HR confidential conversation :is it truly confidential

[Howdoesitwork1]

I've never done this before and dint realise there is a work topic.
I want to log something unacceptable that happened to me with hr but don't want any action taken at the moment. If I ask for it to be confidential will it be?

Whistleblowing hotlines/services aren't for HR matters. I would expect the appointed person to direct OP to HR. Even when a whistleblowing hotline is operated by an external provider, details of the calls are passed on. They don't necessarily identify the caller, but the vast majority of calls to these services are matters which should be reported to HR for investigation. The operators try to get the whistleblower to speak to HR instead.

Never, ever trust HR. They are not on your side., ever, and they will lie to your face. Their job is to protect the interests of the organisation that pays their salaries, not to protect your interests as an employee.

It's not evidence though it's just what you say and if you won't let anyone investigate or do anything until some unknown date in the future it's even more suspect. I tell people in this situation I'm not filing anything, they either have a complaint they want on record and for the company to take appropriate action or they don't.

Maybe read the OP before you get snarky. She says right there in her first post that she didn’t realise there was a Work topic when she started the first thread.

I agree with this. HR and Occupational Health are not your friends. Nothing you say or write is confidential. IME, assume everything you say and do will be held against you.

Ditto. Totally agree with this. HR = Not to be trusted!

In my experience as HR and a line manager you should start with your line manager. If they are not able to resolve the issue then of course they should refer it higher. HR tend to be involved once this channels are exhausted and it s
Likely to become a grievance or disciplinary matter. My advice would be to join a union, now before there is a problem and in 90 days they will be there to support you should it become necessary.

Even then, there's generally a limit to how confidential as a number of different people are likely to get involved in the investigation. But yes, whether it's HR or a whistleblow you would like to think people will only be involved on a "need to know" basis

I would keep your own personal confidential log of facts events timelines and who was involved, and not involved but present.

keep your log off any computer system in a notebook at home.

there is no value at all in giving HR any information in what is effectively a drip feed, if you don't want them to take any action. You are giving them information that they can't do anything with.

the time to get HR involved is when the situation you're in escalates to a critical point where you believe you have a fact-based case against your employer, that would firstly require an informal grievance, for the situation to be dealt with, or if no action is taken, then a formal grievance if action needs to taken against an employee you're working with that might lead to an ET submission . In any case, you would escalate your situation in the first instance with your Line Manager, with HR as an fyi, or if your line manager is at the centre of the issue, then to HR directly.

between now and then, keep your powder dry and give them the complete documented information at the same time.

@daisychain01 yes that sounds reasonable

An an HR professional this attitude saddens me and is frankly insulting.

I investigate employee concerns in my role and regularly have to discipline and dismiss the accused as they violated policy and company values. Please do not paint an entire profession in a bad light. You do realise that we are qualified by an external professional body and so it's not as simple as "the company pays them so they take the company side". Do you think internal audit don't call out wrongdoing or breaches because the Company pays them?

If I was hauled in front of a Tribunal and had to justify a bad decision the that's on me and my professional reputation
We are not all 'puppets' for the leadership and many of us have professional integrity.

That said, there is no such concept of 'logging and issue with HR". You have to decide to go formal so that a proper investigation can be run. Do you know how many times I have seen employees turn on HR to say 'I raised it with them months ago and they did nothing'.. a tribunal would expect us to have taken action regardless so please don't put your HR team in that compromising position.

I did say that “in my experience”. I am not painting an entire profession in a bad light - I am sure there are wonderful HR persons out there. I just haven’t met one.

No, HR are there to essentially protect the company, not the employees.

@404usernotfound no, the OP doesn't say that. You've made some assumptions. The OP said that shes never done this before and didn't realise there's a work topic. I assumed that the "I've never done this before" refers to logging something with HR i.e. the subject matter of her thread. You've assumed it refers to starting two topics about the same thread. Frankly, it's ambiguous and could be understood more than one way, but not everyone will have noticed that she's started two threads on the same topic.

If the OP started a thread in the wrong topic, she should've asked Mumsnet how to move it to the correct topic, not start a duplicate thread. It makes it difficult for people to contribute and follow if there is more than one conversation on the same subject.

No, HR are there to essentially protect the company, not the employees.

That’s often the same thing, by protecting the employees you’re protecting the company from tribunal costs, settlement agreements, etc.

If something has happened you want dealt with confidentially and you don't feel you can speak to someone, you should have a whisteblowing line in place you can reach out to. You can remain totally confidential and all incidents have to be investigated - this might be a better route for you.

@ANiceBigCupOfTea

One would think in my line of work there should be one, yes.

I don't know if it exists or where I could go that's confidential.

@thinkfast are you usually nitpicking on everything like this?

What about you give some info to the OP instead?

Have you got a HR intranet site or similar? Contact details might be on there.

OP whistleblowing only applies for something where there is a public interest in the disclosure. Is that the case here?

Because the OP hasn't given enough info on here for anyone on Mumsnet to give her much advice, except to say that none of us can assure the OP that her organisation's HR team would keep something 100% confidential, as we don't know where she works or how her organisation operates. OP, if it's vital to you that something is kept confidential, don't tell HR.

I don't think it's nitpicking to point out that on Mumsnet starting an duplicate thread is considered bad manners.

@thinkfast

Are you employed by mn.
I can't believe how much you are pushing me that I started two threads.

I think it's bad manners to elevate a small amin error to such a huge issue.
I didn't know there was a working topic or that I would get such rounded snd good advice because many side topics on mn are dead quiet.

However I'm very anxious and distressed about something at work so to keep pushing the two threads error I think is a show of lack of empathy compassion ,and a show of appalling manners from you.

Hi OP

I'm sorry you're having such a difficult time at work. I can assure you that I empathise with how tough that can be.

I would've only mentioned the two threads thing once, but I was replying to other posters who responded to me.

In terms of the subject matter of your threads, based on the information you've provided, I can't add anything further, other than to say please don't assume HR is confidential, I've encountered many organisations where that's not the case. You need to decide which is more important to you, confidentiality, or creating a record of the matter in question. Best of luck either way!

@Howdoesitwork1 based on the limited info from both threads @daisychain01 has given good advice about keeping a log. If this is the first time it has occurred. @titchy has in one post advised you to ask about policies, I would suggest you shouldn’t need to ask HR as these should be available (usually on line) for you to read.

A pp is correct a personal issue is not covered by whistleblowing unless it is a wider issue. For example if you had raised a safeguarding issue to someone senior and they dismissed it rather than following the procedure.

I would also suggest you join a TU now before any reporting is done. This way they can help you should a second incident occur.

Thank you.

I've been steadied.
I'll write it down but I not going to HR at the moment and I am already part of a union.

I really appreciate all the advice on this thread.