

Can I excuse myself from team building event?

78 replies

InAPickle12345 · 09/12/2023 11:57

Hi, looking for advice, legal or practical, on whether I can ask to be excused from a team building event?

Long story short, I work in a team of 8, there were incidents this year and 2 of the team, who work on the same area of the business together, really showed their true colours. They've shown themselves to be conniving, self serving, pushy, defensive when confronted, rude and to top it off they're both really shit at their jobs, not performing and damaging the brand reputation. These incidents have caused a split down the team, we've never received an apology for their behaviour and we avoid working with them on anything where possible. I also took the brunt of this behaviour numerous times.

The CEO is organising a team building event for early next year. A full day of emotional intelligence bullshit and learning how to 'speak each others language'. I really don't want to do this. It will make me incredibly uncomfortable and anxious and I just want to come in and do my job.

Can I ask to be excused from this? I will very likely be the only one.

OP posts:
Original poster
InAPickle12345 · 09/12/2023 13:03

Jellycatspyjamas · 09/12/2023 12:55

What difficulties does your “collaborate when necessary and avoid” cause. It’s not just about your working environment, it’s theirs too and if 6 people in the team get on like a house on fire, the other two could be left feeling very excluded, which isn’t ok. Your boss clearly sees an impact and is trying to resolve the issue, while you might not agree with his approach I don’t think an entrenched position is productive in such a small team.

People screw up at work, they make mistakes and get things wrong. How would you propose to address the rift in the team given you don’t feel comfortable with the boss’ approach.

But they've isolated themselves with this behaviour, which has continued with no remorse or apology? This is not an issue of my making and I don't think I should be going out of my way or comfort zone to fix it.

I would suggest we all just move on and get our work done, accept that we don't get on and make allowances for that.

OP posts:
Original poster
InAPickle12345 · 09/12/2023 13:07

NoTouch · 09/12/2023 12:57

Honestly, these people look down on me so much they will never see it from my perspective, and I'm not interested in explaining it anymore. I did explain my perspective when these incidents happened and it wasn't respected.

A team day is a perfect opportunity for a neutral party to listen to you and other team members. But you will need to listen too and be ready to accept your own faults, as none of us are perfect, if you are going to get any benefit from it.

I know you're right on paper, I really do. But it actually boils my piss that I need to spend a day being uncomfortable, to fix a problem that is not of my making. But I do know that if I don't, then I get dragged in as a problem maker, when I really don't think that's fair or true.

I guess I came here wondering was there a magic way of getting out of this, without being seen as part of the problem. And maybe there's not, maybe I just need to be made uncomfortable, YET AGAIN, to fix a problem these two are causing.

OP posts:
SheilaFentiman · 09/12/2023 13:08

If there are only 8 of you and it’s an on-site, there’s a chance it will get rescheduled if any of you call in sick last
minute

NChance · 09/12/2023 13:13

Neriah · 09/12/2023 12:51

I just don't see why can't just recognise we don't like working together and just move on and do our jobs.

Or if you despise your colleagues that much you could either make a formal complaint about their alleged actions, or literally "move on" and find another job. What you can't do is simply refuse to take part in workplace activities because you don't like some of the people. It's a workplace and not a school playground. You are complaining about members of the team not pulling their weight, not being good members of the team, and not being able to work together with others, then objecting to an activity designed to build the team. You must see how perverse that is?

Don't get me wrong - I bloody hate team building activities myself. Although not because I have problems with members of my team. I just don't enjoy them or find them useful. But realistically, you either need to be seen to participate in team activities, or you need to be upfront about the problems and complain. If you don't do anything to fix the situation, you are as much a part of the problem as you say they are.

See I get it

I work with people that honestly take the piss and there have been SO many complaints
It means the rest of us end up clearing up their crap and doing more work
If my manager suggested a team building day I would be very vocal about what was actually needed and it's not team building
Our team is split because 2 people don't do their job, the rest of us have complained constantly and nothing changes
The team worked perfectly before

Original poster
InAPickle12345 · 09/12/2023 13:16

@NChance THANK YOU! This is exactly it! These 2 employees are permanent members of staff ( what a fucking mistake that was) so its probably 'easier' on the business to try get us all playing happy teammates than it would be to address the fact that they are not performing, causing issues in the team and need to go.

OP posts:
NChance · 09/12/2023 13:20

When I say issues have been complained about I mean
Taking the piss with breaks and lunches
Speaking to colleagues and others like crap
Not working as in faking "IT issues"
Being told to work from the office so management can watch them and then not turning up
Making constant errors which other staff then have to sort

We have a full paid for Christmas do, meal and unlimited drinks which we usually all love and none of us are going as we are all so frustrated and fed up

Original poster
InAPickle12345 · 09/12/2023 13:25

NChance · 09/12/2023 13:20

When I say issues have been complained about I mean
Taking the piss with breaks and lunches
Speaking to colleagues and others like crap
Not working as in faking "IT issues"
Being told to work from the office so management can watch them and then not turning up
Making constant errors which other staff then have to sort

We have a full paid for Christmas do, meal and unlimited drinks which we usually all love and none of us are going as we are all so frustrated and fed up

We had ours last night, I went for the meal because I would look bad otherwise, I left before dessert citing childcare. I've stopped going to any of the social events I know they'll be at. Bit sad for me but I don't mind in the grand scheme of things. We have another end of year party with our customers next week and I'm not going, and I'd normally love to be at this. (Note this 2nd event is organised outside of work so I don't feel bad about not going. Due to our business we get very close to customers and know them on a personal level)

OP posts:
user628468523532453 · 09/12/2023 13:32

Working professionally as a team doesn't mean being friends. It's odd that you are equating the two.

Your boss is trying to get you all to engage as professionals. Obstructing that or playing on a health condition will reflect badly on you.

You should perhaps consider whether your behaviour to freeze them out would be considered bullying.

Original poster
InAPickle12345 · 09/12/2023 13:38

user628468523532453 · 09/12/2023 13:32

Working professionally as a team doesn't mean being friends. It's odd that you are equating the two.

Your boss is trying to get you all to engage as professionals. Obstructing that or playing on a health condition will reflect badly on you.

You should perhaps consider whether your behaviour to freeze them out would be considered bullying.

Im not trying to freeze them out, they've isolated themselves with their behaviour. An apology or even an acknowledgment at the time would have gone a long way towards resolving this but it wasn't forthcoming.

Well he must want to see us be closer on more of a friendly level because we are working perfectly well just avoiding each other where possible. Don't get me wrong, I say good morning, good bye etc every day. I do now avoid any chit chat with them because I'm just not interested but I have no problem speaking with them and collaborating when the job requires it. There is absolutely no bullying whatsoever.

OP posts:
Original poster
InAPickle12345 · 09/12/2023 13:54

Coming to the conclusion that if I want to continue here for another 12 months as I promised, I'll just have to suck this up, as angry, anxious and upset as it makes me. I won't make any comment to anyone about my feelings around the event and just go and give as little as I possibly can on the day.

Thanks for talking it out everyone

OP posts:
ANightingale · 09/12/2023 14:00

InAPickle12345 · 09/12/2023 13:54

Coming to the conclusion that if I want to continue here for another 12 months as I promised, I'll just have to suck this up, as angry, anxious and upset as it makes me. I won't make any comment to anyone about my feelings around the event and just go and give as little as I possibly can on the day.

Thanks for talking it out everyone

Sounds like a sensible plan. Good luck!

burnoutbabe · 09/12/2023 14:01

You mentioned them saying sorry to you?

Does the situation warrant sn apology? That's unusual in a business context unless they say insulted other staff. But I have not seen anyone say sorry for being shit at their job to a colleague.

Is there only your team of 8 and top boss? Has it been acknowledged they have been disciplined and ill not do x again (it seems this had happened)

Original poster
InAPickle12345 · 09/12/2023 14:06

burnoutbabe · 09/12/2023 14:01

You mentioned them saying sorry to you?

Does the situation warrant sn apology? That's unusual in a business context unless they say insulted other staff. But I have not seen anyone say sorry for being shit at their job to a colleague.

Is there only your team of 8 and top boss? Has it been acknowledged they have been disciplined and ill not do x again (it seems this had happened)

Yes, rude and demeaning behaviour towards me is some of my issue, in front of other colleagues and customers. It warrants an apology.

We expressed our grievances to the CEO, he told us he heard us and saw the issues himself. He has spoken to them but I don't believe there has been any disciplinary action.

OP posts:
SheilaFentiman · 09/12/2023 14:10

Speaking to them may be disclipinary action if it is on their record.

if the behaviour has continued since, is your boss aware of that?

Original poster
InAPickle12345 · 09/12/2023 14:12

SheilaFentiman · 09/12/2023 14:10

Speaking to them may be disclipinary action if it is on their record.

if the behaviour has continued since, is your boss aware of that?

Yes, I have weekly meetings with him where I express my dissatisfaction with how they provide me information or work with me on various projects. He is aware, which is why he has made changes to the workings of the business so I don't need to work with them as closely anymore.

OP posts:
Original poster
InAPickle12345 · 09/12/2023 14:13

Thanks @ANightingale, appreciate the advice

OP posts:
SeaToSki · 09/12/2023 14:27

If you are going to go, one way to make it more managable might be to play bingo in your head. Think of a variety of statements, tuts, eye rolls, strops and obstructive comments that they might make on the training day. Then every time they say one, you get a bingo. At the end of the day (or 2 hrs if its warranted) give yourself a treat based on how many bingos you got. I highly recommend nice chocs as the treat. It just takes the seriousness out of the situation and equates it to a game (in your mind) which can make it less personal and more bearable. Then if you do survive without reacting to them, you have won.

Original poster
InAPickle12345 · 09/12/2023 14:31

SeaToSki · 09/12/2023 14:27

If you are going to go, one way to make it more managable might be to play bingo in your head. Think of a variety of statements, tuts, eye rolls, strops and obstructive comments that they might make on the training day. Then every time they say one, you get a bingo. At the end of the day (or 2 hrs if its warranted) give yourself a treat based on how many bingos you got. I highly recommend nice chocs as the treat. It just takes the seriousness out of the situation and equates it to a game (in your mind) which can make it less personal and more bearable. Then if you do survive without reacting to them, you have won.

This is stellar advice, thank you so much for this, I can actually see this being so helpful. I'm gonna call it Bullshit Bingo. These two are so full of shit it stinks so I'll note some of their usual bullshit statements and views and use these on the day! THANK YOU! 😊

OP posts:
NoTouch · 09/12/2023 15:00

Yes, I have weekly meetings with him where I express my dissatisfaction with how they provide me information or work with me on various projects.......

......I won't make any comment to anyone about my feelings around the event and just go and give as little as I possibly can on the day.

You are expressing your issues to your manager on a regular basis, he tries to do something about it, create an opportunity to improve the situation or at least get it out in the open, and you refuse to go with an open mind and engage. Doesn't that feel like you are shooting yourself in the foot?

Shannith · 09/12/2023 15:10

Just maybe the team building exercise is an attempt to get the 6 perfect people to recognise that like it or not they are part of a...team?

And maybe it's to also get the 2 problem children to speak the language of the 6 good ones.

Maybe it's a bit of both. What with it being a team and all.

Original poster
InAPickle12345 · 09/12/2023 15:11

NoTouch · 09/12/2023 15:00

Yes, I have weekly meetings with him where I express my dissatisfaction with how they provide me information or work with me on various projects.......

......I won't make any comment to anyone about my feelings around the event and just go and give as little as I possibly can on the day.

You are expressing your issues to your manager on a regular basis, he tries to do something about it, create an opportunity to improve the situation or at least get it out in the open, and you refuse to go with an open mind and engage. Doesn't that feel like you are shooting yourself in the foot?

Some people just don't get on, that's just a fact of life. And I'm not the type of person get on with someone or forget someone speaking down to me or dictating my role when it's not their place, particularly when there has been no apology.

I would have had an open mind 5 months ago when this happened, I would have happily sat down and discussed it. But this is forced and disingenuous, and I don't know why I should be expected to be open about my vulnerabilities and feelings in front of people who don't respect me, to solve an issue that I didn't cause.

What needs to happen is a serious change to that business unit, not making me, and very likely some of the others, uncomfortable in the hope we sweep their treatment of us under the rug and we all move on.

These people are not young, if they don't know how to do their job, or engage with other team members respectfully then why should we be the ones to have to deal with them being taught this?

OP posts:
Original poster
InAPickle12345 · 09/12/2023 15:15

Shannith · 09/12/2023 15:10

Just maybe the team building exercise is an attempt to get the 6 perfect people to recognise that like it or not they are part of a...team?

And maybe it's to also get the 2 problem children to speak the language of the 6 good ones.

Maybe it's a bit of both. What with it being a team and all.

I have never said that the other 6 are perfect. But we deal with each other in a really honest and respectful manner and work really well as a team.

Honestly, I would love to see two teams form and allow the other 2 to stand on their own. The bandwidth is there within their team to do this and it would make them more accountable for their performance and everyone much happier. But our workplace is obsessed with this concept of one team so that would never be entertained fully.

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MissBuffyAnneSummers · 09/12/2023 15:15

Team building, team meetings, training etc all reasonable requests.

Employer taking steps to address team conflict reasonable.

You don't have grounds to refuse to participate.

If you really can't then you need to phone in sick.

But you should also think about whether it's time for you to look for a new job.

Shannith · 09/12/2023 15:18

The more you wore the more I wonder if your boss may like it or not see you as part of the problem.

I've worked with people I didn't like or rate. I judged their behaviour as not good enough and decided my word was law because I was better.

I was old enough to know better but not perhaps mature enough to see my part in it. And that's not saying I was to blame but that my reactions made the situation worse not better. The I didn't cause the problem, why should I fix it approach you've described yourself as having.

I've been the boss in the scenario many times as well. Perhaps your boss sees as I often do that it's not as black and white as either entrenched side of the schism believes.

It's one day. You don't have to lay yourself bare. If it gets you through it be surface willing but distant and don't give of yourself emotionally any more than you want to.

You might even learn something

Original poster
InAPickle12345 · 09/12/2023 15:25

@Shannith I don't think he sees me as part of the problem yet, but would do if I don't go to this thing and try to feign engagement.

I don't have a choice here really I think. He's made changes based on me staying in my role for another 12mos so I need to go and just have some coping strategies in place for the day.

In terms of learning something, I've spent years and £££ on personal development, I'm comfortable in my levels of emotional intelligence and I'm a good team member. I don't need to spend a day trying to learn why these people are stuck up arseholes.

OP posts: