Redundancy

[princesssparklepants]

Not sure if anyone will know the answer to this....

If someone works in a team of 6 people, all on same level, same job role etc and the company decides they need to make 2 of the 6 roles redundant.... they decide who those 2 people are and put them under notice.
Do they have any obligation to tell those 2 people why they were chosen?

Hmmm I'm no expert on this but when I've been in a similar position in the past (team of 5) we all had to re-interview for our roles.

They can either make you all interview or benchmark you against a set of skills/job profile criteria.

No interviews... Just as of today you are under consultation with a view to be made redundant.
I asked the question of how it was decided.... I said was it based on last in, first out but was told no and it was just repeated something along the lines of we'd all been reviewed... and I had been picked.

So guess it must be they have bench marked me and I've been found lacking.... not sure how though as I have 18 years of company specific knowledge...

I thought all 6 had to be put into the consultation, then you rank them against some agreed criteria (skills, number of sick days, performance ratings maybe) and then the bottom 2 go.

You should have the opportunity to see the scoring because they might have made an error and not given you credit for a specific skill or something?

As above OP has said there should be scoring, it should be very transparent and you should be able to see the criteria.

This website has some info which might be helpful-

https://www.davidsonmorris.com/redundancy-selection-criteria/

They will have done a benchmarking review. It's usually done by the line manager for the team and will grade you and all the other team members on the same criteria and those with the lowest scores will be the people who are put at risk.

You have the right to review and discuss the scores, but in my experience it's very hard to get the outcome changed. Also as part of the at risk process you have the right to apply for any open roles in the wider organisation.

Ok thanks I will do some googling..... part of me doesn't want to rock the boat, they have offered a fairly generous enhanced redundancy package.... but it does seem rather unfair...

I'm not expecting the outcome to be any different but would like to know how/why I have been picked .... if I have the "right" to see the scores I will push it more but didn't know if it was something HR are obligated to share...

Yep, you absolutely have the right to see it and discuss it. It may be that they have weighted some things heavier than others and that you didn't score as high in those areas.
I had to do it once for part of my team when HO decided to go from 4 people doing the job to 2 and it was really hard- they were all good, just different strengths. We shared all the criteria and gave a lot of feedback- it wasn't that they weren't good, but we had to do the grading and it was a difficult decision.
I'm glad it's a good package on offer and wish you best of luck with whatever you choose to do next.

I just did some Googling and it does seem like they have missed a step....

None of us knew our jobs were at risk.... so as of 8am this morning none of us had had any formal notice of this potential review.... then at 10.30 I get called by my manager and someone from HR to be told they are putting me under consultation.

Also they said only seniors were the ones being reviewed, there are other team members who are not seniors but there is very little difference in what work we do... so should they have been included too....

Arhh so frustrating..... I didn't love my job, but I did it and I did well.. it paid so well and I could work around school runs. Going to be so difficult to find another role like it!

Hey advice from ACAS, they need to follow the correct process.

If people are at different grades, so for example some are seniors and some aren’t, then no they don’t need to be in the same pool and in fact I would say they shouldn’t be.

What I am not clear on is if the six people in the team were all the six seniors or did you include non seniors in that six? If six seniors were in the pool and they have now picked out the two that are at risk, then yes I would agree that they have missed out a step. They should have told all six that they were at risk, explained the next steps / criteria that will be used to assess and then present the outcome.

I would call ACAS for advice. You can then challenge them if they haven't followed legal process by telling them ACAS have advised you rather than Mumsnetters! 😉

Thanks all

@yoshiblue yes I was thinking of giving Acas a call on Monday.

I ask Mumsnet as the company I work for is a huge global company and it's hard to imagine they wouldn't do things in the right order.
They should know the correct order of things where I have no clue what is or isn't correct. Plus acas wasn't open when I posted and the question was on my mind.

I woke up stressing about things this morning, the thought of looking for a new job in a new company is terrifying. I'm rubbish at selling myself and I haven't had to interview for a job in a bloody long time! Let alone prepare a CV and write out applications.

@princesssparklepants oh I wasn’t criticising you, just helping you give more weight to any issue.

To me it sounds like you should all be up for redundancy then assessed either thru interview or defined criteria. Though in reality they often know who they want to go and will massage any process to get what they want.

Ive been through redundancy before and it’s horrible. I’m supporting an amazing friend at the mo who is now unemployed. It will work out, often for the better too.

When you’ve processed things a bit more take a look at this. Helen and Sarah are amazing and they have done a free resource to help:

https://www.amazingif.com/redundancy-reset-2/

Thank you x

Big multinational companies get it wrong too. I was put in a redundancy pool of 1, no-one else was at my level or held my skills, but I was also told they wrote the job description “for me” but expected me to apply for that role (which no-one else had the skills required)

It depends on whether they are following good practice or now. I have been through a few rounds and sometimes there is a fair and transparent process which included a points system, interviews, past performance and things like time off (sickness etc).

The last one was just a witch hunt (big company again so can get away with it) which depended on whether you were a favoured minion of management all done under the guise of a department restructure. As I didn't spend my day under management's desk I went but have moved on to a much better job with a much better company. It is a daunting prospect, I get that, but it can be turned around.

It’s bloody unfair but proof that when it comes to business you are just a number.

I was at risk of redundancy 2 years ago but had to remind my FTSE 250 company about maternity protection during redundancy consultations when they wanted me to interview. Within a day I had written confirmation my job was safe and an apology from the head of HR because I was correct.

look up the procedures and be prepared to debate if you think it’s wrong.

Are you offering you a package?
We had a similar experience in my company recently, it was only some roles that were impacted, and not the whole team was put on a notice. But there was an option of getting a package.

*they offering a package

They have given me figures which is more generous then I thought it would be.

I have no issues with my boss... reviews always satisfactory, never had a reprimand. we were expecting the whole team to be under notice soonish with a view of whoever was picked to be gone next year as part of a big project.
But apparently this has nothing to do with the big project.

They have made me redundant before (long story) and then asked me back a few years later so totally get the just a small cog in a big machine.... but just feels so totally shit and come as a massive surprise. None of the rest of team can believe it!

The last one was just a witch hunt (big company again so can get away with it) which depended on whether you were a favoured minion of management all done under the guise of a department restructure

I went through one of those. We sat in a consultation meeting with a panel of senior management (including the one who managed to get himself made head of HR despite being a manager in finance). I wasn't too bothered because I'd worked out my package and it was a year's salary tax free so skipped happily off into the sunset and took the better part of a year off.

Not long after that head office downsized the whole branch from 200 to about 50 - meaning most of the managers telling us that it hurt them as much as us to have to do this also got the chop. Tee hee.

Good job on the package.
UK laws are quite flexible on getting rid of people, so that's your best bet (unless there is discrimination).